Ask HN: What benefits of quitting alcohol consumption? | Hacker News Reader

Ask HN: What benefits of quitting alcohol consumption?

23 pointsthrow5131954 comments

I've decided to do a "dry" January and if I can do it, will try to extent to all of 2020.

I didn't drink often, not more than once a week. But it was usually a binge episode, having at least 10 drinks.

Has anybody stopped? What were the benefits? I am thinking that the reduction of stress on the body might lead to clearer thinking during work, etc.

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Another angle: ego.

Never drank in my life till 25 due to growing up in India and luckily finding myself among folks who didn't drink most of the time. I then had a chance to decide without baggage and never drink in my life.

The voluntary reasons are several, but the primary is the fact that I respect my authority over my mind too much. Even if you're slightly drunk, you're legally not allowed to drive. Neither are you considered "able" to give consent for things. Suggests to me (rightly?) That we momentarily don't consider people who are drunk as human, but as some mentally challenged being that is incapable of good reason. I personally feel like voluntarily becoming a mentally challenged person just to get a buzz is just too demeaning, so it encourages me to stay dry.

Why completely dry? It's always easiest to draw the line where it's absolutely clear, and with "addictive" things like drinking it's easiest to draw it at 0.

Yeah I agree with the completely dry. My parents are always like "just have a few!". Which I can do at family events, etc. But at a big party, it is tougher and sometimes impossible to just have 2-3.

>I didn't drink often, not more than once a week. But it was usually a binge episode, having at least 10 drinks.

Just fyi, i think most people would consider having 10 drinks in a single session, once a week, to be "often"

I live in NYC so maybe it is more excessive. But usually if you start at 9:30pm and end at 3am... that's 2 an hour. Not unrealistic. Honestly it's usually even more for me.

So far as binge drinking:

I used to go to parties, drink too much, and then act like a jerk.

My brother-in-law kicked me out of his house. After I stopped binge drinking and atoned I get along better with my brother-in-law, which is a real benefit.

Otherwise:

The worst immediate consequence of overdrinking is that you feel worse the next day. Alcohol can mess up your sleep and also feed into the metabolic disorder behind insulin resistance and Type II diabetes.

I don't think you will notice a difference between 2 beers a night and no alcohol at all, but if you drink more than that you probably will perform worse the next day.

Nice. That is pretty much the same reason I am stopping. Did you notice any other benefits on a large or small scale?

> I used to go to parties, drink too much, and then act like a jerk

Alcohol doesn't make people worse, it just make more evident what they really are.

Alcohol is known by medical science to be

- neurotoxic.

- carcinogenic.

If that's not persuasive, I don't know what else could be.

So are wasted fumes coming from your car, without the benefits

The same can be said for barbeques

When will people stop pretending that changing one thing doesn't really change anything in life in general?

Drinking is like everything else: if you do it with moderation it is not that harmful

If you don't, you got bigger problems

If you're implying that I am overestimating risk by comparing it to barbecued meat and exposure to vehicle exhaust then I would say that maybe you're underestimating risk from those two things.

I personally avoid barbecued meat for that exact reason, as well as refrain as much as possible from huffing exhaust fumes. If a lifestyle that allowed me to avoid being near cars were reasonably easy to achieve I would choose it. Because as you say, car exhaust is neurotoxic and carcinogenic.

I work in healthcare in Italy, where we live more than anyone else in the World, on average, except for the Japanese.

You are overestimating the causality between consumption and actual damages.

Consumption is ok, abuse is not.

Even too many showers can kill your skin

Of course if you have a condition even a simple contact can be deadly (think about favism)

And of course people are free to not drink, there's no shame in that, but don't think that it will give you more chances to have a long life than someone who drinks moderately

It's like smoking, it is bad, you shouldn't do it, but truth is that smoking a couple cigarettes a day is like not smoking at all

Paracelso said, many centuries ago, that it's t he dose that makes the poison and it's still true.

> Drinking is like everything else: if you do it with moderation it is not that harmful

No it's not.

https://www.npr.org/2018/08/24/641618937/no-amount-of-alcoho...

Do you know the difference between "completely safe" and "not that harmful"?

Not even walking on the streets is completely safe

Unintentional injuries is te the leading cause of death in US for people aged between 1 and 44 years.

They kill 170 thousands people on average, while alcohol related deaths are 88 thousands (including car accidents)

The first cause of death in US is heart disease, I bet you still eat bacon though...

Alcohol abuse is dangerous, alcohol per se is as dangerous as driving your car (probably less, there are over 2.2 milion people injured every year by crashes)

It looks like you are citing the CDC (https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/dvs/LCWK1_2015.pdf) study. They define poisoning (including by alcohol) as an unintentional injury. So that 88 thousand is included in the 170 thousand that you are comparing it to.

