Microsoft announces dual-screen Surface Neo | Hacker News Reader

Microsoft announces dual-screen Surface Neo

theverge.com

146 pointsaminecodes41 comments

This is really clever design, and I like how they've incorporated the keyboard, giving you the freedom of the configuration. I just wish I could have a different OS underneath it all.

I really think the trick is not to try to hide the hinge, but to use it as a demarcator as seen here.

The addition of the keyboard is genius.

This feels like a very well thought out product. I might end up buying one of the full surface laptops + Duo because of my work flow. But, damn I would have loved to own one of these.

disclaimer: work for MSFT

Yeah, this looks really nice. Probably also gonna stick with my laptop for now, but I could see this being amazing for note taking. I could really see this taking off at my school.

This looks like super cool hardware. The hinge in particular!

I think hardware and software made by the same company can have big advantages.

For me personally, I don't really see much use case for something this size the same way I don't see much use case for an iPad. If I have a lot to do, I'll use my laptop. If it's something quick, I'll use my phone. I don't have much need for an in between currently. I'm sure there are use cases for this that I haven't thought about, though.

And not to say I wouldn't want one, looks great!

EDIT: As a phone replacement (new product video for Surface Duo just shown), this is even more interesting!

Microsoft have been working on this for more than seven years, and it looks exciting.

> For me personally, I don't really see much use case for something this size the same way I don't see much use case for an iPad. If I have a lot to do, I'll use my laptop. If it's something quick, I'll use my phone. I don't have much need for an in between currently. I'm sure there are use cases for this that I haven't thought about, though.

As somebody who has tons of textbooks in PDF form, the ability to use something like this (or the iPad Pro, which I currently own) for reading, annotating and otherwise working with them is pretty damn useful. I'm especially excited about the Duo, since PDF's are unreadable on even my 6.5" smartphone and I don't always want to bring my iPad with me everywhere.

When the Courier concept was first shown, I almost couldn't contain my excitement.

Now, ten years later, it feels like most challenges the Courier (and now the Surface Neo) tried to solve have been solved by bigger screens, better multitasking and great pencil support.

New note taking and productivity apps benefit from the big screen and fluid resizing of apps that the iPad Pro and similar tablets provide.

The separation in the middle that made the courier look awesome ten years ago, now feels like an unnecessary hardware separation between the two sides of the display.

It seems like the Nintendo DS worked because every single piece of software for it was written to use both screens effectively. With this, I can't imagine there will be hardly any software ever written for it specifically to use two screens, except maybe some first party stuff at launch.

I'm also worried about use on the go. When you're holding it in your hands, a folding device is a pain to use. If there was some reason you couldn't have a single large screen maybe ok, but as you say this is a solved problem.

YUP. This will end up like all the other Surfaces of the past... It will just get used like a regular laptop, docked to external peripherals 99% of the time. It will run Word, Outlook and Edge, and be locked down so the user can't do anything new or interesting with it. I doubt that the majority of Microsoft's own applications will even be optimized for this configuration.

I'd buy a Courier as shown in that video right now, and all it is is a OneNote appliance.

I love the idea of being able to write new form-factor-sensitive apps as needed for a tiled window manager that resizes to accomodate a keyboard, or a ZUI on one screen, CLI on the other, or the traditional browser in one screen, terminal and VS in the other.

IFF they don't lock this down so much with Windows Lite/Windows 10 X (apparently 10 is now glued to the word Windows no matter what), Centaurus / Surface Neo has the potential to be an excellent device.

Edit: and am I glad it wasn't cancelled, not sure if I want to handle another Booklet PC being cancelled on me after getting excited about it.

Panos' announcement was hilarious. Announcing it 1.5 years before release though...

I think this is a smart strategy. They're trying to involve developers as early as possible to avoid repeating the Windows mobile mistakes. It'll also allow them to collect feedback and adjust the product before launching it. This will give it a greater chance of success.

Is there any info what they offer for developers? A simulator?

If it's supposed to sell for the 2020 holidays, it would probably be released by October 2020 or so, so it's more like 12-13 months. Still seems like a rather long lead time.

