I tried to hack my insomnia
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until one night I fell asleep on the couch in front of the TV, and it occurred to me that I could just modify this behaviour to bed.
So I put a handful of old Star Trek episodes on my phone. Each night I put me earphones on (so as not to disturb my wife), turn on an episode of Star Trek, and I am asleep within the first five minutes. ... I can even repeat episodes... it doesnt even matter since Im asleep within literally 5mins.
At first the earphones were annoying, but after a week you dont even notice them.
The stress at work continues, but I sleep like a baby.
I think the familiarity of Star Trek (which I watched a lot as a kid) gives me a subconsious sense of security.
And yes I also find listening to something familiar helps me get to sleep quickly if I’m overstimulated and/or anxious, which is often the case.
I also find it helpful to play binaural beats in the background, which you can do with an iOS app called BrainWave (Dream Inducer).
however, it doesn't work when i need a clear mind, especially when i am exhausted. it is frustrating that no amount of movies, songs, video games will help clear your mind -- at least not mine -- which in turn makes you stay awake...
i used to know how meditate in college, but i have somehow lost that ability it seems (yes, one can lose it lol)
Lack of sleep ages you, makes you overweight, and susceptible to many health issues. Here's what I did to get enough sleep:
* Make sure every monitor/portable device is using Redshift / Night Light blue light filter.
* Set a "sleep alarm" After which no work on a screen. Only reading books/audiobooks
* 0.5mg of Melatonin helps sleep naturally (more gives trippy dreams)
* AVOID sleeping pills (they're more addictive than crack)
* Exercise 3-5 times a week
* Get some natural sunlight during the dayNot properly tried this before, but I'd imagine if it was interesting I'd want to stay awake and listen to it or find out more information... if it's boring I'd just be annoyed by the noise. Maybe bore myself to sleep?
TLDR: MIT did a study and patented Melatonin usage with reasonable dosages. Manufactures just increased the dose 10x to get around the patent. The patent is expired but the damage remains.
Someone posted this a while back, and it goes into a lot of detail: https://www.lesswrong.com/posts/E4cKD9iTWHaE7f3AJ/melatonin-...
* I take 0.3mg at 7:00pm with the goal of falling asleep at 11:00pm
* Redshift always on at 4500k, turns to 2500k at 10:00pm
I still use a screen until the moment I fall asleep, and I probably don't get enough sunlight. However the changes listed are sufficient for me at least.
[1]: https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-th...
Since then I have been: - Trying to exercise every day - No screens after 10:30.
Seems to be making a big difference for me.
Now I've just trained myself to go to sleep. I put my ear plugs in, tell Google to turn the speakers (so my phone charging doesn't make random noise through them) and my salt lamp off and I'm out within a minute or two.
> I just couldn't stop thinking about shit that was going on.
This was the issue. I had to learn how to just shut thoughts off. Not think of nothing, just not think. Watching a television show for an hour before bed (with the monitor color adjusted, whatever Chrome OS calls their version of f.lux) let's me get my mind off of whatever and then I'm in bed within a 5 minute window Sundays-Thursdays.
This. I have high anxiety and sleeping is difficult when you brain is trying to send you into a panic about all the shit you have to deal with. So I use two things, weed and TV.
I smoke some heavy indica just before bed and within an hour or two I have trouble keeping my eyes open. Though some nights it gets pretty bad so I put on MST3K or ST-TNG. It's like hanging out with old friends, especially MST3K. It's comfy with the volume on very low, screen dimmed maximum and a sleeping mask. Basically, you do your best to drown out the world and your mind.
Though the big help with weed is I don't get that extreme groggy almost vertigo feeling in the morning either. It's almost like being drunk without the intoxication or nausea. Like you are awake but your body didn't get the memo. Though I'm looking to move to making my own edibles as smoking is unhealthy in the long run.
I use the same technique. I purchased a sleep mask with mini built in speakers from Amazon, and it's been great:
https://www.amazon.com/Headphones-Bluetooth-WATOTGAFER-Adjus...
No cords and can even sleep comfortably on my side.
It all unexpectedly went away when I moved into my current apartment. I have huge, unblocked, east-facing windows, and every morning I’m bathed in sunlight. No more sleeping in; I’m wide awake, no arguments. Consequently, by midnight I am dead to the world.
All of this makes me a bit worried for the future, as "big unblocked east window in the bedroom" seems like a big ask for a rental. But yeah, it worked, my sleep is solved for the time being. Except for chunks of February.
However, I don’t know if it counts, medically speaking, and the marketing page is careful not to make any actual claims.
My rational is: if your body has enough sleep, it'll wake up on its own.
On the flip side: it's actually very hard to sleep when your body doesn't need sleep.
On another flip side: it's easy to stay awake even though your body needs sleep.