Let's talk real numbers.

Alcohol kills directly through alcohol poisoning 2 thousands people / year in the US

It's around 6 people a day

In US about 19.5 thousands people/year die for accidental poisoning

It means than for every death caused by alcohol poisoning there are almost 10 caused by other substances

If that wasn't enough, in 2017 in US 70 thousands people have died for drug overdose, of which 50 thousands were caused by opioids, of which 50% (25 thousands) were prescription drugs

2017 saw a rise in drug overdose cases of 10% compared to the year before

So how we end up with the 88 thousands deaths for alcohol related problems?

Because we count them as related, for example if there's car crash and in one of the victims blood stream a BAC of 0.08 g/dL or greater is found, it is considered alcohol related

Nobody count it as drug related or poison related if drugs or other poisons are found in the blood stream

Nobody even look for them usually, unless it's a violent crime

Half of the liver disease are counted as alcohol related, the stats says "involved alcohol" they don't say they were caused by alcohol, but even if they were (which is entirely possible, alcohol is toxic for liver) nobody count drug related liver diseases or poison related ones, even though drugs and poisons are toxic for the liver

Official stats count alcohol related deaths as "alcohol misuse" not consumption, while prescribed medical drugs consumption is responsible for half of the deaths for opioid overdose, and there are 12 of them for every death due to alcohol poisoning

I think I made the point

I think US has an addiction problem and their policies "all or nothing" don't work

People, especially young people, binge drink because they don't develop over the years a mature, responsible interaction with substances

It's either you drink to death or you show your "alcohol free" coin to the world (which is another addiction BTW)

Recently two young Americans have killed a cop in Rome while on holiday, after abusing of alcohol and cocaine

That part of Rome, Trastevere, is a well known spot to find American students that literally trash themselves drinking, because they are not used to being free to drink in their country

It's a social problem and I think won't be addressed anytime soon, because it cannot be cured with a pill, it requires public investment in education and psychological support and sadly it's not something US is good at

Last but not least, the national institute on alcohol abuse and alcoholism (nih) reports that "More than 10 percent of U.S. children live with a parent with alcohol problems, according to a 2012 study."

https://www.samhsa.gov/data/sites/default/files/Spot061Child...

Alcohol problems means heavy drinker

Heavy drinker means binge drinking 5 or more days in the past month, according to the official definition

It means that one kids in ten has at least one parent who is an addict.

Alcohol is just the cheapest and easier to find of the drugs, that's why it's so common in the US to count alcohol related deaths and not drug related ones, because US would have to admit to have a serious addiction problem and to be doing nothing about it

Better blame the usual suspect

I don't think you're making the case for the safety of consuming alcohol. One could argue you were actually making the opposite case.

I'm not making a case for the safety of consuming alcohol, I'm just saying that alcohol is a broad and complex phenomenon, we as human have been drinking it for thousands of years, it is engrained in many cultures, it requires a more in depth analysis that "it gives you cancer"

Note that the original poster states that they are drinking in binge episodes of up to 10 drinks. That is certainly not moderation.

A few recent links for your consideration... http://cancerherald.com/alcohol-itself-causes-cell-damage-an...

https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/07/190708084334.h...

https://neurosciencenews.com/age-alcohol-consumption-10835/?...

Thanks for the info! I think the 2nd link doesn't work.

Google search suggests the title of that page began with "Quitting alcohol may improve mental well-being, health ...", which leads to pages like [1] with the same title from around the same date.

[1]: https://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2019-07/ji-qam070319...

Just for a counter opinion: I only drink on the weekends in social situations, but have gone 2-3 months without as an experiment.

I didn't notice any difference other than it completely resets your tolerance. After the break it only takes one beer to feel buzzed, whereas before it was 2-3. In a big city, I'd recommend trying it once regardless of the benefits because it is challenging from a social POV. A surprising number of events center around alcohol, and people think it is strange that you're not drinking.

If people think it is strange you are not drinking you can mitigate this in a few ways:

1) Order a club soda with ice and a lime in the same glass they are serving something like Vodka soda.

2) Tell them you have an early meeting

3) Tell them you have emails to follow up on after the event.

4) Get better friends (better being not a moral judgement, but better for your needs)

Some people like to socialize over drinks, others don't really like it and some only want to do that on special occasions or rarely. Its like anything else. E.g. some people obsess over board games, some people like board games now and then, and some people really hate board games. If your friend group is based mostly around board games and you dont want to play board games anymore, in the long term, its probably best to find some non-board game obsessed friends. Same goes for drinking.

I was thinking more in business situations. If your friends have a problem with it that's another story.

> After the break it only takes one beer to feel buzzed

Not sure if this was your experience, but at the same time hangovers get _enormously_ more painful!

