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Comment by danso | Hacker News Reader

Besides the humor of how Lyft's filter flagged traditionally Caucasian names like "Cummings" – in addition to the usual issues with non-Western names, e.g. Pimpong and Poon – I'm fascinated/confused how this made it into production? The user database already exists and was currently being used by the live application. Before deploying this new filter onto the production database, wouldn't you do a dry run to get not only the count of users who will be flagged and notified, but a listing of frequently flagged names? Which you could easily manually eyeball to make sure there weren't obvious false positives?

With a userbase as big as Lyft's, I'm sure there were a ton of obvious true positives (anyone named "Fuck", ostensibly). I just can't believe they didn't notice a surname as relatively common as Cumming/Cummings. Yes, the apparent naivety of the regex is an issue, but this seems like a system for which a lot of testing on actual data would be easy and natural to do as part of the QA process.

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> traditionally Caucasian names like "Cummings"

It always amazes me when US Americans talk in terms of human races like it's the most normal thing in the world. And no, “Cummings“ is not a “Caucasian name“ (whatever that is supposed to mean), it's an English name. I don't want sound too harsh, it's just that as a Central European with all our recent history, things like this really rub me the wrong way.

Caucasian is a funny word to apply to Europeans since its a part of the area around present day Georgia and is a highly diverse ethnic mix of people which most people would classify as Central Asian (like Turks and Armenians for instance). Not exactly what you would think would be "white" which is what many Americans assume it means.

> Not exactly what you would think would be "white" which is what many Americans assume it means.

Because that's exactly how some people teach the definition to mean.[0] I've always been told that to the people in Persia, the people that came across the Caucasus were much more pale skinned. Teachings also say those same people helped populate Europe. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_people

It does mean white/of European origin in American English. Just like entree means main dish. Both don’t correspond to the original meaning of the words. You can find similar shifts in meaning in other languages too (e.g., German calls a mobile/cell phone “Handy” which makes no sense to a native English speaker).

I question the wisdom of telling native speakers that their language uses a word wrong/that doesn’t mean what “they assume it means”. Stuff in AE (and other language) means exactly what AE speakers (and speakers of other languages) assume it means.

Cau·ca·sian /kôˈkāZHən/ NORTH AMERICAN white-skinned; of European origin.

‘Handy’ comes from the WWII ‘handie talkie’, a transceiver small enough to hold in the hand¹, which followed the ‘walkie talkie’, a transceiver small enough to walk around with².

¹ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Portable_radio_SCR536.png

² https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Scr300.png

I find that highly doubtful, since around 50 years passed between WWII and the advent of mobile phones. I heard that "handy" was some early model by Motorola.

And why did Motorola name it the “handy”?

Probably because it was handy.

Meanwhile, at least in the modern US, "walkie talkie" is the name of the handheld unit and "handie talkie" would get weird looks because it's not really known.

Same in Germany when you're talking about radios.

I wonder if "Cauc" would be flagged.

Race is not a uniquely American concept. The Germans were the ones who first came up with the idea of a Caucasian race back in the 18th century. You're not wrong though, we should use White European instead since that's what it means today.

That really doesn't resolve anything, and just further demonstrates the really weird relationship with race and nationality that Americans have.

Namely: Why would it be called "white EUROPEAN" when basically none of the people it is applied to are European in any reasonable sense of the word? They may have great-great-great-grandparents who were European, but that does not make them European.

Americans do this all the time - they call themselves "german", "irish", or "italian", even when they are not born there, do not speak the language, have never even visited the country, and have zero exposure to the culture of that country.

This is a debate about language conventions, I can assure you that 0% of Americans claiming to be European in this sense actually think they live in Europe or are actual Europeans. There are some that speak the language and have exposure to the culture, but that is not what they are saying in this context.

In America, a nation of immigrants, people are often proud of where their family came from. This can trickle down a few generations. There is an increasing number of people that identify as "American" instead of where their family originally immigrated from, particularly in Appalachia and the South, so this could eventually change.

I understand the frustration from a European point of view, but I just wanted to provide some context to the phenomenon.

> have zero exposure to the culture of that country.

Even when that’s true—-and it often isn’t--they usually mean that they’re part of a specific American subculture.

