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Comment by jccalhoun | Hacker News Reader

Did I miss it or did the article not say what they arrested the older man for. Living in a basement isn't illegal in and of itself but the only hint of wrong doing is that the guy at the bar wanted to end the way they were living. I wouldn't be surprised if the family had been held against their will or there was some kind of abuse but the article doesn't mention it.

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You missed it, the reason the older was was arrested was because he was not cooperating with the police investigation. What it exactly means in this context is not completely clear though. But I can imagine the police went to have a look, and the man freaked out.

This is uncommon in the Netherlands, I know there are communities in the US with small communities that don't want anything to do with the government. Those people don't even have birth certificates or social security number. But I've never heard anything like that in the Netherlands.

> But I've never heard anything like that in the Netherlands.

They must be really good at hiding themselves. /s

...something something kelder vs. achterhuis.

yes hide and seek champions! https://imgflip.com/i/3dfs74

>not cooperating with the police investigation

Here in the US that means "lawyering up instead of being dumb and running his mouth", not sure if it's the same over there. If he was really not cooperative the police would be more than happy to say exactly what (they say) he did.

Strong privacy laws prevent them from doing that. I saw an interview with a police officer and they could basically not say anything at all. Most info comes from journalists.

It's just the smallest, easiest to prove thing that allows them to lock him up for a short time while the investigation is getting started. When they know more about what actually happened they can file more detailed charges.

From what I've gathered reading Dutch sources:

* The man wasn't cooperating with a police investigation as to whether or not people are being held there against their will (at least one person - the escaped 25 year old 'boy' - said he had been).

* While the children are now adults, it appears as if they never went to school (illegal in NL, with some homeschooling exceptions, but this must be formerly arranged).

* It appears as if (at least some of) the kids were also never registered. This is also illegal in NL.

* The above two facts are probably considered to be child abuse and may be part of a larger pattern of abuse now that they are adults.

There's what they technically arrested him for, which was apparently not cooperating with a police investigation, and there's why they really arrested him, which is that there is a very strong possibility that he was instrumental in forcing several children to live in a basement for 9 years, but they don't have the evidence sorted out for that charge yet.

The article gave the age of the oldest one (apart from the older guy) as 25, and apparently they've lived like that for 9 years. That suggests they were all children when they went underground. There's almost certainly some sort of child welfare law violated when you force your kids to live in a basement for 9 years.

Even just not sending your children to school can be a legal issue. There are religious exemptions though (I was mostly home-schooled, for example).

The article does mention that the man claimed to have "ran away" and requested help to enable his younger siblings to "end the way they were living", so that kind of does imply that at least some members of that family have been held there against their will.

arrested for "not cooperating". Perhaps that's against the law there and one can be compelled to cooperate in a general way.

I'm more curious about how they paid rent for a decade, without contact with the outside world (e.g. a job-->salary). And how did this man pay for his five beers?

There's an interesting story here, but to my American mind I don't see evidence of a crime unless some were being held against their will.

Based on the bar-chatter, it sounds like the boy was being held against his will.

There’s probably also a case of negligence to be made. Keeping children in basements for a long time is likely to impede their development.

Also schooling?

Do they require that you educate your child via the state or (not so) equivalent home-schooling?

It is required to let your child go to school and home-schooling does not satisfy that requirement so is in principle illegal. There are a few ways some people do manage to get it allowed (you have to argue that your way of life / religion is fundamentally incompatible with all schools in the region) but expect quite a few visits from suspicious civil cervants and lots of arguing.

That's the theory, anyway. How it was possible that these children were never checked on is still under investigation.

Why bother teaching your children if the world is going to end before they are adults?

Because it'll get them taken away before the world ends

Its an annoying needle to thread

More details are coming out. The 58-year old renter who was arrested did have an income (from work as a carpenter), and he bought groceries. He was not the father of the kids / young adults, the father was also inside, bedridden as he suffered a stroke a number of years ago.

I'm assuming he didn't pay for his beers. In small pubs you only pay your bill when you leave. Not that he'd know.

Notice, the farm did not belong to him. So where is the owner?

The current owner is a lady married to a local politician. She inherited the farm 4 years ago from her aunt. She visited the property a few times and never noticed something suspicious. The rent was paid for promptly every month. Many questions remain unanswered.

article in Dutch: https://www.rtvdrenthe.nl/nieuws/153066/Eigenaresse-boerderi...

Where did the money come from?

The 58 year old was an excellent carpenter, specialized in ship interiors. He did not live at the farm, but visited it daily with food and stuff such as toilet paper. Towards the outside world he was just refurbishing the old farm. Very weird story.

I would suspect that anti slavery laws could be used and yes there is such a thing, in the UK it's normally gang masters keeping agricultural workers.

Well, he was not educating his childrens. Not sure about the law, but too me, it's serious misconduct.

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