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It's not the hands that are the problem, it's the cognitive load. Hands free is no safer than hands on, when it comes to talking on the phone.

https://www.insurancejournal.com/news/national/2014/04/15/32...

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Is having a conversation with someone in the car any different than having one over the phone?

I don't see anyone advocating for a ban on conversation in cars.

The hypothesis of why local conversations are safer is that when traffic gets complex, the passenger will see that as well and pause the conversation. The person on the phone doesn't have that awareness. However some jurisdictions have restrictions on passengers for younger/provisional drivers, for just that reason.

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