Italian-Americans, for example, traditionally celebrate Christmas Eve with a “Feast of the Seven Fishes.” This dinner isn’t traditional in Italy, but it’s also not common in other American cultures either. An Irish-American family might have a turkey instead but they’re more likely to “observe” St. Patrick’s Day by eating soda bread and corned beef.

Sure, those that have their own culture do exists, but a lot of times, it's not even that.

It's a weird mindset, and it's definitely tied in to the toxic streak of white supremacy that runs through all of American culture.

> The Germans were the ones who first came up with the idea of a Caucasian race back in the 18th century.

Yes, but it has been completely abandoned by the scientific and political mainstream for decades now. Using the word "Caucasian" will definitely give you some strange looks ;-)

> You're not wrong though, we should use White European instead since that's what it means today.

I agree, because it would make it clear what it is really about: lumping people together by their skin color. This is one of those examples where PC speech only helps to hide a problem instead of solving it.

As an American I agree and this was also my reaction to the comment.

There are a number of these things, though. I personally get a little irritated with the way many people here use terms like "Hispanic" to contrast with "white people". To me, "Hispanic" is a wide spectrum of ethnicities but really more of a linguistic, cultural and national/political specifier, with lots of overlap with "white". People who are trying to be correct about this will pull out complicated phrases like "non-hispanic whites" which may be correct but are also clumsy, reflecting the absurdity of the way we categorize this country's social boundaries in the first place. "White" itself has had a fluid definition in the US over time, previously having excluded southern or eastern Europe, Jews, or even the Irish.

I know that in my own recent ancestry I have at least 4 European ethnicities, some of which would have been ridiculed by other Americans in the past. But this nuance washes away and I am a "white guy" which lumps me together with cultures I don't particularly identify with. There is no sense in denying, for example, that I am less discriminated against by appearance than other groups. But I do not think either that there is one homogeneous "white people" living in the United States.

Thanks for you comment! After all, the concept of "ethnicity" is highly debated and numerous definitions exist (just have a look at the wikipedia article). Many European countries don't even ask for "ethnicity" in their census; cultural minorities are often rather defined by their language because this is what practically matters regarding things like school, traffic signs, offices, court, etc.

Therefore I find it pretty odd that in the USA the idea of a uniform European "ethnicity" - largely defined by skin color! - is still very common and even officially practiced. I remember how I had to fill a form when entering the USA which asked for my "ethnicity". I was flabbergasted and just ticked "unknown" or something like that because I didn't want to identify myself as "Caucasian".

Officially practiced doesn't mean ideas are current and common. Government forms tend to be fossilized examples of culture and conventional wisdom from (sometimes many) decades ago. This is not unique to the US.

"To me, "Hispanic" is a wide spectrum of ethnicities but really more of a linguistic, cultural and national/political specifier"

Every form I can remember seeing in the US that asks whether you are Hispanic says that it includes people of any race.

So how do you like this election season?

> Every form I can remember seeing in the US that asks whether you are Hispanic says that it includes people of any race.

Yes, that is the "correct" thing that goes on the form, written by people who have bothered to look into this question. It isn't how people talk in casual speech.

What kind of "casual speech" are you referring to?

The kind you are likely to hear talking to random Americans. A lot of people you are likely to meet, of diverse backgrounds and origins, will talk about it imprecisely, and as if white and hispanic are contrasting terms.

I personally do not. Nor do those forms you are talking about. But it something I hear a lot out in the world.

positives (anyone named "Fuck", ostensibly).

This guy would disagree:

http://mw.eco.br/ig/prof/ReinhardtAdolfoFuck.htm

Along the same lines,

https://www.nie.edu.sg/profile/chew-shit-fun

Yeah, no name filter is going to be perfect for all edge cases. But presumably, it's a lot cheaper to have the Lyft support team handle email tickets from the relatively few Professor Fucks, than to have them also deal with every Cummings and Dick.

Or just not filter names on an app like Lyft. You can't even see other users' names. Who is potentially being harmed by even a malicious Professor Fuck?

Drivers? Cannot imagine it being a big problem people having really offensive names though, after all you are actually meeting the driver irl and expect them to.. well, drive you.

Drivers have to go the in-personal approval thing first though, and they'd present their driver's license that would have their name on it - so the Lyft/Uber/etc employee who approves their driver status would presumably also verify that their name is real.

zulln isn't saying drivers are spoofing their names. zulln is saying drivers are being harmed by riders spoofing their names.

