First electric ute engineered in Australia for use in mining and agribusiness | Hacker News Reader

First electric ute engineered in Australia for use in mining and agribusiness

thedriven.io

58 pointsclouddrover51 comments

I don't know if "engineered in Australia" is a fair description, it's an electric conversion for 79-series Landcruisers, which are already widely used as light vehicles in the mining industry.

Mining LVs are a good match for electric vehicles, though, because they spend a lot of time traveling at low speed or sitting around idling, and they can be recharged from the plant's main electrical power source (which can be augmented with renewables) instead of using diesel which needs to be trucked in over hundreds of kilometers.

Edit: Also while the sticker price seems high, if the maintenance is lower by any significant amount then mining companies will love them. Equipment costs are a small fraction of site operating expenses.

There's some mining operation with battery electric trucks where the mine is above the unloading point. So the heavy loads all move downhill, the trucks use regenerative braking, and they don't need external charging.

https://www.autoblog.com/2019/08/26/edumper-electric-mining-...

I think these are the ones you're talking about?

> It’s available in 20 to 120 kilowatt hour battery packs, with modular battery packs in it, and has a 700 Newton meter electric motor in it,” said Possingham.

I bet you he said Newton metre.

It's an extra kicker that people who don't use metric units also get to change the spelling of metric units the rest of us are using.

> I bet you he said Newton metre.

Are `meter` and `metre` pronounced differently?

> It's an extra kicker that people who don't use metric units also get to change the spelling of metric units the rest of us are using.

Assuming you are referring to the US, we use metric. We just don't use it for everything.

What a strange high-horse you sit on.

> Are `meter` and `metre` pronounced differently?

I wouldn't imagine so.

Bit like how cheque and check aren't pronounced differently -- so not really homonyms, as the meaning is the same (or at least in the North American interpretation usage, one of the meanings matches the meanings of the standard English word / spelling).

In English, meter is a device used to measure something, and it's convenient to distinguish that by spelling (rather than relying on potentially ambiguous context) from the SI unit for length -- the metre.

Similarly, a thousand x 1kg (SI unit for mass) gives you a tonne -- this is also easily distinguished from the myriad variations of 'ton' that may refer to mass or volume (eg UK, US, long, short, harbour). Seeing US publications regularly use the phrase 'a metric ton' provokes a similar reaction of despair for my horse.

For non-Australians, "ute" is the widely-used abbreviation for "utility vehicle".

Need to 'muricanise it more... It's a sort of pickup truck.

Here, let me translate to American ;D - Chevy El Camino or Ford Ranchero.

"Two^ nations divided by a common language" - (someone famous) ^Four, really.

The Land Cruiser platform in the article is similar in size to the more contemporary Ford Explorer Sport Trac:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Explorer_Sport_Trac

It's also probably more comparable mechanically.

Do you guys get the Toyota Hilux[1] in the USA? That's a classic "ute".

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Hilux

Yeh. That segment is usually referred to as something like "compact pickup truck".

The Tacoma is the NA equivalent of the Hilux, and they are close enough in form factor to be considered equivalent for the purposes of this comparison.

We used to. I had the 4x4 version and I miss that truck. It was absolutely bulletproof and would go anywhere and get back home in one piece.

Since 1993 or so it's been replaced by the Tacoma which might be even better, but not as simple mechanically.

Honda Ridgeline and Subaru Baja are probably the comparison points that are more relatable to the HN crowd as far as UTEs go.

Small four door pickups are a more analogous use case to the vehicle in the article though.

Smaller than most pickup trucks though, more like station-wagon sized.

Traditionally yeah, although most utes are pick-up sized now. They're enormous bastards.

Here's Goose driving a traditional ute:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_pc0BJ33cQ

    Judge Chamberlain Haller:  Uh... did you say "utes"?
               Vinny Gambini:  Yeah, two utes.
    Judge Chamberlain Haller:  What is a ute?

( https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hu8tX2BAD1k )

When I read ute I was expecting to see something like an electric Maloo, not a 4x4.

It's really only since the demise of Ford and Holden in recent years that "ute" has been used to describe an American-style pickup like a Ford Ranger or VW Amarok with an enclosed tray.

Maybe someone will do an electric "Sandman" panelvan conversion. The petrol fumes were always terrible driving around with the back open.

Yeah, it seems the marketing geniuses got together to make the one tonners become tradie utes which then allowed this new american style 'ute'. It's not cricket.

For everyone non-Oz, a 'Maloo' is this: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ute_(vehicle)#/media/File:2010...

A uniquely Australian vehicle:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zmGfLFF6O9M

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ute_(vehicle)

> Traditionally the term referred to vehicles built on passenger car chassis and with the cargo tray integrated with the passenger body. However, present-day usage of the term "ute" in Australia and New Zealand has expanded to include any vehicle with an open cargo area at the rear; which would be called a pickup truck in other countries.

My first two vehicles were utes: Holden, of course (HJ '74 and HX '76).

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holden_HJ#/media/File:Holden_U...

Born in the early 70s in Australia, there's something visceral about Holden V8s.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMUx4DXDhA0

And the Monaro GTS sedan on the HJ Wikipedia page is my idea of a family car.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holden_HJ#/media/File%3AHold...

Very expensive. AUD200K is over USD$136K

Base car costs $AU71k according to carsales, plus it has 88kWh worth of batteries. A naive calculation puts that at $65k worth of batteries when compared with 6.5 tesla powerwalls (costing $AU10k each) to get the same capacity (obviously the non-battery hardware in the powerwall vs ute would be different but roughly equivalent). Adding to $136k. Plus of course the engineering costs. No idea what you could sell the unused diesel motor for, and how much the electric motor costs. Interesting!

