An Open Letter To PC Makers: Ditch Bloatware, Now
hothardware.com
hothardware.com
Not only do the PC makers make money from bloatware; the vendors (BestBuy in particular) also makes money from offering to remove the bloatware when you buy a PC (laptop). I was at BB and the salesguy offered a deal ($30?) to "optimize" the laptop after purchase, and remove the bloatware.
To paraphrase a saying, "if a man's paycheck depends on him not understanding something, you can bet he won't understand it".
We seem to be transitioning away from PC manufacturers being in the selling a PC business and are towards being in the software distribution business.
If you want anything more than that (good position in a row that doesn't have a homeless camp in it, a featured position in the store's ad, and so on) you pay for this.
This is one of the reasons Windows 95 totally killed OS/2, even though on every technical level (including the ability to run Windows programs) OS/2 should have won. Microsoft paid for ads. Microsoft paid for end caps with Windows 95. Microsoft chipped in to help software developers who wrote for Windows 95 afford store ads and end caps.
IBM was content to just shove OS/2 into the store, let it sit on the bottom shelf in the back where even someone who went to the store with the express purpose of buying OS/2 would have a hard time finding it. That and IBM's complete disdain for developers is what killed OS/2.
The mail order computer catalog businesses also work this way. When you read the entries for a given product in catalogs from different sellers, they are often nearly identical. That's because the item entries are not written by the catalog company. They are ad copy written by the product's vendor. When a product gets a quarter, half, or full page in a catalog it isn't because the catalog company thought it was great and wants to push it. It's because they thought the big fat check from the vendor to their ad sales department was great.
Sure I can root it but why should I have to void a warranty to remove this crap? The wireless industry in this country is a joke. I'll take my free McAfee trial, thanks. At least the OEM and software vendor have a measure of respect for the end user.
"consumers do not want bloatware"
This is wrong. Consumers don't care. 90% of people who buy PCs from the major manufacturers probably don't even know what it is. (Some even think it's a good thing when it's advertised as "Comes with free 2 month subscription to X Security Centre")
Hackers/Programmers etc don't want bloatware, but we are a minority. Personally I usually build my own PCs. On the odd occasions when I buy them pre-built (or when I buy laptops) I format and reinstall the OS when it arrives and in these cases I am quite happy that the cost of the hardware has been subsidised quite nicely by something that only requires me to quickly reinstall to resolve.
I regularly get requests for advice on PC buying and from non-techies the question normally goes "Where can I get a cheap [PC/Laptop] that will let me use [internet/facebook/email]". As soon as I hear "cheap" I just direct them to a the current big PC supplier. They don't care if it takes 45 seconds to load the desktop, they just want to 'friend' people and tag photos.
In the end seeing as it was running Vista Basic I took the ultimate step of removing the OS as well and putting on Ubuntu, which she was much happier with :)
I have never heard a non-techie complain about a new computer being slow despite it being loaded with bloatware.
(The whole question of windows needing occasional reinstalling is another issue)
Consumers care, they just delegate this particular task to others.
So please PC manufacturers, save my life because I can't take it anymore.
They don't care if it takes 45 seconds to load the desktop
I don't know who came up with that "45 seconds" figure, but it's totally bullshit.
I reboot my Mac about 3-4 times a year
2) I have an MSDN subscription which covers OSes and MS dev tools when I need to do work in C#.
Yeah, I know it's not something most people have access to, but it works for me.
Though I remembered that my MacBook came with a pack of games and OmniOutliner, and my wife's with Quicken.
Sure, it's not really bloatware and more like freebies, but it's good to remember that Macs don't come perfectly clean either and that Apple gets paid a little too.
I've purchased probably close to a dozen various Apple machines (MacMini's, MacBookPro 17, MacBook, MacBookPro 15, MacBook Air) in the last ~4 years and have never had anything come on them besides OS X, iLife, iWork (which I don't consider bloatware, plus they're easy to remove if you want).
I imagine the iWork you mention was the trial version of it, right? Not bloatware to me either since you're not bothered to upgrade like you might be with pop-ups for anti-viruses on a Windows PC.
I also forgot, FWIW, I bought an iMac for the kitchen/wife's home computer, and that didn't come with any crapware either.
Anybody care to chime in with some citations supporting/refuting this?
I found: http://gigaom.com/apple/mac-lands-one-two-punch-against-pcs-...
But it's a little confusing. It says Apple's unit share is between 4% and 5%, but what they call its profit share is its share of revenues, which depending on how you count seems to be 20%-25%. Given that Apple's profit margins are higher than PC manufacturers, Apple's share of the profits has to be higher than its share of revenues.
This is actually astounding, it's the opposite of what you might naively assume: In most markets, you would expect the revenue leader to be the one with the lowest prices and thinnest margins who tries to "make it up on volume."
Apple has either slightly more or approximately the same revenues as Dell and HP, while selling half as many computers at (obviously) higher prices and higher margins.
Is that your metric for "winning?"
You asked other people what they mean by winning. If you want to have a productive conversation, I suggest you ensure that your definition of winning matches theirs. Otherwise, there will only be confusion.
If in the end the one who adds bloatwares makes more money, I have to give it to them, right?
Maybe I am understanding it all wrong.
I also disagree with the logic a bit. Where's the tipping point? At what percentage market share does it become difficult to gain more?
