Show HN: Tired of mobile games with IAP and ads, I made No-Bullshit Games

Here is my contribution (a webapp, a.k.a. a website) http://lalo.li/lsd/ coded it years ago mostly drunk on an island in Thailand, I now like to play it again on my iPad with iPencil.

Github: https://github.com/franzenzenhofer/lsd (Warning: a single, dependency less CoffeeScript source file)

Great idea. I really enjoyed Angry Birds when it first came out and when my children asked about to install it on their devices I said this was fine. I couldn't find the original Angry Birds so installed Angry Birds 2. What an awful convoluted mess it was. Instead of a simple, fun physics-based game it's full of lives, spells, bad level design and in-app purchases.

Top idea. Really really nice. I recently loaded up a blank Android phone with dozens and dozens of games, pretty much anything I could find for a 12h flight, only to realize most of them were an absolute horror show of IAPs and requiring internet connectivity for no apparent reason. So after you've grown this list (and it already looks amazing, excellent work!) maybe worthwhile considering to add an additional "works offline" flag, including the first start of the game. That would've been amazing to have. Either way — you've cracked the secret: make something people want (and saves them a lot of time).

Honestly, I wouldn't mind ads if they weren't so obtrusive. a simple ad on a loading screen isn't the end of the world to me. What's annoying is trying to tap a tiny 'x', unskippable video ads, ads that try to fingerprint my device, ads that slow down my machine, ads with volume, time limiting play unless you buy an IAP (when there's no option for just buying unlimited time for a reasonable price)

I want game devs to be able to make a living, but there's a difference between game devs who responsibly put in monetization and game devs just trying to squeeze every last cent through deceit and manipulation.

I echo the others here, Thanks! I have young kids and we let them use tablets on long trips, vacations, airplane rides. Finding games for them is impossible. They are too young to understand when characters, levels, items are locked. It seems like every 2 minutes they get stuck on some ad screen with a hidden X. I just want a game that when I pay $4, I get the full game. It doesn't even have to be a big, intensive game. My kids would be happy with a finger painting game, as long as all the colouring sheets and paint brushes are available.

I would like to build an app that's a series of games, that are all related. I want to use the freemium model, with a one-time payment. No ads, no subscriptions; once you pay, you own the entire game.

What's a better model for this? A single app with a one-time IAP; or two apps, where one is free with no ads or IAPs, but there's a link to a separate paid app with no IAPs?

It seems there's no way to distinguish easily when you're looking at the App Store whether IAP means a reasonable one time purchase for the full game, or a series of predatory IAPs. So having any IAP at all seems to turn off a lot of people. But I'm not sure two separate apps is the best approach either.

I built a site that’s adjacent to this idea (www.darkpattern.games). It catalogs the dark patterns found in mobile games. Premium currency and ads are two of them but there are many more. The idea is that you could educate yourself so the dark patterns have less power over you and also you can browse the site to find good games that don’t have dark patterns.

Haven't had time to look through the list, but this is exactly what I've been looking for. While I don't play mobile games myself, my (older) relatives do a lot, but since something like the 10th time a scam ad almost got my grandmother to lose 300€, I no longer install anything with ads on their devices. It took me almost an hour to find a bullshit-free solitaire game in the Play Store. It took exactly 3 seconds here.

This is awesome, but I'm going to forget it exists, so: please take my email address and feed me notifications about when new games get added. (I might want to be notified immediately, weekly, or every N months.)

Besides that, some minor nitpicks:

- Infinite scrolling would be very nice to have

- The ability to sort the columns by clicking the headers (eg, reviews) might be useful

- I have some, uh, really old devices here that I continue to use. One is on Android 5. There are probably only like 4 people out there that will appreciate seeing a game's minimum Android version, but they'll really appreciate it

- I kind of think surfacing screenshots or description info might be interesting, but that's probably because I'm on 256k slowed internet right now and am loathe to click links (lol) but want to compare/get more info about each game

Also: something interesting is going on with the rating filtering. If I type in "4.8" and select Free under Android, I see 3 items; trying "4.7" gets me a total of 6 4.8-rated items.

This is why I’ve embraced Apple Arcade... it’s inexpensive and no games have in app purchases or ads it’s great

Strong suggestion: define "IAP"

I'm always amazed how many sites like this make wild assumptions about the domain knowledege of all the people that might come across the site. I think "IAP" is "in-app purchases", but just make that clear. And a better statement about what constitutes "bullshit" and whis is the correct definition would help a lot.

Also, why not also include mobile web games like 2048?