If the drivers are harmed, why not just allow people to use their name regardless of offensiveness and then just display it to drivers as "Professor F*". Sure, it's not ideal but it prevents people arbitrarily being kicked off the system and from drivers being offended by their passengers' names.

Or, perhaps people just shouldn't be offended by names. There are more important things in life.

If your driver’s name was Hitler Did Nothing Wrong Nazis Rule, would you want to drive with them? I think name filtering like this is incredibly dumb and have never seen a good implementation of it. But “don’t be offended” is rarely the blanket answer people seem to think it is.

Don’t know much about Lyft in particular, but with the amount of reports and cancellations you get with a name like that you’d get booted of the platform pretty quickly, no?

It is not the same for drivers though. Drivers have to use their real name as in their driving licence . I doubt that a registered legal name is going to be that kind of offensive.

I'd want to know if that was their name, so I could not get into their car.

If that's the person's name, should they be excluded from those apps? Also: shouldn't they change their names in those extreme cases?

I call those systems "auto-censorship".

They are as dumb and undesirable as incomplete regex email filters in web forms.

Every single one ever written will have this problem. And ironically, absolutely nobody reading a fart joke will ever be offended. But the millions of people who are denied service and not twitter famous enough to reach a dot-com employee are very much offended.

...Also, the single reason to add those auto-censorship features is to please advertisers, not to protect users/drivers from fart jokes.

Expect Advertisement on lyft very, very soon.

> You can't even see other users' names.

You do see their first/given name for identification on pickup.

Not only do drivers see your name, but I believe when you do a Shared Lyft, other riders also see your first name. And customer support will see your name as well.

In general, just because someone is providing a service to you (e.g. driving you, providing customer support, etc) doesn't mean they should be unnecessarily exposed to offensive language.

It’s not “offensive language” if it’s legitimately part of someone’s name (and I don’t mean the obvious bullshit cases, but cases where someone has had the name since birth).

Fucks is Germanic surname. It isn't the most common, but it isn't rare either. Sometimes it is spelt "Fuchs", "Fuks", or "Fux".

Means “Fox”?

"Fuchs" (pronounced fooks) is the German word for "Fox", and the other variants (Fux etc) have the same pronunciation.

The flower Fuchsia is named after someone called Fuchs, and therefore the correct pronunciation is "fook-seeah", not "foo-shah".

And what about Mr. Fucks, the fast food worker with no network to get his issues in front of a Lyft employee? He's probably just unable to use the service.

That guy's so used to services failing him that he doesn't use his real name unless necessary.

…which of course is a valid reason to deny him access from your service, too.

My point was not to defend the blacklisting of expletives. I remember a CS prof giving us dozens of legitimate uses, including people with Scunthorpe domain email not having their mail delivered. My point was that Mr Fucks is not as helpless as he seems and probably spells his name Fuchs when entering his name into a computer because he can't tell which system is poorly designed and which is not.

Until another computer system denies him service for not spelling his name exactly as it is on his ID.

In other words, you are saying he's a non-person. How very nice of you.

That second link actually made me spit out coffee for the first time in my life.

In Austria, we have many people called “Fick“, which literally means “Fuck“.

BTW, isn't it insulting to those people to suggest that their names are insulting?

And, of course, there’s the town of Fucking:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fucking,_Austria

This is all bullshit anyway. A word is just a word and whenever it insults somebody it's their own problem. I would rather change my actual name to Fuck if I wasn't too lazy to deal with problems like that.

I once read a story of a Vietnamese man named Hui. He had to go to the court to protect his right to be named this way in Ukraine where the word is used widely and has only one meaning - a dick.

A word is just a word and whenever it insults somebody it's their own problem.

There was a study linked to on HN a couple of years ago that found that babies recognize swear words even before they have language skills, and that people can sometimes recognize swear words in languages they don't speak. It has to do with the tone and sharpness of the sounds.

Does this mean a baby, whose father's name is Dick would feel bad and/or get mentally traumatized?

> It has to do with the tone and sharpness of the sounds.

Precisely the opposite.

Babies are recognizing the act of swearing at someone rather than the particular word being spoken.

