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Comment by kaibee | Hacker News Reader

Is there some reason you're not interested in building it yourself?

Though to answer your question, I don't think you can go wrong with https://system76.com/desktops

The answer to why not diy is usually predominantly available time.

Start to finish build time(including OS install) is maybe two hours if you're a complete newbie. Everything is color coded and keyed to fit into only one spot.

Putting the computer together is typically the fastest step in the process. However, you have to factor in trouble-shooting time if some component doesn't work. More wait time if you need to ship it back and get a new component. Then there's all the time up front to research desired parts and find the best prices. Filling out rebates and then having to think about getting the rebate check back for the next 4 to 8 weeks.

There's a lot more to time and cognitive load to account for than just plugging in RAM sticks.

What you described is not a normal experience. Sure problems crop up, but it also can and definitely does happen with a prebuilt machine. If you're already working on existing machine, wait time doesn't exactly factor into any of it.

I've never built a machine without at least one DOA part. I've never had one just turn on and work the first time either.

As someone who has built at least a hundred PCs, I have to assume that you are either breaking the parts yourself or buying from the shadiest resellers. Or, only built one and gotten very unlucky.

I build a PC every few years. You've built at least 100, so you're much better at it. You have the experience to avoid problems and solve problems that come up that the average builder doesn't.

The advice to someone like me, someone who just needs a new computer once in awhile, that building is the way to go, is not so obviously the best advice.

You said that you always receive DOA parts. This shouldn't be affected by experience, unless you are damaging them.

> you have to factor in trouble-shooting time if some component doesn't work.

> More wait time if you need to ship it back and get a new component.

> Then there's all the time up front to research desired parts and find the best prices.

These three downsides are not avoided by purchasing a pre-built, either.

Aren't they?

1: The computer has been tested before shipping (at least enough to install an OS on it), so odds that it's got a DoA part is virtually nil. 2: Sure, but see above: less risk that any components will be broken. 3: You don't have to do nearly as much research - you know that they're shipping you a working configuration, that the motherboard socket fits the CPU and the RAM in the listed configuration. You might still want to do research to try to find the best bargains or performance, but the time is way less.

or for work. i ain't building something for myself for work. if it breaks, i fix it. im going to buy it from someone and if it breaks, they fix it.

I recently did a tear down of my main desktop to upgrade the SSD mounted on the back side of the motherboard. Due to being a small form factor case, I had to pretty much tear the whole computer apart to take the motherboard out. This whole process of tear down to the point of reinstalling the OS was probably 45 minutes. It shouldn't take too much time to build a desktop, but I'll admit it doesn't always go perfectly to plan.

There are plenty of places to find lists of parts picked by people who just love building computers, so getting a list of parts to order isn't too difficult even without a lot of knowledge into components.

That said, for people who really want to just get a fully assembled computer most Ryzen 9's are going to be sold by boutique builders. It seems like most of the big name OEMs aren't building many units with Ryzen. This is especially true for the highest end parts such as the Ryzen 9's and Threadripper. System 76 is probably the best place to go to get a professional looking machine, otherwise try the smaller gaming rig places such as Cyberpower or Alienware if those kind of aesthetics are acceptable (or wanted, some people need RGB LEDs everywhere :) )

If you're going prebuilt, you can afford to throw around money. If you can afford to throw around money, you can just not think about the parts you buy and get the most expensive a la carte parts and end off better.

Then, putting them together takes maybe thirty minutes?

Going prebuilt for a desktop is never worth it.

Having a computer that's already ready to go, and any problems are dealt with via a single supplier? I'd pay a couple hundred extra at least for that.

That's kind of optimistic. The only service that does this I know of is the Dell enterprise agreement. Computer breaks, they fix it within a few hours or give you a loaner.

Anything else you're looking at at least 2 weeks. Typically it's better to just buy another machine or buy more parts then repurpose the fixed one.

> Then, putting them together takes maybe thirty minutes?

Getting the cabling in neat order takes that 30 mins alone. So does CPU+cooler installation. I always reserve a whole afternoon+evening for full computer rebuilds. Then again, that happens every 5-8 years so I'm always a bit rusty when starting.

Also, never had a prebuilt so could be they aren't as clean with the cabling of course.

They're definitely not that clean. The wires are just shoved in there. Maybe not will some high end Dell servers. You can do the same in your builds, too -- only time it matters is if you're ricing a uATX case.

It could be over 30 minutes for sure, but at most an hour or two unless you've never done it and have no idea what the parts do. But just looking at the parts on Amazon or whatever, I see a lot of people figure out where they go in their head.

With how easy it is to slip up and destroy the pins on these things, I'm amazed how comfortable everyone seems to be with handling a $750 chip with absolutely no recourse for damaging it besides spending another $750.

> With how easy it is to slip up and destroy the pins on these things

Every socket based CPU I ever saw had a graphical mark or a little cut out on the top of the chip which lined up on the motherboard's socket.

Unless you went out of your way to ignore that marking and jammed it in the odds of bending pins are really really low / close to impossible.

I'd be more concerned about mounting an after market heat sink on the CPU. I don't know how much has changed in the last few years but the amount of force you need to use to lock them down makes you think you're going to snap your motherboard in half.

> With how easy it is to slip up and destroy the pins on these things

Is it any easier to destroy than any other CPU? Just as easy to crash a Lambo as a BMW but people still drive those.

With Intel CPUs the pins are on the motherboard socket. You can easily destroy the motherboard instead, but when dealing with high end CPUs the motherboard is probably the less expensive component.

You really have to be unlucky or do something stupid to bend the keys. You just have to pick up the CPU and put it back down at some place without any pressure. If you let it fall down or try to force it to go somewhere - sure you can kill it. But how often do you let something fall down every day? For me it's the same probability then damaging my car while parking in a spacious parking lot - which will be even more costly. Or dropping my laptop.

I recently watched my friend attempt to remove the stock cooler from his 2200G and it yanked clean from the socket, bending about 50 pins in the process.

Unlucky, sure. Dropping things is unlucky, and that is all it takes. People drop things all the time.

You're supposed to twist the cooler off to break the thermal compound. Pulling it straight off is a really bad idea.

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