I would request you to consider web apps as well. I tried submitting http://arcadejack.com but no luck. Here is what I had entered as comment: "Consider this no-bullshit math game to help kids practice math. Free, no iap, no login. Everything is stored locally."

Edit: Still super early in dev and pin for "grown up" tab is 1222

Thanks for making this, really. Phone games seem to be a sort of gateway drug for video games and it's a shame that most of them are so laden with microtransactions and attention-hacks. Anything that can steer people away from heroin-adjacent mobile games toward games with substance is a great product in my book. Nice job.

Sometimes I hate that I can give only one upvote to a story.

Back when the iPad 1 was new, I was actually playing games on mine. Then everything turned into a mess of IAP bullshit and now I don't even look at mobile game releases any more. Hopefully this site will help me find something to play.

Cool list!

I'll throw in one I made for myself and never really showed to anyone. It's a clone of Unblock Me/Rush Hour, but with no ads and undo+redo support. It's only a website since I don't want to bother with app stores (I just save the page to my home screen).

https://zwegner.github.io/slidey-blocky-thingy/base.html

The puzzle variety isn't great, my generation method sorta sucks. I had started to build an exhaustive generator after reading Michael Fogleman's article[1] on it, but haven't finished.

https://www.michaelfogleman.com/rush/

Any reason why the Genre filter field is a text input rather than a dropdown? I went to look at the Genres available to see which ones I might like but the only way I can see to do this is by scrolling through the pages to look at the available options.

I feel this is a google/apple problem. They need to celebrate and advertise premium games more. Instead, we're stuck in a world where most games are fremium with tons of ads or IAPs, or subscriptions..... It sucks to be a gamer.

I've seen some games that are on both Switch and Android. The Android one has ridiculous IAPs, and Switch is a one-time purchase. I get that it isn't the developer's fault. Premium games don't sell well on Android. But it sucks none the less.

Remember how Angry birds and Cut the Rope used to be good? Now they're a disgrace, full of video ads. And for most of them you cannot pay a single fee to remove.

Would you be open to adding other Genre's of applications in there? iPad has no built in Calculater application and it has been a beyond infuriating experience simply finding a non-bullshit one without any adds or anything.

Thanks! Awesome idea. My son and I have started our own "game studio" for iOS, and I've submitted our first game, Barrel of DNA: https://apps.apple.com/us/app/barrel-of-dna/id1460483070?ls=...

One of our main design principles is to charge a fair price and never do any ads, tracking or IAP's. The idea is to be contrary to the vast swathes of crap that is out there...

Its awesome to see kitten game[0] on here! I had no idea it was released as an app. For stuff like this, I'll buy it even if I never plan to play it on the device, to support the creator for the time I've spent on the free version.

https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.nuclearuni...

I recently changed my relation with video games. I used to play a lot of FIFA (or Football Manager), which are games who are just here to entertain yourself, but there is no backstory at all. Now I see video games as reading a book, or watching a great movie: focus on the story, the art design, the sound design, and the experience in general.

I still play a bit of FIFA, but I reserve it to my social time (even though I find that FIFA create a lot of tensions, while Mario Kart is funnier to play, and the level to be competent is lower).

The problem with most of IAP games are that they are in the same category than FIFA or FM. There is little backstory. While paying upfront for a game (on mobile, a dozen of great games exists, and you can play some of them during short period of time like Limbo...) create a sense of connection with the game, because you invest money in it, and you are ready to really invest time in it. On the opposite, IAP are games where the goal is to make you play as much as possible, to pay as much as possible.

I feel dumb so I don't know if it's a UI thing or just my weird brain, but I loaded this page on my phone, on Firefox and and Chrome, and I incorrectly assumed it was just broken. Where was the list of games?!

Finally I read "choose your platform" and realized it was saying that not for adding games or any other reason, but to see one of the lists! D'oh!

Shameless plug: I also made some games built with TypeScript/Phaser: https://xojoc.pw/games2d/

The code is on GitHub: https://github.com/xojoc/games2d

It's a PWA[1] too, so it can be installed on some OSes. I wrote about the experience here: https://xojoc.pw/blog/experience-pwa

[1]: https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Progressive_web...

I like this a lot.

For a few years now I've wanted something like "No-Bullshit Podcasts" which does the same thing - lists podcasts that are either ad-free or that can be made ad-free via purchase, and that don't require a proprietary player.

Really nice idea! I added a few.

But one that I added didn't make it to the list and I don't know why: Spaceteam https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.sleepingbe...

