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Comment by vkou | Hacker News Reader

And even then, they can go out and apply for something like an office manager job, which has advancement prospects, that their degree-less peers, who have been working retail for the past 20 years, and will be working retail until the day they die, can't.

I don't judge them for not exercising this option, as I don't know them, everyone's life situation is different, etc, etc. But they at least have that option, should they [choose to/end up in a position to] work towards it.

A degree doesn't magically open doors for you. But in 2020, not having a degree will actively close doors for you.

To put it another way: A seat belt does not guarantee you will survive a serious car crash, but not having one is not going to help your prospects.

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It can close doors on certain life events. Buying a house, being financially stable enough to have kids, living without the burden of a massive debt. I think I'm not against degrees overall, but it's almost predatory these days. I remember my high school counselor filling my head with these ideas of becoming an MD and how much money I could make. Don't recall ever asking if I liked that sort of stuff. I dropped out early and went into IT and have been pretty successful. There are folks where a degree is really just a debt and they'd be better off learning a trade.

> I remember my high school counselor filling my head with these ideas of becoming an MD and how much money I could make. Don't recall ever asking if I liked that sort of stuff.

Not liking your job is the most normal thing in the world. It is incredibly privileged to have a job that you actually like doing.

> There are folks where a degree is really just a debt and they'd be better off learning a trade.

There are large problems with going into a trade, too. It's hard work, your body is destroyed after 15-20 years of it, you are incredibly vulnerable to economic cycles, you don't make much money in most of them, unless you become a business owner. It's better than stocking shelves, but that's a pretty low bar to clear.

To tie back to your earlier point, tradespeople almost universally hate their jobs. Most of them like the money, but hate the job.

Yes, I have an electrical engineering degree, I now work as a software developer, and the last two project managers I worked under had no degree. They are great developers and leaders.

Let's not conflate 4 years of undergrad with a crash course in leadership. Id take someone in the military for 4 years over most college grads with a useless major any day of the week. For one, the degree and failure to apply it shows me that make bad decision or can't execute a plan. The military person shows me they are a leader, can make tough decisions, and are able to keep going when thing get tough.

Hiring is much more nuanced than that. Putting people into categories like "Military Person" and "College Grad" is stupid.

I think we should all appreciate people's life choices, recognize people's hard work no matter how they went about doing that hard work (military, college, self-taught... who cares) and give people equal opportunities.

I've come to find that this is typically how life plays out anyway, most decent companies aren't particularly worried about the minutia of your background and are much more focused on what you know and what you can bring to the table now, and rightfully so.

I like meritocracies. The world should always operate as a meritocracy. It's 2020 for fucks sake lets end the gate-keeping.

Did you just comment to tell me there are more than 2 types of people in this world? TIL.

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