MNT Reform DIY Laptop | Hacker News Reader

MNT Reform DIY Laptop

mntre.com

98 pointsmilsebg39 comments

Hi,

this is where I regret not having updated that particular page in a longer time. While the goals remain the same, we have almost finished a complete redesign of the project.

Here are some updates: https://mntre.com/media/news_md/2019-05-20-reintroducing-ref...

In the flesh:

https://mastodon.social/@mntmn/102903623346043604

https://mastodon.social/@mntmn/102872674526072643

https://mastodon.social/@mntmn/102720152037379092

There are many work-in-progress pictures when you go to https://mastodon.social/web/accounts/35156/media

If you prefer Twitter, I also post a lot of updates about the project there (@mntmn).

Updated technical specs:

CPU: NXP/Freescale i.MX8M with 4x ARM Cortex-A53 cores (1.5GHz), 1x Cortex-M4F core

RAM: 4GB LPDDR4 memory

GPU: Vivante GC7000Lite GPU with

Display: Full HD (1920x1080 pixels) 12.5" IPS eDP display. Optional HDMI port

USB: 3x USB 3.0 external, 2x USB 2.0 internal (for input devices)

Networking: Gigabit Ethernet port. Optional miniPCIe WiFi card

Storage: Internal M.2 socket for NVMe SSD. Full size SD Card slot

PCIe: 1 miniPCIe port

Keyboard: Slim Mechanical USB Keyboard with Kailh Choc Brown Switches, FOSS Firmware

Trackball (Option): Reform Optical USB Trackball with 5 Mechanical Switches (Kailh Choc Brown), FOSS Firmware

Trackpad (Option): Reform Capacitive USB Trackpad Enclosure: Modular case from CNC milled, black anodized aluminum 6061 and semi-transparent acrylic (bottom cover, bezel)

Sound: Wolfson ADC/DAC (WM8731), Stereo Speakers, 3.5" headset/microphone jack (no internal microphone) Camera: No camera

Battery: Safe LiFePO4 battery technology. Owner serviceable 8x 18650 cells totalling 12Ah/3.2V. Estimated 5h battery life.

System Controller: NXP LPC11U24 ARM Cortex-M0 chip with FOSS Firmware and hackable expansion port Manual: Printed Operator Manual incl. system schematics and full parts list

Sources: KiCAD sources for motherboard, keyboard, trackball, trackpad, STEP/STL/FreeCAD files for case parts, C sources for all firmware (input devices and system controller), build scripts for boot & system image

OS: Preloaded with Debian GNU/Linux 10, Linux 5.x mainline kernel

Weight: ±1.5kg (TBD)

BTW don’t panic, there’s also a trackpad option if you don’t want the ball.

Hi, just curious if there had been any requests for a E-Ink display? I understand the limitations with refresh rates, burning etc. and that the use cases are limited to document reading; but considering this is a DIY/Modular laptop I wonder whether offering an optional E-Ink display crossed your mind.

P.S I browse HN on my Kindle Oasis and found your site to be rendered very well on it. Most minimalist sites does work very well on an E-Ink display.

Yep, the original plan was to have an option with a Plastic Logic display. But the displays are expensive and an extra big project to get to work well for a general purpose computer. But an interesting option for later.

Yes, costs of larger E-Ink display have been prohibitive; I've been told its due to the low volume production.

Btw, €100 Hisense E-ink display phones are supposedly about to hit the market[1]. Perhaps they have their own factory or has found ways to minimize the cost, if so it should be worthwhile to check them out.

[1]:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZzfmvYWUwB4

The MNT Reform seems to have open sources for the case and boards but a proprietary SoC and modules. There is also the Teres-I laptop from Olimex with open sources for the case and boards but a proprietary SoC and modules. The Librem 5 from Purism will have open sources for the case and board but a proprietary SoC and modules.

It is good that we have at least the choice to buy a device with a blackbox from China (Allwinner A64, Teres-I) or from Europe (NXP i.MX8M, both MNT Reform and Librem5). But I think we would benefit from reusing common components in hardware just like in software.

What do you think about cooperating with other developers that have similar goals to yours? Are you already?

Yep I’d like to see an open SOM for Reform. If we are successful enough (re: cashflow/funding), it’s possible to do our own.

Are there trackpoint with FOSS firmware out there that could be used?

I'm very glad to see the mainline kernel! I had a Novena and it not being upstreamed really hurt it's ability to be supported.

What does the "system controller" actually do? Battery management? Could a reliable system controller be used for other SoC platforms?

This is fantastic. It looks like we're approaching the territory of being able to easily build our own laptops from scratch. That will go a long way to preventing lock-in!

I think if a specialised workshop can assemble a better laptop will be nice. It can open in business for those specialist who can use machining and specialities skills to quickly assemble a laptop for customers based on their choices and design.