It has no ads. The IAP it has seems to fit your definition of acceptable: it's only cosmetic and goes to support the developer.

So my suggestion would be this: include another list of rejected games, which some reason why they didn't meet the criteria for the No-BS list.

I really, really like this idea 'StavrosK, so thanks for making this site.

I contributed the iOS version of Seedship: I played it a few weeks ago, and it had no IAP or in-game currency to speak of [0]. I only have an iPhone, so I cannot test the Android version [1]. I strongly suspect that the answer is no given that the two web versions do not have those things [2][3].

This project did give me follow on idea though that others here mentioned and/or alluded to in this this thread: content blockers for the App Store/Play Store. Apple and Google only check for a number of things when reviewing app submissions: malware checks, conformance with local laws, major performance issues, certain security issues etc. What if a user could download content blockers to block apps that they don’t want to see? Apple and Google get to free themselves of having to break ties between content curation and being a censor. Users who want use apps that are vetted by a third-party of their choosing to achieve some purpose would be able to do so e.g. apps for children. I’m not sure exactly what Apple or Google would have to accomplish this, but I think they could some of their organization app policy logic combined with a few other things e.g. forbidding side-loading, or adding additional content-blocker specific app signatures that an app could optionally have. There is a good chance that this would hurt advertising, so there would be the appropriate and proportional pushback. However, I consider that to be an expression of what the market wants.

[0] https://apps.apple.com/us/app/seedship/id1340497640

[1] https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.johnayliff...

[2] https://johnayliff.itch.io/seedship

[3] https://philome.la/johnayliff/seedship/play/index.html

My contribution is a tower defense I've been working on over the last 7 years and that I'm still regularily playing myself: https://mazebert.com/ The graphics are pretty bad (I'm drawing them myself, heh), but there's a lot of depth and content to it.

There are three optional, one-time in app purchases, where you can tip me with a cookie, beer or whisky and get a cosmetic card in return.

Are there more options for a Solitaire game that fit on this list?

My retired father could use something familiar (more like the Windows 95 solitaire, minesweeper, and 'mahjong solitaire' tile matching) games that probably still occupy some floorspace in that grey-matter.

I'd also like some games that might help both younger kids and the elderly by exercising memory matching, pattern deduction, and basic math skills. It wasn't clear how to pick such titles out of the list.

Columns can only be sorted descending.

https://nobsgames.stavros.io/ios/?s=price

Great idea... I don't mind paying for good games, but what i do mind is games that try to squeeze as much money out of you for just playing it, which fits your definition of bullshit games.

So unlockable DLC and removable ads are fine, but endless pay-to-win consumables aren't.

Sorting by number of reviews would be great - it's a better indicator of popularity than the review score

Those are games I might actually try! When I see "in app purchases" in an app description, I don't install the app.

Measuring popularity is potentially an issue here, since:

- Every game’s popularity measure is competing against all other games in stores, which definitely includes all the “bullshit” games (and there are probably way more of those).

- One form of “bullshit” is gaming the review system itself, e.g. finding ways to generate thousands of “reviews”.

- It is very difficult to get users to submit reviews.

I see many games on the list are free with "One-time purchase".

I find these to be pretty annoying, at least on the Android Play Store. The concept is good: free demo, you pay for the full game. The problem is that it hides the actual price of the game.

Maybe an "actual price" field could be added to the site.

Joining the chorus of this being a wonderful idea. Maybe link to Metacritic or other respected reviewers?

Thank you very much for this!

Are my games eligible? I own a game company named Kidoteca, our target market is small kids so we never put ads or IAP.

The closest thing to ads is a section to see our other apps, but it is hidden (requires reading, to figure out how to get to it, while we expect most of our users are kids that can't read).

The table that has the game list in it doesn't work very well on my iPhone. I have to scroll horizontally.

Would a game with ads that can be turned off for free count? Its called Snowpounce and here is a video about its development https://youtu.be/7ZYkCOmF0yc

Disclaimer: the game is not mine

You should set up your own game store with only the listed games on it. Would be great.

I’ve found in most cases putting the phone into airplane mode before loading the game makes them playable.

Sometimes you miss out on hints and whatnot but overall it lets me play the game with my kids without worrying about inappropriate ads.

Good coverage, well done! At least for the iOS games. Few more to add:

Tiny Bang

PDTA (please don't touch anything) <- absolutely awesome btw!

Carcassone

Tokaido

Miracle Merchant

Alchemy 2

Supertype

Ordinary puzzles

Auralux, Auralux 2

Do you have a way to filter duplicates? I just took a look at the iOS list and there are a few games that are on all 3 of the first 3 pages.