With this, we should all sleep in a completely dark (blocked) room with no sound and etc. The "big unblocked east window in the bedroom" (unless the curtain blocks the light effectively) is a no for me.
I've read "why we sleep", and I get this conflict where:
1. The author believes in the no-trigger-to-wake-up as well.
2. Somehow I also get the impression that the author also believes that we should use sunlight as a trigger for waking up. We'd feel fresher. But wouldn't that cut off our sleep?
I tried the no-trigger approach for a while, when I was between jobs and didn't have anything to do otherwise. What I found out is that my natural schedule, without manual intervention, has me going to bed at approximately 2am and waking up at around 10:30-11am. When I regained employment, it was a pretty rough transition to go back to waking up at 7am again. After going through that experience, I'd caution people about buying into the no-trigger method. Yes, your brain will naturally get you the amount of sleep that you need. However, there is no guarantee that your natural sleep cycle will mesh with the other obligations you have in your life.
And I don't say that with any joy...
That said, sleep is a complicated, personal thing, and everyone's a little different. You should do what feels right to your body, because it might be very different from what works for my own.
One major assumption that your reasoning relies on is that: human can't adjust their sleep cycle at all.
My unscientific assumption is that we can adjust our sleep cycle to be earlier. But it'll probably take time and effort to do so though.
When I say sleep cycle, I mean: I usually go to bed at 2am, and I want to go to be at 9pm. Can I slowly adjust my body to achieve that?
> After going through that experience, I'd caution people about buying into the no-trigger method. Yes, your brain will naturally get you the amount of sleep that you need. However, there is no guarantee that your natural sleep cycle will mesh with the other obligations you have in your life.
It seems you agree that the no-trigger method is good if we only consider health.
"why we sleep" convinces me that sleep deprivation (even a little) is bad. Essentially, it's a trade-off between damaging your health vs. obligations. This tradeoff is difficult to quantify, so it depends on how you perceive value in each.
Another way that I think about is: the mistake is "going to bed late". You already made the mistake, but you still can choose the punishment. You can choose to damage your health OR you can choose to fail the obligation.
Of course, a better way to avoid all this dilemma together is to go to bed early.
I'd suggest the no-trigger method as the way of life and re-arrange your life to fit the no-trigger method.
As far as the sun as a waking trigger, I believe that as well. With an alarm, it's nothing... nothing... nothing... and then BAM! Time to wake up! The sun rises gradually, and light is entering your eyes before you regain consciousness, so even though it seems like you suddenly wake due to the light, I think it's a more gradual process. That, and I fall back on a naturalistic idea that since that's how humans have woken since time immemorial, that our brains are wired for it in a way.
Absorbing light after waking up is an activity that I agree with though. I actually have SAD lamp at home for this.
I really enjoy not getting that awful rush of stress hormones every workday morning and I feel like it helps me to stay more calm and relaxed. I feel healthier as a person so I think it is worth it overall for my employer.
1) puberty,
2) putting the long break in Summer rather than Winter plus a very early start time with the result that for several months I'd only see the Sun for at most 2.5 hours in the afternoon (walked into the building with the stars still out),
3) a homework load + butt-in-seat time that had more of my hours spoken for than I even came close to reaching again until I had multiple young kids of my own plus a full time job, plus the conditions being a hell of a lot closer to prison than to either college or working adult life (college was harder in some ways, of course, but less time consuming and way less stressful, I found, thanks to the much lower in-class time per week and more flexibility scheduling homework/study time, and consequently felt like a vacation after four years of high school),
4) glowing screens and the opportunity to reclaim some time for myself late at night with highly-engaging entertainment (by which I mean video games and screwing around on computers, the latter of which actually ended up being the most valuable thing I did in high school bar none, admittedly)
Oh and there's a good chance, according to current research, that the whole Winter-is-school-time thing plus younger grades not getting us outside enough in those low-sunlight-per-day months was a major contributor to my being nearsighted by 7th grade. IOW K-12 school broke me both physically and psychologically for no good reason, with consequences lasting between a two-digit count of years and a lifetime, and I had it pretty easy, relatively speaking.
This is what I've been attempting to do to help with my sleep problems, with reasonable success:
1. Lift heavy each week day.
I'm using a PPL routine with at least one big lift each day. I also trying to burn a significant amount of calories each day in the gym. 2. Strict evening routine.
I try to go to bed within the same hour each night if I can help it. 3. Reduce responsibilities.
One of the biggest issues for me is missing my routine. I now try to keep my weekday schedule the same (don't go out at night) so I can have plenty of wind-down time at home before bed. 4. Wind down time.
I try to do something relaxing before going to bed that will distract my mind (like play a low intensity videogame, read about non work-related topics, etc.) 5. Supplements.
