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Comment by motivic | Hacker News Reader

I am a Chinese American but my wife is Chinese. I have a large number of Chinese friends. You may be surprised to learn that vast majority of Chinese natives are very pro-China; and while they can be critical of the Chinese government at times, they tend to be united against any actions taken by foreign entities they consider anti-China or anti-Chinese government.

Talk to a few Chinese immigrants and you will know.

The younger Chinese generation grew up in an era of Chinese economic boom and are the benefactors of the efficiency in decision making that came with a more top-down (dictatorial if you will) government. The younger generation is much more focused on economic well-being and safety over liberty or freedom.

So as long as China can maintain the economic growth it's been having the past two decades, the Chinese public will by and large support the government.

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> The younger generation is much more focused on economic well-being and safety over liberty or freedom

This is perfectly reasonable when you consider it a personal decision. Sure, trade away some of your freedom for better economic well-being.

But how do they justify this when their personal economic well-being requires trampling the freedom of other people?

By that logic, would pro-China people would support China going to war with and taking over other countries if it brought them "economic well-being"?

(edited to make the last statement more clearly a question since it's something I'm genuinely curious about.)

>But how do they justify this when their personal economic well-being requires trampling the freedom of other people?

There are 3 great evils in China: terrorism, separatism and extremism. HK/Tibet/XinJiang/Taiwan are not economic issues but security ones. People balance prosperity for security everywhere. The west sees HK as a large pro democracy movement, the Chinese see's this as fringe separatist violence by 0.001% of the population. They see HK as Chinese alt-right getting bold undermining domestic serenity: disenfranchised, social media savvy, economically anxious youth who see their culture being displaced and their privileged being eroded by mainland immigrants. They're acting accordingly.

In what way does pretending Taiwan does not exist improve China's security?

The physical island is a huge geopolitical asset or security risk. See island chain strategy. Also look up elevation map of Taiwan + Taiwan straight. Chinese coast is very shallow and hard to hide Chinese subs, whereas east Taiwan drops straight into deep water which enables China to hide subs which is important in controlling regional waters against US Navy. Regardless, the Chinese military planning certainly doesn't pretend the land isn't there. The government (from both sides) just doesn't recognize each others sovereignty.

China does not occupy Taiwan, so those points are moot.

What security interest is served by censoring discussion of the existence of Taiwan?

This is a political issue, not a security issue.

It's both. Politics is a huge part, reunification is #1 CPC policy consideration since founding and her entire legitimacy rests on it. Occupation goal is by 2050. No one is censoring discussion of Taiwan? If you're talking flag emoji that's equivalent to banning confederate flag in Chinese context. People talk about Taiwan in China all the time but under context of reunification. On refusing sovereignty claims. If Taiwan was sovereign they would be free to host US bases which challenges Chinese security, particularly shipping lanes where China imports oil. China is not energy secure. Taiwan has been a Chinese "redline" for many reasons.

I like to compare it with the Cuban Missile Crisis. Imagine having that Soviet (in this case US) power projection so close to home.

> If Taiwan was sovereign they would be free to host US bases

Taiwan is clearly sovereign, anyone saying otherwise is ignoring reality or avoiding offending China.

The US had military bases in Taiwan for 20 years, the military bases were removed to assist with normalizing relations with China.

I can absolutely see why insisting that the US not place military bases on Taiwan is a security concern, but this has nothing to do with the sovereignty of Taiwan. (Similar to US concerns about Russian military installationa in Cuba which were unrelated to Cuba's sovereignty.)

The institutional double-speak around the sovereignty of Taiwan is purely political and has no impact on actual security issues.

How do Taiwanese companies do business in China?

"Hello, I am the CEO of a company located in a fully autonomous province that does not pay taxes to the PRC?"

> But how do they justify this when their personal economic well-being requires trampling the freedom of other people?

The same way every one in every other country on earth deals with the awful things their country does I guess. By ignoring it.

> By that logic, would pro-China people would support China going to war with and taking over other countries if it brought them "economic well-being"?

Looking at world history probably?

The same thing happens with the US: despite the problems that (most of) the rest of the world has with its government, the US citizens are very much supportive of their government.

To paraphrase your last statement, as long as the US can manage to not destroy their economy completely, the US public will by and large support the government.

I would say that most Americans are actually very angry about the US government.

Not in my experience.

Most Americans are angry about the president or some senator. Medicare? FBI? The US Navy / Air Force / Army? The police? Most Americans love those. (When did you last see a group of people asking for the disbanding of the FBI? Heck, for the disbanding of the IRS even.)

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