I love the idea, and will use this to help find games for our family iPad.

No IAP and no ads? How does a game studio should earn money then? Knowing the fact that business model of games are moving to free to play and than players are now reluctant more than ever to pay a decent price for a game but prefer spend 5x more little by little? Do you intend to reverse the trend? Real question, no trolling.

How a game studio can make money with a F2P game? Or how can we make money from a free 2 play NoBullshit™ game.

Disclaimer: I'm a game developer, I make a MMO F2P mobile game with IAP and ads.

EDIT: I'm not trying to discuss why a F2P with IAP and ads is not always a Bullshit game, you guess that I'm trying to do things well.

This is great! As a parent I try to screen for good apps but I definitely prefer a database.

I’d love to share this with my kids but would prefer a profanity-free site to share...

Huge huge upvote from me. So dead tired of IAP for my 7 year old daughter.. The amount of money wasted on crap in Toca world or similar.. Thank you!

I like the list! I wish it was more usable on my actual mobile, though. There’s lots of inefficient use of space and strange word wrapping.

Good start in any case!

Wow, I was thinking about why its still impossible to find honest games on android! This is just what I need!

I think you should broaden your categorization logic. One app idea I've never had time to start was to make (basically your project) but with also the intent to help filter by specific attributes like:

- offline play

- ads

- ads removable by IAP

- no gambling via IAP

- multiplayer

- 2 player online (1v1)

- 2 player online (co op)

- 2 player same device

- asynchronous multiplayer (like modern play by email, e.g. words with friends)

- not a farmville clone (almost all games trying to catch simcity SEO on android are actually farmville clone shitware).

- no paywalls

- no pay to win

- native of html5

- turn based

- real time

- board game

- 2d

- 3d

The problem is it's really hard to find good games in the android store because every search result is littered with child gambling addiction shitware, or the specific detail isn't isn't indexed at all anywhere.

I love seeing this become a project after seeing the tweet that (maybe?) started it. Good job SK!

Awesome website! Great work, it would be nice to have a sort parameter to sort by score or price.

The ability to sort by rating alone is a gesture Google lacks, that alone makes this a joy.

I made something similar a few years ago although for Android only.

playworthy.io

Man, I miss the days of simple tabled listing, relevant information and scroll.

thanks for this!

A bit of ui advice — you can tell what phone I’m browsing on from user agent screen. You should default to showing me the right games right on the landing page.

Cool!

Sorting by release time would be nice to see new stuff.

Reminds me of Honest Android Games.

Nice job. This is awesome.

Nice idea, thanks!

Clever idea. I'm curious why you decided to allow games with DLC though. That's technically an In-App Purchase. I get it's not a Consumable IAP, but it's still IAP.

Also you can probably add just about any modern (i.e. non-Hasbro) board game conversion to this list. Almost all of them charge a fee up front and won't have anything more than some DLC for their expansions. Like Ticket to Ride, Carcassonne, Through the Ages, etc.

I'm actually working on a mobile game in my spare time right now, and while I normally like to charge money for them I thought I'd try the IAP route this time, but I wasn't planning on making it anywhere near as obnoxious as most IAP games.

Ads you can pay a few bucks to remove, then a couple of consumables that are optional and you can earn during a game anyway if you're lucky, but can buy more if you want (it's a push your luck game, so luck is part of the design), that's about it.

I'm not looking to make all of the money in the world like these big companies are, just hopefully enough to make some side income and maybe eventually switch to making games full time.

I tried playing a Jeopardy game recently, and it just bombards you with screens of crap constantly. Here's a screen where you can pay to add an item for a round! Use your items to help you answer a question slightly easier! Oh you won! Let's update your win streak! (or Oh no! you lost, you're about to go to 0 on your win streak, but if you pay, you can keep it up, and you'll get a reward if you keep it going enough!), then here's some special event that earns you some random nonsense for getting a question right! here's a level up screen! here's a screen that pesters you about something else (I don't know, I lost track after awhile). Just on and on, and in your face. I can't believe people will spend money for these stupid win streaks and whatnot.

So yeah, I'm hoping mine doesn't come across as obnoxious (obviously it wouldn't qualify for the No-Bullshit list, though). And if it doesn't do well, at least it helped me get back in the swing of making mobile games again (it's been like 6 years).

Good luck with your website, it looks nice! If you can add a few extra filters to it, you might have better discoverability than the Apple App Store, which has been too "Winner-Take-All because we refuse to highlight more than a handful of games or give proper filtering options" for forever.