Like in the good old days corner stores and shops can assemble pc’s. Larger assemblers like HP, Dell and Apple killed that market but I feel it will be a good time to restart it. Like vinyl took over CD sales representing going back in time.

Hopefully this can be done for mobile phones as well with advancement in technology and standards. We need IBM PC kind of open and free as in freedom standards in laptop and mobile phones on hardware level.

Yep, I believe that indie/boutique hardware that gives you some independence from the big corporate gardens will be an important thing.

> Reclaim your privacy and security: No microphone, camera or management engine

The nice thing about Libre laptops is the camera + microphone have a hardware switch, so it's not either/or. They also claim to have neutered the management engine.

Regardless this project looks cool and is obviously a different approach to Libre.

Do you mean the Librem laptops from Purism?

Yes too late to edit comment thanks

The beta units were 600 euros, while the chipset is $87.

Meanwhile an Acer Aspire E 15 for $600 gives you a $297 CPU and $70 graphics card.

I guess there is some overhead because the beta was 10 units not a hundred thousand units, but still. You might as well get a Raspberry Pi and a portable screen and stick them in a box. It's half the price and you can use the components for other things after you get bored.

You can't expect a two-man company to win on every point against Acer. I don't think 900 euro is bad for a laptop, especially not one with an upgrade path.

Making your own Raspberry Pi laptop/portable is a fun project, but it's not really the same as making one that people can just buy, neither for the maker nor the owner. A community of hacks and mods can spring up around the standards set by such a project.

I really look forward to getting one.

Can you get the sources for the board for the Raspberry? Can you run it without blobs?

It doesn't look like those are available. But CPU chips are just compiled Verilog at this point, if you want sources for every last thing you'd have to move away from ARM entirely since it's a proprietary ISA. Maybe SiFive will release a fully open laptop sometime in the future.

To what extent have you consulted the mechanical keyboard community? There is a tremendous amount of knowledge and experience about keyboard layout, electronics, software, hardware, etc. and it is not obvious to me that a community design would closely resemble what you are using. I recommend posting to https://reddit.com/r/mechanicalkeyboards, https://geekhack.com, and https://deskthority.net, and possibly reaching out directly to some of the most experienced individuals, if you have not already done so. The keyboard has been an important part of the success of at least one major laptop brand.

>The keyboard has been an important part of the success of at least one major laptop brand.

Which one?

Likely ThinkPads.

Why have mSATA or MiniPCIe on a 2018/2019 design? M.2 replaced both of those as of literally years ago, and anything remotely modern is only available in that format. mSATA is flat out dead and MiniPCIe has very few modern offerings.

It's not like there's a meaningful hardware difference, it's just a different slot pinout for the same technologies, but one's the modern standard and the others are outdated trash.

This should have two M.2 B-keyed and one M-keyed slot rather than the three legacy slots it has. And really, if I were in charge, it would have two M-keyed slots and only one B-keyed for WWAN. The SSD slot should be a M-keyed PCIe slot, not SATA nonsense. SATA is for spinning rust, PCIe NVMe is for SSDs.

SATA got eliminated for M.2 M-keyed (for NVMe SSD) in the redesign, see my other comment. mPCIe is still useful, because there are a lot of WiFi cards available in that formfactor that don't require firmware, for example.

Crowd supply campaign: https://www.crowdsupply.com/mnt/reform/updates/re-introducin...

Wow. Directly using easily-sourced 18650 cells for power is a killer feature. The trackball seems nice, too. Reminds me of my old Powerbook 180.

A lot of old laptop batterus are a bunch of 18650's wrapped in a black case.

https://imgur.com/gallery/Fywq0

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YBE7-LEPDSk

I'm aware. In many batteries, though, those cells are welded together and the cases are additionally glued or welded. This makes it much more difficult to repack those batteries with new cells than it needs to be.

Does anybody know the expected price point? This is quite exciting and is exactly what I'm looking for, but I imagine the price point will be too high to justify replacing my high-spec working laptop with this lower-end device.

My target price is around 900 EUR.

More libre hardware. Excellent!

The chrome browser on the screenshot makes me suspicious :) Otherwise cool project.

Yeah, nowadays I wouldn't include that anymore.

Will you be at FOSDEM 2020? Would be nice to see a presentation and the actual hardware. https://fosdem.org/2020/

I imagine I could go to FOSDEM again yeah.

I would rather gouge my eyes out with a spoon that look at that eye-sore of a "computer". This is 2019, not COMDEX 1988. C'mon people.

"Please don't post shallow dismissals, especially of other people's work. A good critical comment teaches us something."

https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

It makes me want it even more! It’s has so much character compared to an aluminum blob or black box.

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