I drink a cup of chamomile tea and take 5 mg of melatonin before I go to bed, and this seems to help (or might be a placebo) 6. Listen to something calming and familiar while I fall asleep.
Unlike others in this thread, no Star Trek for me; I like to listen to twitch streamer ZFG speedrun Ocarina of Time. I turn the volume on my phone to the lowest setting, put the phone face-down on the bed next to me, and the audio commentary seems to be helpful background noise.That is way too much and possibly not timed properly. Correct dosage is closer to 0.3 mg - 1 mg. See here for more details about dosage and timing: https://slatestarcodex.com/2018/07/10/melatonin-much-more-th...
Edit: I incorrectly written grams instead of milligrams previously, thanks aneidon for catching it.
I tried just about everything discussed here....meditation, podcasts, watching television, reading before bed but nothing really helped me consistently. I even bought a treadmill and started running every day which does help, but the thing that actually did the trick best was a few puffs of marijuana about an hour before bedtime. It was sufficient to take me "out of my head" enough to get a better night's sleep without feeling foggy the next day.
https://medium.com/s/story/combat-tested-training-unwind-and...
- child pose for about 10 minutes with the head/forehead resting on a pillow
- forced yawning, but without needing to actually make a sound, (and without needing to open the mouth wide). Hard to explain, there's some oral/neck musculature that is not triggered voluntarily that I've been experimenting on which becomes somewhat easier to control with exercise. I'd start with lots of yawning first
a) only dim lights after sunset (reflect for a moment on how unnatural it is, after million or years of modern human evolution, that we all of a sudden have light after sundown. (especially blue light screens, seriously, use apps) ; this disrupts your circadian rhythms and melatonin cycles, so it's a big deal.
b) black out shades. don't underestimate - I've monitored my sleep +2 years with multiple fitness trackers, and noticed a clear positive difference in restlessness levels. it also cured my problem of waking up in the middle of the night to pee believe it or not.
c) air tight wax ear plugs ; sounds will wake you up and you often won't know why. a motorcycle, someone closes a door etc.
d) chilly room. I find ~70F is great. again going back to evo history, it's always been chillier at night.
e) habit x 10. go to bed at the same time, wake up at the same time. be unplugged for at least an hour before sleep and relax for a bit when you wake up. follow point a) after sundown. your sleep drive will take over. this might take months to get there, especially if you're a high cortisol individual, but biology will take over if you let it.
Firstly, it doesn't require leaving your smartphone on all night as she writes. Once started, it's autonomous (it even reportedly shuts down its onboard WiFi/BT, probably for power saving reasons but also to alleviate any fears about having an RF emitter so close to your head for 8 hours)
Secondly, getting an accurate hypnogram (detailed sleep phases) on a consumer EEG device is a huge deal in itself (she doesn't seem to understand the point), but this one goes even further by promising to actively enhance slow wave/deep sleep through precisely timed audio stimulations (white noise pulses). The research in this area is apparently the starting point of the company.
Thirdly, the app does include the kind of CBT program she praises at the end of the article. I find the combination of this with a device that provides an accurate sleep log to be a potentially more efficient combination than CBT alone.
One area where I do have reservations with this class of devices is privacy : not only do you have your exact sleep/wake times + hundreds of MBs of your EEG data uploaded to their servers every morning, the latest version apparently has a built-in microphone !
It's reserved for future use (an obvious application is snoring / sleep apnea detection) and reportedly not activated yet, but of course it's closed source firmware and you have to take their word for it, and even if you trust their intentions (I do, and there's always GDPR), you also have to trust their security as well.
Disclaimer : I have no stake or direct interest in Dreem, but I'm very familiar with their product and even interviewed with them at one point.
And it was 100% stress related. Taking pills, trying breathing exercises, and everything else didn't fix it. It could make me slightly better than doing nothing but it was never fixed.
I have a rhythm now I follow that works better. But, really, I never found a "solution". I just got into a less stressful life. (Finally having a girlfriend, high(er) paying job, etc. was the "trick" - aka solve what causes my stressors)
These days my ability to fall asleep feels like a superpower (because - 1. I know just how absurdly many people out there are functioning on less than optimal sleep on a daily basis, and 2. I know I'm not the only one who has had trouble with falling asleep).
These are the bits of advice I have:
1. I've woken or havent been able to fall asleep because I was hungry. Always try to have eaten at least one satiating meal a day. Also make sure you're not dehydrated or have to pee.
2. Don't ever worry or intentionally think that you have to fall asleep. The stress, the cortisol, and the excitement(when you start falling asleep) will keep you awake. Going one night without sleep is not the end of the world. At worst you were really really relaxed in a nice cozy bed for 8 hours, so take comfort in that time.