Cheaper than running it on petrol you have to haul in. Have to look at total operating costs, not just vehicle sticker.

They also mention reduces ventilation needs; if mines don't have to handle diesel exhaust in confined underground spaces that's another win.

I wonder how quickly it charges. Vehicles in mine sites are often in use around the clock, which is fine if you can quickly top them up with fuel, but if it takes a few hours to recharge them, you're going to need more vehicles.

The bigger the battery, the faster it can charge to 80% or so. The last 20% is the slow charge, but if the vehicle is always plugged in when not moving, it’s not a concern.

Most of the time a mining vehicle (or any other vehicle used in a similar setting) is not moving it is nowhere near a plug. It's not like buses or delivery vehicles where they only ever stop when they're at some sort of "home base" where they can charge. A mining vehicle is sitting around somewhere remote while the operator gets out and surveys something or fixes something (or it sits there with HVAC blasting while they do paperwork).

While a mine itself is remote, they typically either have utility power or on site generation. Many mines are moving to renewables for local generation for cost savings reasons. Anything you have to bring to a remote location is expensive, including power or fuel.

How the mine gets its power is irrelevant. The point is that these vehicles are rarely stationary at any sort of base where they can charge. Most mines run 24/7 (though often not at full capacity during the "off" hours). The duty cycle is much higher than buses and delivery vehicles.

I find it sadly ironic that the industry that's responsible for most emissions and actively influences political position in this country to put profit before the environment is the one that this zero emissions car is being targeted at.

With that said, bravo on the implementation and using the 79 as a very solid platform. The sales pitch of the article doesn't sound very compelling though, so I wonder how much success they'll have. Until they can hit a cost parity with diesels, it could be a bit of a slog.

(1) Most of the mines in Australia aren't coal mines. Maybe there is a case that Asia could prosper as they do without coal (I doubt it, but maybe) - but there is no way they could have prospered like they have without vast amounts of iron ore and copper. The environment absolutely takes a back seat to that outrageous level of prosperity. And even then, Australian mines are pretty environmentally sensitive.

Also, Australia seems to be ~40% of world's lithium production [0]. Probably not going to complain about the emissions those mines kick up.

So basically, don't be sad. Maybe try for proud wonder.

(2) You'll often see solar panels in mines too (setting up infrastructure to a grid is hard work) and I suspect mine rehab would often be a good place to erect some windfarms.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mining_in_Australia#Statistica...

You'll often see solar panels in mines too

I know that you're talking about surface mining, but this phrase made me giggle because I thought about the other kind first.

Even when not directly responsible for emissions, the Australian mining sector has been notoriously and effectively climate denialist. As an industry, miners actively and successfully lobbied against the “carbon tax” implemented by the Gillard Labor government [0]. In fact, the then CEO of my former employer (Western Mining Corp, 90’s) Hugh Morgan, was then and still is an absolutely single-minded climate change denialist, despite WMC being primarily a nickel and uranium miner (at the time).

But what’s even more ironic is the fact that in the election earlier this year, eventual PM Scott Morrison was lambasting the Labor leader Bill Shorten for his proposed policy of a ICE vehicle phaseout, saying that Bill wanted to take away people’s utes and “end the weekend” [1].

[0] https://www.afr.com/policy/tax-and-super/miners-dig-deep-to-...

[1] https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2019-04-09/utes-electric-cars...

Also ironically, the mining sector is also the driving factor behind a lot of renewable energy innovation projects in Australia. Since mining usually takes place in the middle of nowhere, utilising the sun/wind for energy makes things easier than having to transport fossil fuels long distances.

https://arena.gov.au/projects/agnew-renewable-energy-microgr...

They are also leaders in utilising vehicle automation with many mines operating self-driving dump trucks with minimal remote supervision.

Also decomissioned mines are increasingly being used for pump-hydo, eg: https://www.genexpower.com.au/250mw-kidston-pumped-storage-h...

Even better if they are right where the customers are. This would be awesome if they can make it work:

https://www.arup.com/projects/bendigo-underground-pumped-hyd...

Electrics have significant lower opex, it will make a fair dent in the considerable capex for this, especially given Australian labour costs. Also the article spruiks underground use, where air quality is always a consideration. So health and safety is also a plus.

So I recon cost parity should be tempered by all the external positives, which for electrics is not insignificant.

FMG just signed a biggish deal for Solar PV to run the admin offices (and more): https://www.fmgl.com.au/docs/default-source/announcements/19...

Wow, that's a beautiful truck. I wish American utility vehicle designers would go back to a boxier design.

Edit: I'd kill for a truck that had Land Rover looks with Ford or Toyota truck reliability.

Look up Rivian

The truck in the article is a converted 79 Series Toyota Land Cruiser. I would have thought you could get one in USA?

That's funny, this got me googling around and I discovered my mistake. I thought that looked like a retro Toyota grill. Definitely in love with the Land Cruiser 70.

Unfortunately we can't get them in the states. Truly rugged bare bones vehicles have sold so poorly in the U.S. that a base Ford pickup is about the simplest thing you can buy here.

See https://bollingermotors.com/

>I wish American utility vehicle designers would go back to a boxier design.

As long as we care about fuel economy (and range, when they go electric) in light trucks curves are here to stay.

In the mining industry our utility trucks are often still boxy like this.

$200K sounds like a lot, but thats about as much as a Landcruiser with Duramax conversion (in AU).

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