I thought that was just because I was getting older.

(A couple of people 5 years older than me say the same thing.)

That's why you only drink one!

You will save a ton of time, money, energy and productivity that you currently waste in going drinking and recovering from drinking.

I mostly stopped, not particularly by trying, but just by sort of growing out of the lifestyle and almost like, "forgetting" to drink, after a while. I'm big on the forgetting thing. When I failed to quit smoking dozens of times, it was by paying close attention to what day/time I was going to stop, how long it had been since then, etc. In other words, thinking a lot about smoking. The time when I finally succeeded, was the time when I just sort of forgot to smoke. Although note that there was undoubtedly an "infrastructure of forgetting" in place, without which it wouldn't have been possible to forget. For example the band I was in (with two smokers) broke up, so I stopped being reminded so often of smoking. So set yourself up for success by going through and trying to get rid of things that remind you of drinking. And don't make a big deal of it or count the days. Certainly "Only 5 days left until I can drink again" is a sign of failure, but in my opinion so is "Alcohol-free for 12 days! ... 13 days! ... 14 days!" Makes me thirsty just typing it! The biggest indicator of success in my book would be that the thought doesn't enter your head, and you're not paying any attention to it. Fill the extra time that you save, especially at first, with new or neglected activities that are more interesting & pleasant, yet not too demanding, so that you have better things to do and experience and think about.

So true about "forgetting". I've also come to the same conclusion, in my experiences with other substances. If I simply forgot about it being something that I would do, it just seemed a lot easier.

For instance, a nic vape, I would just put it in a drawer after the last coil finished... and within a day I forgot about taking hits in the morning or while on the computer.

* All the cliche health benefits and then some! Car analogy: you'll fire up the other 2 cylinders while no longer needing to tow a caravan. Combine with exercise and better diet which will be easier to stick to due to no drugs to sap your will power.

* Ability to drive places. Not worry about being "DUI" the same or next day.

* You'll exercise your ability to say no! In the UK for example it is sacrilegious to not drink unless you have a good excuse, which apart from religion (along with appropriate ethnicity to make that believable) there seems to be no acceptable excuse. So you can say "fuck you, I'm not drinking that shitty poison" and be an outcast for a while, then find people worth hanging out with.

Australia is not as bad because of the sport culture. "My personal trainer said no" is acceptable and most places I have work have had a mild to zero drink culture.

Not sure about the US, but I get the impression that like Australia and unlike UK, Russia, etc. it more acceptable to not drink.

> Australia is not as bad because of the sport culture. "My personal trainer said no" is acceptable and most places I have work have had a mild to zero drink culture.

That's a pretty specific edge case.

If you're sitting at the pub with friends or work colleagues and you're the only one not drinking, you can expect some irritating comments.

I've learned to deal with it. I've figured out the main reason people push a drink on you is to justify their bad choices (e.g if you're at the pub with Bob and he's sinking 12 pints tonight, he doesn't want a reminder that he's killing his body and will have a terrible hangover in a few hours).

When I tried to stop drinking in college, I used to fill empty beer bottles with water to drink at parties. This helped a lot with social pressure. I reckon one could do the same in a pub if the bartender is understanding and discrete, but I never tried it.

Nowadays just get some Topo Chico (carbonated water) or you can drink the Heineken Zero.

> Not sure about the US, but I get the impression that like Australia and unlike UK, Russia, etc. it more acceptable to not drink.

Very acceptable in the US, members of multiple prominent religious groups in the US don't drink.

I did it for year. Two big benefits: first, you are loosing weight (I lost ~10 pounds) and second, craving has gone. It was seriously concerning me and a big motivator to quit.

I did not find much difference in how I feel, but at least this disgusting feeling in your mouth in the morning has gone too.

Binge drinking is not synonymous with alcoholism, but comes with many downsides nevertheless. The benefit to stopping binge drinking is to avoid the associated risks of binge drinking (including risks to health). Avoiding binge drinking could certainly improve work performance. However, just trying to avoid binge drinking may be difficult. I would consult a health professional who specializes in addiction.

https://americanaddictioncenters.org/alcoholism-treatment/bi...

Lifestyle judgments aside, you'll certainly save a lot of money in the long term.

Good luck! I'm trying to rein in my affinity for craft beer (I love the beer but hate the empty calories that come with it).

>I've decided to do a "dry" January and if I can do it, will try to extent to all of 2020.

There's no "can" about it, you'll do it, and you'll enjoy it. Whether it has to be a whole 2020 thing is up to you.

Personally I do dry months during the comparatively quieter social periods at the start and near-end of the year (leading up to Christmas), and I find that I both enjoy the months where I allow myself to drink and those that I remain dry all the more because of it. YMMV.