The baby wouldn't experience the father's name as a swear word unless the conversation was for example about the dicks new girlfriend and his wife's assessment of the matter.

Dick vs DIIIIIIICK

This is a nonsensical argument. A word has meaning, which is why it is a word and not a sound.

If I yell insults at you, you are saying that doesn't mean anything? And if you get insulted, it is your own fault?

No, words have meaning based on a common understanding between the person saying the word and the person hearing the word. If I insult you and you understand it, it is me who did the insulting, it is not 'your problem'

You should try this argument out in court: "No, your honor... I can't be guilty of threatening to kill someone.. sure I said, 'I am going to kill you tomorrow at 5pm', but those were just words! If the person felt threatened, that is on them!"

> "And if you get insulted, it is your own fault"

Yes. It's just sounds that you hear, then your brain recognizes and turns them into words with meaning. How you react to the meaning is entirely within your consciousness. This is how you might pick up words from languages you don't know if the sounds are similar, yet you wouldn't claim to be insulted by them.

> "If the person felt threatened, that is on them""

Yes, your feelings are your own, nobody else controls them. That's one of the fundamentals of free speech. There are some very limited situations (like threats) where it's overruled, not because of your feelings but because of the intentions being forecast. Even then, there's a very high bar to prove any criminal intent there.

> How you react to the meaning is entirely within your consciousness.

Considering that it is often very easy to guess how people will “react to the meaning” of the sounds you make, it’s often considered polite to refrain from making them when they would probably offend.

Sure, but politeness is besides the point. It doesn't change the fact that your reaction is still your responsibility.

> If I yell insults at you

In such a case I would just assume you are stupid or something and keep on my business. If you don't have capacity to ignore that kind of noise you probably need treatment. Threats, however, are a different story.

You shouldn't care much if some random people express their opinion which is you're a moron (unless you meet such people often - then it might be a good idea to actually make sure there is nothing wrong with you or you are not hanging out in a wrong place) - ignoring insults usually causes better consequences than reacting to them. At the same time you usually should be worried if somebody threatens to kill you, ignoring threats can often get you in a real trouble.

This is very much the same argument I hear online on why it's ok to use the word, nigger, and even why it is ok to call black people that word. Words have meaning and swear words have meaning and history to their usage.

If you yell insults at me, I will be offended. It doesn't matter if the words you use are "fuck off", "f*k off" or even "would you be so kind as to vacate the premises by the violent application of a large phallic-shaped object on your rear end".

The entire discussion here has been about being offended by a word, even though that word is used in a context which is not offensive at all.

Right, but that is because of a flaw in their attempts to fix the problem of trying to stop people who are setting their names in attempt to insult and offend people.

Some people are trying to insult and offend, so they set their names as offensive and insulting names... in an attempt to stop that, Lyft messed up and blocked non-offensive names that share the same words as the offensive ones.

That doesn't mean words can't be insulting and offensive, it just means context matters and algorithms have trouble with context.

> If I yell insults at you, you are saying that doesn't mean anything? And if you get insulted, it is your own fault?

Yes. You should check out Seneca, and/or Epictetus.

> A word is just a word and whenever it insults somebody it's their own problem.

That's what you think the world should be like, not the way it is. If your name is Adolfhitler Smith, a perfectly legal name in the US, then you will have trouble getting hired.

That's a made up example, but there's evidence[1] that unusual (not necessarily obscene) names will lead to less success in job applications.

If you have a "bad" name, it's your problem well before anyone else's.

[1] https://www.nber.org/digest/sep03/w9873.html

"A word is just a word"

Good luck using the N-word in the US.

Dave Chapelle's Mark Twain prize show on PBS was littered with N and F bombs. Only Fuck was censored.

Not sure if you are aware but Chapelle is black

Does the skin color of the person vibrating the air impart some intrinsic quality to it?

The point of the comment above is that the meaning is informed by the listener, you can import all the traumas and neuroses of those around you or you can listen mindfully and limit the impact to whatever is the speaker's intent and capacity to harm you.

In the historical context, where in the US people with white skin had people with black skin as slaves, yes, it obviously does.

Since a credit card is required to use Lyft, why not just validate the name on the card with the card company and make it the issuer's problem?