I recently bought the Note10+ and really like the pen functionality except for the fact that the screen is a little too narrow for any serious writing. I really like the idea of a A5 size screen for hand writing. I'm a heavy onenote user and would be very interested in the Neo if its priced right

"Partnering with Google" - Be very interesting to see how deep that goes. The google logo was on the homescreen of the demo device...

This device (Surface Neo) does not have a partnership with Google. It's a Microsoft device running a flavor of Windows.

The other device they announced (Surface Duo) is Microsoft hardware running Google software (Android).

Makes sense, as it's really the only way to get into the phone market and still have an app ecosystem.

its a very Microsoft thing to do to name a Microsoft product built on (aka extending) a Google product after a different unrelated Google Product.

If my friend has a Microsoft Surface Duo and I say "open your Duo" do I mean to unfold the phone, or open the google video calling app?

Somebody is actually using Duo the chat outside Google?

I recently started using it. It's nice because it comes with E2E encryption and is usable on desktop. Alternatives all have various limitations: Skype (no E2E encryption), Signal (no calls on PCs), iMessage (only usable for Apple users), Wire (requires additional program installation and account creation).

I haven't used the desktop Signal app, but there appears to be one:

https://signal.org/download/

Yes, Signal and WhatsApp both have desktop apps, but they're only for text chat, neither do voice calls like their mobile counterparts.

# of users of Duo calling app is small and tending to zero. It is laughable to think that MS would name it Duo for this negligible benefit.

I didn't mean it as a benefit, more an ineptitude. They always name things with names already in use

Will be interesting to see Microsoft return to the smart phone market. Satya Nadella's organization is much more geared towards catering products towards their demand signal instead of repeating Ballmer's blunder of always acquiescing to the Windows fiefdom.

Microsoft is a software company first, and is supposed to only be in hardware for "aspirational" reasons. It doesn't seem clear what the Duo will encourage (Android) OEMs to "aspire" to, and at least from the announcements so far doesn't seem to give much reason for software innovations either. As a return to the smart phone market, it is hugely underwhelming for Microsoft's stated goals.

CNET's two-part series on Courier:

https://www.cnet.com/news/the-inside-story-of-how-microsoft-...

https://www.cnet.com/news/how-windows-8-kod-the-innovative-c...

Here [1] is the original concept video for the Courier. I remember it generated a ton of hype when that video came out.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmIgNfp-MdI

This is huge... but the biggest thing remains if the Windows platform will be ready to meet this hardware. It's painfully obvious that Andromeda and Centaurus and all this hardware has been there and solid, but that Windows' true universal platform structure hasn't been good enough to meet it.

Presumably why fast-track Windows Insiders have been testing 20H1 for months already, if most of the platform guts have to go out in 20H1 for these devices to meet shipping goals.

20H1 of Windows 10 is essentially a different operating system than Windows 10X. My understanding is that the 20H1 focus is around standardizing what's running on Azure with what's running on desktops.

I think it behooves Microsoft today to brand 10X as a "different operating system", but it's not like it is an entirely independent fork. Some of the same "OneCore" improvements Azure needs on the one side are likely what 10X needs, so 20H1 can be (and probably is) for testing both. Microsoft can test two things.

This is fantastic. I've always found it cumbersome to write on onenote and have a browser / PDF reader open simultaneously. Split screen doesn't really work, especially in landscape mode.

Might finally be able to drop the paper notebook in my backpack if they can make screen larger on this one.

I wonder if this will take off. People are Very entrenched in traditional laptop world, so this seems essentially useless for corporate settings.

This looks more like a device to take notes on in meetings rather than replace a work laptop or desktop.

So, limited use case, no specialty, and overlaps almost completely with a tablet.

Nice -- but I want two 15" screens, not 9", and set it down as two 15" portrait monitors for code editing, etc.

I counted 5 seconds from flipping keyboard until all screens rearrange and complete rendering

Hardware aside, I’m not a fan of the delivery. The presenter comes across as fake humble and insincere.

Oh neat, a Dock.

Amazing hardware, looks well thought out. Would never buy it with Windows OS though - I have a Surface for work with Windows 10 Pro and it's invasive crappy nagware.

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