I reached six months alcohol free in January. I didn't have a problem but once I turned 23 I found my body just seemed to no longer tolerate alcohol and decided just to try not drinking for a while.

To be honest, my life hasn't really changed as a result (socially), but I definitely feel healthier, have a clearer head and my skin has never been better.

Friends from college that kept drinking 4-5 times a week (2-7 drinks per outing), especially women, appear to have aged years more than me.

> Friends from college that kept drinking 4-5 times a week (2-7 drinks per outing), especially women, appear to have aged years more than me.

I have observed this too. Not sure why but this and also smoking seems to hit women's age appearance a lot more than men's.

It's really kind of uncanny. I think the root of it is alcohol dries out your skin and causes lots of mid-level inflammation. Smoking is just all around bad for your body (I didn't realize it causes your body to heal about half as fast - although I've never smoked), granted your face is always inches away from a source of smoke.

How long until you noticed the clearer head and the better skin? I wonder if it takes a certain amount of time (1 month, or 3-5-6 months)?

I had really bad skin in high-school and college. Unfortunately, my parents had me take antibiotics for years instead of just going through with a treatment of Acutaine. To be frank, I'm stunned that I don't have more severe acne scarring, fortunately my minor scarring is covered entirely by my beard.

In my last two years of college or so my skin started to improve but was still incredibly dry and I continued to have dark circles under my eyes (which I've pretty much had permanently since childhood).

I stopped drinking as often for about a year prior to completely stopping drinking, so I'm not sure how useful my experience will be to you, however I'd say about 4 months in I really started to notice how vibrant my skin was. Zits would clear within 1-3 days and my skin seemed to need less moisturizer and have a healthy "oily" texture.

As someone who used to really enjoy drinking, I have no clue how or why people keep up drinking habits just to bend to social "norms".

here is a testimony that motivated me to try and stop like you are : https://thinkfaster.co/2019/02/quitting-alcohol/

Take the problem at the source and ask yourself why do you need to get wasted?

Yeah true. I thought about this a lot and I think it is an expression of some inner nihilism and a self-destructive habit. By trying to focus on something creative and doing a good job, I can put the nihilism at bay and thus my desire to self-destruct through drinking is reduced.

Not sure how much science there is, but I suspect that a lot of drinking turns out to be self-medication for depression (and/or anxiety). If so, it's obviously not ideal, but it may be that in some cases there is no clear superior alternative.

https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Why_Do_Men_Stupefy_Themselves...

I wonder why some folks seem to only go on these huge drinking sprees. Why do few people seem to discuss simply drinking 0-2 drinks daily? Ie using moderation like an adult.

I don't go on huge drinking "sprees", but I feel like this comment applies to me.

I don't drink during the week as I reserve it for social occasions, even though I really enjoy certain drinks (wines, cocktails and liquours). I also eat healthily during the week and try to look after myself physically and mentally.

I'm pretty actively social, between family and friends, and we get together pretty often. That manifests itself usually with a dinner, with a drink or two proceeding it depending on the time available, drinks over a nice slow dinner, maybe a digestif and then either relaxing with a couple bottles of wine and good conversation at one of our houses/apartments or maybe move on to go listen to some music, go dancing, etc.

All-in-all, over the course of a typical 5:30pm to 2am gathering, that can equate to quite a few units of alcohol (at one unit per hour you'd be looking at 8.5 units, and it doesn't take an hour to finish a cocktail or glass of wine) and the majority of the time it's not people getting wasted, it's simply enjoying themselves with a variety of alcoholic beverages they enjoy.

I, and I'm sure many others, enjoy this approach while also enjoying not drinking on a day-to-day, "more moderate" approach.

Probably because they (me too) are viewing it as an experience in itself or as a momentary escape. When you have 2-3, it's just an enhancement of whatever you are doing. When you have 10, it's an experience in and of itself. You are drunk and "going crazy". Maybe also, some people were condition in college to "go hard" and that's what they associate alcohol with deep down.

I don't drink at all anymore, but I also never liked the taste. I used to drink socially (maybe a beer or two or three, once a week), but I found better friends, so I don't need to do that anymore. It's been like 5 years.

> What were the benefits?

The benefits are that I look younger and I'm definitely smarter and sharper than people that binge once a week at my age. Alcohol dehydrates you (which makes you look older) but it also destroys your brain, especially in binges.

The downsides are some people try to peer pressure you or try to make you feel bad for not drinking in social situations.

My $0.02 are - if you can't do a dry January, for whatever reason, then you probably have a drinking problem and need help.

I don't drink and I really wish it were true, but just drinking (unless you're alcoholic) by itself doesn't make you "dumber". You probably are anecdotally associating idiots around you (who tend to drink like the morons they are) with causation.

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