Just a suggestion, but if you try to flesh out your queries a bit more you may find them more likely to be answered. Not your fault, but when every other poster is being ironic/sarcastic/sardonic, you have to take the extra step to make sure you're not mistaken for one of them :)
For a new install, it's pretty easy: Rip consumer apps out of dock, delete apps you'll never use, load in MacPorts, compile a bunch of stuff, runs some installer packages, set up your shell environment, tweak preferences in various apps. Done. Usually it's 2-3 hours tops and you're ready for anything.
Merely a difference in philosophy; I can't be satisfied that any one default configuration will meet all my needs. That's all.
Hell I might spend hours themeing the visuals, that doesn't mean it's difficult or a failing of the OS.
Is it because they're all running the same OS and making better hardware doesn't offer enough differentiation?
Some even try to compete on product design (HP Envy?), but they fail to match up to the attention to detail that Apple is known for. My guess is that they have outsourced most of the process to their suppliers, which means that they have less of an influence on the design details. Apple spends a huge amount to keep an in-house design team that not only does the superficial design, but also the layout of components, figuring out which materials to use and how to use them, etc. From the film Objectified: http://vimeo.com/7827217
For instance, all PC laptops have a big external power supply with long cables with some kind of velcro strip on order to tidy the cables It's been like this for 20 years. Apple probably uses the same internal components in their power supplies, but they've designed one with a nice magnetic connector, a detachable power cable and nice "hooks" for winding the cable. They've had this design for at least 10 years. This is probably not a deciding factor when people buy a laptop, but it's a nice design detail that Apple decided to spend the money on developing, whereas other laptop manufacturers never thought about it. Or, more likely, a lot of designers have thought about it and has have had their ideas axed by the business CEOs.
A less elegant solution is the breakaway cable used on the original XBox controllers, which would detach while leaving the "main" connector still in the laptop.
They run Linux and FreeBSD kernels really well with all hardware components working out of the box as well. Compared to my last experiences with Dell and HP, I'm sticking with Lenovo and Apple for good.
Also: What stops PC manufacturers from creating their own OS? (Obviously not from the ground up but they could create a Linux distro ála Ubuntu.)
I recently tried that with a cheap Compaq laptop (that’s a HP brand) which comes with loads of crap. When you install a fresh copy of Windows, it is clever about which drivers it needs to download and everything just works. Special buttons, sound, Bluetooth, wireless LAN, webcam, SD card slot, you name it. I didn’t have to hunt for one single driver.
You obviously need a fresh copy of Windows and I’m not aware of any computer that comes with one. (All this is assuming that you want Windows and not Linux.) I’m a student and get Windows for free but others are not so lucky. Reinstalling the OS is not really a practical solution for the average user, anyway, but it is illustrative of one thing: The manufactures wouldn’t have to do one thing – just ship their PCs with Windows as is — and there would be no more bloatware.
The last time I bought a Dell, for $10 I could and did add to the order just such a disk. This was in addition to the crapware-laden "recovery" disk that came with it by default.
I haven't done a Windows 7 installation (nor Vista), so I'm not aware of whether this still applies. And the last time I helped someone shop / potentially place a Dell order, I didn't find an option to receive a such a "plain Jane" MS installation disk.
If some variation of the above still applies, my recommendation would be to use another machine to download the machine-specific drivers from the vendor's web site -- assuming they are available. Then, when the machine arrives, do a fresh install from an MS install disk, first thing. Well, maybe turn the machine on first and use it trivially for a day or three to make sure it doesn't have a physical defect. But don't start customizing it in a way you'll regret losing, until you've reinstalled.
As you describe, such a reinstallation can take a miserably "compromised" machine and turn it into a delight to use (if Windows is your thing).
Oh, also have your anti-malware suite ready to install, post Windows reinstallation, BEFORE you plug the thing into a network connection. (Yes, I recommend using one, especially for most/normal people.)
(As for all the "free" programs that come amidst the bloat: TANSTAAFL. You're better off just installing what you need, picking what you really want and/or, where they are the best or your demand is marginal, free programs.)
If you want a fresh retail copy of Windows 7, unfortunately, you actually have to buy it, which adds about $199 onto the price of Windows. At that point, you're better off buying a Mac, as the price advantage that your cheap budget PC gave you by bundling the bloatware is easily cancelled by the additional Windows license price.
You get better software and better hardware with the Mac, plus a bloatware free and virus free experience. It's a win/win.
Though I'm pretty sure they used to do what you described in the past, so I wouldn't put it past other manufacturers to still do it!
EDIT: Perhaps I should have said / mean "licenses" rather than "disks".
If you bought a PC and it came with Windows, then you should have a windows license (and associated product key or whatever) so reformatting should be fine.
Maybe I was doing it wrong, I don’t know, but I couldn’t get it to work. I always had to rely on keys I got from elsewhere.
If there is some way that would be great but still not exactly solve the problem. Can you download Windows ISOs directly from Microsoft? I don’t think so. You might have a key but I don’t know of any easy way to get a Windows copy without paying.
(With the disks being stamped wholesale, I don't see too much wrong with this. Stealing the license code / functionality -- that would have been another matter.)
I always offer to do this for my family members too as soon as they buy laptops, because if I don't, I'll inevitably be on the receiving end of calls like, "acabal, why is my laptop so slow, I only just bought it last month, does it have a virus?!?!"
You should see all the crap that's installed on a Japanese laptop, it makes the American ones look completely spartan. I personally think it's bizarre, the machines are unusably slow, I pave mine as soon as I get them
Secondly, there is a technological solution to the crapware menace. It's called a Linux installation CD (or USB drive).