3. This one is the most important: think about your brain like its some sort of muscle. If it's engaged its sort of 'flexing', and its very hard to fall asleep if its flexing. If I just 'unflex' my mind the way I would let go of my grip, the next thing I usually notice is that its morning and my alarm clock is waking me up.
Other than these things, everything else I've seen had little affect on my abilities to sleep when I had insomnia - working out until exhaustion out didn't work, neither did weed, neither did alcohol, and neither did induced food coma, reading a book, watching tv, counting sheep. And when I learned again how to fall asleep, I haven't had a problem with blue light, I haven't had a problem with caffeine, I didn't even have a problem with a lot of noise. These things help or hurt your ability to sleep but it doesn't ultimately determine whether or not you do.
When I do sleep, I sleep pretty well, but getting to that state can be tough. I simply have to do some physical work each day to tire my body - otherwise, sleeping is near impossible. The gym is often not enough (and if I go in the evening, it actually wakes me up). I find I need to do something moderately strenuous and mundane, like carrying a few groceries for a mile or two, or maybe sweeping + mopping a few floors round the house or perhaps some DIY.
Also, if I'm unable to sleep, rather than trying to sleep, I find it's better to get up and do some work, even if means being in front of a screen. That knocks me out eventually!
Or more seriously you have messed up bloodwork. Get your blood checked. Vitamin D is necessary during day. Seeing the morning light and end of day sun set can actually help.
Or you didn't exercise enough. Various military organisations have sorted out sleep: they can get you tired enough to sleep vertical. Often while still marching.
It has to be tried to be believed (IMO)
>0 results
None of the stuff they talk about in the article helped me kick my insomnia/DSPS.
Only exercise helped.
I used to run 50km per week or so and still feel like I could use more. Restless legs, active mind, fidgeting, etc. These days I'm running much less, but I'm lost without it.
(Steroid creams to fix skin conditions, caffeine for energy, alcohol for relaxation and fun, anti-inflammatories, antihistamines, the list goes on.)
Oh, if one sees the enormity of complexity body & mind has - one can be sure he can not foresee all side effects. I like that you gave examples like caffeine which messes up your nervous system or alcohol which destroys your conscious attention and lever, among other things :)
>Are you also advocating against medical drugs or vaccines?
I am only advocating about being conscious of how much we don't know. If medical drug or vaccine saves lives - I have no problem with it, still most likely we don't know all the side effects.
(Although, PSA, I do understand that the vast majority of people whose sleep is ruined by alcohol or caffeine or both are also too addicted to quit, and this isn't at this point a conscious attempt at "hacking" anything.)
For one person a heavy day might be a few sets of deadlifts at 80-90% 1rm, for some of us that might mean 2-2.5 hours of training where are warm up alone moves considerably more mass than your entire training and then we also tack on multiple accessory movements and conditioning and if you aren't doing that in the morning it's almost certainly going to mess with your sleep quality that night.
I have a training-induced insomnia blog post that is years old and gets hits every single day without fail. It's probably 1/4 of the total traffic on my personal blog and probably more like 60-65% of Google-referred traffic despite the fact I have 18 years of blog posts.
If you go to sleep when you're so tired, as opposed to when the societal clock says you should, you won't have any trouble sleeping.
Great PMA, but you're absolutely wrong.
I did that last night, got tired and went to bed around 10pm. And then I woke up at 1am. Now that it's approaching 6, I'm getting tired. But this happens to me occasionally and I know from past experience that my two options are:
1) Go back to bed at around 7, wake up at 8 or 9, and feel awful all day
2) Power through, and feel awful all day.
Maybe I'll be tired enough tonight that I'll catch up on this morning's loss. But given past experience, I'll probably get 2-4 hours of sleep a night for the next week. When I say "wake up" I mean that I'm alert and can't get sleepy -- I can stay in bed and be bored for hours, and sleep won't come no matter how tired I feel.
This is how your sleep schedule is naturally designed to work. Sleep for a bit, wake up, sleep again.
Remeron/mirtazapine works really well for me as a reset to baseline. Talk to your Physician about it.
>1) Go back to bed at around 7, wake up at 8 or 9, and feel awful all day
This is exactly what I'm talking about. Faced with this scenario, I would get up at 1AM, go back to bed around 7 or 8, and sleep into the afternoon. Wake up feeling great.
Good for you! I went back to bed around 7, slept for about 15 minutes, and woke up again. I would love to sleep 'til noon, and my work schedule permits it. I've never been able to sleep during the day, except when I'm sick or have multiple days of exhaustion piled up. Your experience is not my experience, stop giving me advice based on what works for you!
Edit: Also I guess I should point out, sleep was way easier in my 20s, but I'm approaching 40 and encountering the same issues my parents did at my age.
I tried telling her that my body doesn't run on the same schedule as the rest of society, but all she did was laugh in my face.
Thanks in advance, doc.