A credit card is not required to use Lyft. You can use credit from gift cards or promo codes, as well as 1 time payment methods like Apple Pay which are completed at time of ride booking and do not expose names

To use Lyft, or to sign up? Using alternate payment methods makes sense once you sign up. I do it, too. But can you start a new account without a credit card?

Are you sure about that? I don't have Lyft where I live. But, about a year back, I was given a Lyft code for an interview. When I got the code, the instructions made it clear that I needed to register a credit card for liability. I had my account created with my personal credit card and redeemed the code. I thought I was good to go. When I got to the destination city and tried to order a ride at the airport, it said I needed to enter a SECOND credit card for verification. Unfortunately I traveled light and didn't a second card on me.

I just tried to create a driver's account on Lyft's website. There's an initial page where you give them your name. And then, deeper into the process, a form for supplying your name as it officially appears on your driver's license.

Which makes sense. There's likely a lot of drivers who want to go by "Tom" instead of "Thomas" or whatever their full official name is – which is even more important for drivers with very uncommon names who want to go by something more familiar/pronounceable. There's probably a decent safety argument for not requiring drivers to have their full real names be accessible to the user, especially in cases where a driver has an uncommon (i.e. easy to doxx) name.

I hear the argument but taxi drivers were always required to show their real name, so the same should apply to Lyft drivers.

The privacy of the driver is outweighed by the need for the public to feel they will safely be taken to their destination in an enclosed vehicle totally controlled by another party.

> I hear the argument but taxi drivers were always required to show their real name, so the same should apply to Lyft drivers.

You can definitely argue that they should show their real name, but it is not a good argument that because taxi requires it, lyft should as well.

I'm not sure what the official rule is for NYC's taxis when it comes to the name display; fwiw you can see the official list of medallion license numbers and associated names here:

https://data.cityofnewyork.us/Transportation/Medallion-Drive...

In any case, rules are different for different jurisdictions and entities. If NYC TLC did have that requirement, then it's possible that real name display is mandatory for Lyft drivers operating in NYC, given that TLC has some oversight over services like Lyft. However, TLC also has some say over livery cabs. It's been awhile since I've been in a livery cab, but I think they do operate under different requirements in terms of what's required for display.

None of the major card networks except for American Express validate cardholder name. The Address Verification Service (AVS) also only validates numeric values (so if your address is 123 Main Street, 123 Maple Ave will return a matching response)

Was always wondering about that, only occasionally misspelling a letter here or there to see if a transaction would get approved. Can anyone corroborate?

The crazy shit that happens when an address is entirely correct would make me hesitate before adding errors intentionally.

Having worked around payments, I can guarantee you that card networks do check the Card Holder name. Better yet, they can match against first name, last name and middle name to adjust the risk rating of individual transactions.

Albeit, this is rarely used to block payments, because if they stopped payments when customers didn't put their middle name the exact way it's written on their card, nobody would be able to pay online.

I'm not so sure. I have a credit card under a completely different name (by accident).

I think the claim is that credit card processors don't validate names at payment time. Back before KYC became a thing you could sign up for a credit card with whatever name you preferred. I think it's a bit more strict these days.

Ah, well it was only a few years ago.

There is no error code that denotes invalid name. Sure the banks gateway fraud detection can decline auth(most don’t), but there would be no way to communicate back to the merchant that the customers needs to check the spelling of the name. I’ve also never seen it when I ran technology at a e-commerce startup that did millions of transactions of month.

It’s up to the merchant to decide. You can ask for as little as card number and expiry. All up to the merchant based on how they configure their payment processor

That feature is a configurable option (at wildly variable strengths) that is set up by the merchant when they are setting up their payment gateway. All the CC processors I have worked with provide these varying levels of Name/Address strictness.

You can't validate the name on a credit card. There is no error code that indicates an invalid name.

Why even try to catch “naughty” names. Why do I even need to give Lyft a name in the first place? It just seems like such a made-up problem.

I think you and the driver are supposed to exchange names. This is probably awkward when you name yourself "suck my balls" or something, which people undoubtedly do because people are terrible.

The Simpsons figured this out decades ago: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M1EjcWU6sEk

> I think you and the driver are supposed to exchange names.

What for?

And how does any other environment where people introduce themselves to each other fix this? I don't think they see it as a problem in practice.

