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Comment by mysterypie | Hacker News Reader

Is there any way to visit Shenzhen without submitting your fingerprints to the Chinese government? I've heard that everyone gets their fingers scanned at entry these days even if you never had to submit fingerprints with your visa application. Is that correct?

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Last time I went there (July 2019, Shanghai), I had to submit myself to a fingerprint scan. As I recalled I have done the fingerprint scan previously. But this time, for some reason, the machine did not work or had an error, and the immigration officer saw it. She fiddled with my hand and checked the machine, was confused, then allowed me to passport check anyway.

I don't think you can refuse a fingerprint check. But if one can somehow make their fingerprints unreadable, through one way or another, you probably could bypass it.

One of my coworker is notoriously hard to fingerprint scan. Her fingerprints are allegedly busted up due to all the hand washing she'd done in her previous line of work. So maybe it can be bypassed somehow.

Same as US then. Every time you travel to the US - boom all 10 fingers scanned.

It's nothing the Chinese are exceptional at.

Don't forget you are now expected to hand over twitter, Facebook and other social media handles before travelling to the US as well, and that's as a UK/EU passport holder...

Seriously? Do they just ask for it or is there a section on a customs form or something? What if you just leave it blank and/or don’t use social media?

Absurd if true.

There's a section on it in the online visa application form. They make clear that if you omit items (eg you share you facebook page but not your twitter) and they find out then that may be grounds to deny your visa application.

The entire form starts with copy that goes something like "by filling out this form you waive any right to privacy". It's extremely aggressive. The US hates foreigners.

(source: my first and only trip to the US some 3 years ago)

No we don’t. We just have dumb politicians. Sorry about that.

I meant US the country, as in the government etc. Not the Americans, you're great :-)

It is part of "random" checks. There have been cases of people being denied entry for unlocking burner phones or social media, and -allegedly- people have been denied, because the TSA didn't believe them they weren't using social media.

Furthermore, it isn't only illegal things thst could get you singled out. If I remember correctly, a simple facebook post accusing the US to be war criminals and the greatest threat to peace was used to deny someone entry.

(On mobile atm. will update with sources in 4 hours)

I had to do a fingerprint scan and photo for the visa application, then another fingerprint and face scan when passing through the airport security.

Is there a problem with the fingerprinting requirement? I imagine the face scan can be used in much more dystopian ways, as your face is probably* being tracked by the ubiquitous security cameras in every public place you go.

* If not now, then soon.

I flew to Beijing in 2017 and no fingerprints were taken.

Then in 2018 I took a train from HK to Shenzhen and they indeed took all 10.

I’ve been to China three time in the past three years; I’ve never had to be fingerprinted.

Anecdata but I got fingerprinted just passing through Shanghai airport in transit at the end of 2018.

I haven't visited the US or transited through a US airport but again anecdotally I've heard this happens there too (even in transit).

I'm not sure about transit but when I (EU citizen) have been to the US they took all ten of my fingerprints, and this has also been the experience of my friends.

(Incidentally, my own government doesn't even have any of my fingerprints...)

I wouldn't be so certain that your government does not have your fingerprint... if it's European you can bet that at least your secret services have it as part of "we spy on your citizens, you on ours" agreement.

Of course they do - at least in Germany. Your biometrics are part of your personal ID and passport. It is only thumb and index finger though plus facial scan / photo.

The prints are only stored on the passport/ID card and not indexed by the government (although there are plans to change this)

Incidentally, when EU countries introduced biometric passports in mid 2000s, USA was one of the first countries to actually require the fingerprints and not accept older but otherwise valid documents.

Your handle suggests you're Dutch: every Dutch passport issued in the last decade (and hence, I think almost every current valid Dutch passport?) has your fingerprints. In fact, the Netherlands is the only EU country so far (I think) that's storing them all together centrally, not just in the passport.

https://web.archive.org/web/20100108102201/http://www.nrc.nl...

That article is from 2009. I believe a few years later fingerprinting was scrapped again due to public backlash. Now they're implementing it again due to EU regulations.

The US has been doing that for about 15 years, based on laws (such as US-VISIT) passed after 9/11.

Jan 2004: http://www.nbcnews.com/id/3875747/ns/us_news-security/t/us-b...

https://travel.state.gov/content/travel/en/us-visas/other-vi...

https://epic.org/privacy/us-visit/

> The US has been doing that for about 15 years

Except for US citizens and Canadians. Interestingly, Canada is the only country exempt from the US fingerprinting requirement, at least for tourism or business entry.

I would assume because they consider Canadians generally lower risk, have good relations with Canadian authorities, and really don't want to slow down the line at border crossings.

> even in transit

There isn't the concept of international transit in the US. You have to "fully" enter the country as there aren't separate international terminals with passport checking and whatnot.

There's a short stay transit visa if you are just using the US as a connection point, though.

Was in Shanghai yesterday, at Pudong. Got all 10 fingerprints and face scan.

Been over 40 times this year, get my finger prints checked every time I go through the Shenzhen border.

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