For safety, mostly - there have been bad situations when people mistook a car for their uber, including at least one kidnapping & murder: https://www.nytimes.com/2019/03/30/us/samantha-josephson-usc...

One of my co-workers once got in the wrong Uber; she and another person with the same name were being picked up on the same corner, and the cars just happened to arrive close enough they each got into the wrong car. It was confirming the driver's name as they sat down that clued them in.

The Simpsons gag however would bypass the naughty word filter completely. The name Bart uses is "Mike" last name "Rotch" Moe just ends up pronouncing it as "My Crotch".

>people are terrible

There are many terrible things in the world. People naming themselves Mike Rotch isn't one of them. Certainly not as "terrible" as denying hundreds of thousands of people a service.

No, you and the driver are supposed to exchange a keyword to make sure you got into the right car. That keyword happens to be a name by default because it's very... human, I guess, but it does not have to be your name. For taxis, I frequently use two or three random names common in my country.

> No, you and the driver are supposed to exchange a keyword to make sure you got into the right car.

I've never heard of this. Where did you learn this? I'm not saying you're wrong either, as it makes sense. I've just never heard of it.

OK, not _supposed_, but it is a common practice, going back to traditional taxi services where you'd call a number and order a taxi to an address where you are. They'd ask you for your name which they'd also tell the driver they send you. On arrival, the driver would then ask the name when you're entering the car.

It's useful for busier locations, where more people would call for a taxi at the same time.

I’m guessing test and prod are highly-segregated to prevent improper data access. Remember when one of the app-based taxi companies had employees who spied on their exes via their system? I’m guessing they beefed up security to mitigate the insider threat risk.

Regardless, your point still stands. The product manager should have gone through whatever process was needed to pull down a limited set of production data to test against. Or the engineers could have logged exceptions in prod before making the filter active.

That end of year rush to finish projects in order to get them on your yearly review... :rolls eyes: Lots of corner cutting happens in december.

What's the upside of deploying this anyway? It's not as though it's similar to Facebook where these names are very publicly visible. It's just the drivers who would see the names.

They could just generate the list of questionable names and get support to give them a call about it or institute a rider identity verification programme.

Wouldn’t be surprised if this was a 20% project by an employee group of some sorts.

The intentions can be noble, such as a Lyft employee seeing an user named “F* N*” and thinking, hey that shouldn’t be okay.

The actual consequences can be meh.

I had a friend named Hung Wang who was pissed Microsoft wouldn't let him make that his gamertag.

"I'm so sorry my name is offensive!"

I have a friend named Aryan who was not allowed to sign up for a Microsoft account with that name. Support even refused to make the exception when asked, suggesting that he sign up with the name "Ryan" instead.

To this day, emails from that account have "Ryan <lastname>" in the header.

How do people find that offensive?

It is probably best known as part of nazi ideology: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan

This is no the only use, of course, but that doesn't matter. Good luck being a Hindu and displaying a swastika.

Or being ethnically Aryan :/

> Scholars point out that, even in ancient times, the idea of being an "Aryan" was religious, cultural and linguistic, not racial. — https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aryan

Right, it's an ethnic concept: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indo-Aryan_peoples

> Which you could easily manually eyeball to make sure there weren't obvious false positives?

Implying devs test their code thoroughly. lol. After working at numerous companies (some with high bars of entry) I've noticed many devs push changes without testing properly. Or, if they test, they rarely consider edge cases or implications of what they're doing and only test the obvious base cases.

In my team we called it the "Scunthorpe problem". Scunthorpe is a town in northern England.

Tom Scott did a video on exactly that problem: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CcZdwX4noCE

Oh gosh, I grew up on The New Bob Cummings Show.

He had his own flying car, in 1961!

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_New_Bob_Cummings_Show

As far as I can tell, the name "Cummings" is Gaelic, not Caucasian.

http://www.comins.org/cummingsname.htm

Or just let people use any name they want.

https://deadspin.com/life-aint-easy-for-a-basketball-player-...

> anyone named "Fuck", ostensibly

How very dare you. I'll have you know I come from a long line of Fuckers.

As someone already pointed out here, Fuck is a real last name. Fucker is also a real last name. You need a credit card to pay for Lyft; I don't quite follow why they can't just match people up with their credit card data.

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