My OpenStreetMap Workflow: Mapping the Village of Marmari, Evia | Hacker News Reader

My OpenStreetMap Workflow: Mapping the Village of Marmari, Evia

code.mendhak.com

168 pointspolitelemon40 comments

I used to walk around taking pictures and memorizing some key points to later upload the data from JOSM, but it was very time-consuming and a lot of time was spent matching the aerial view with my street-level pictures.

So I started trying to use Vespucci from my Android, but it's interface is really sophisticated and not ideal for "lightweight" work, such as adding POIs (when the streets, paths and shapes are already in place).

I also liked a lot Street Complete, but it does not allow _adding_ new POIs, just completing existing ones.

Finally, a Frenchman developed OSM Go! (https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=fr.dogeo.osmgo..., open source on Github, but not yet available on F-Droid), which is the sweet spot for me: not as powerful as Vespucci, but much easier to use for adding/updating POIs. It has recently been translated into English, and though the UI is not perfect, it greatly improved the ease of contribution.

So now I am much more inclined to, when walking around somewhere with incomplete mapping, simply stop for a few seconds, add some missing data (wheelchair accessibility, opening hours, or a minor POI such as drinking water or even trash basket), and keep on walking. No extra homework required!

The amount of effort the community devotes to such apps and to OSM in general is incredible and contagious!

Thank you for the OSM Go! Tip.

N.b., it's the stated policy of OpenStreetMap to not take information from Google... not primarily out of zealotry, but because Google's terms of service conflict with the ODBL license, and they don't want the organisation in legal trouble.

Normally this means no copying from Google Maps or Google's satellite or street-level imagery. (It also means no using Google's geocoding API if you have addresses that you want to add, but don't know where they should be added -- low-budget SEO companies tend to do this a lot.)

Using Google Translate -- and not even to translate, but just as a way to get copy-pastable handwriting recognition -- is a greyer area, but I probably would still recommend avoiding it. But nor do I know of any free alternatives offhand.

> Normally this means no copying from Google Maps or Google's satellite or street-level imagery.

Just to note for general use that the standard web-editor for OSM pulls in Bing satellite imagery. So one can use satellite imagery without having to rely on Google or risk that type of legal issue.

There's several different satellite/aerial mosaics available. They often differ in resolution and freshness, so it pays to check which one best matches what you are trying to map.

Maxar (formerly DigitalGlobe), Mapbox and ESRI are additional global layers, and in many places there are local imagery sources that can be both the highest quality and the freshest.

Also, in my experience address locations on Google Maps are often very inaccurate, so it's not even a good source.

I recently attended the State of the Map conference (OSM's annual, global conference), and that inspired me to start improving the map around my area. I discovered a lot of small details I assumed would have already been mapped. There's a lot left to do, even in a fairly well-covered area of the world.

This helped me plan better for when I go out mapping—all of the apps are slightly wonky to use, so you have to develop your own custom flow to be efficient.

Out of curiosity, what type of feature are often left to improve?

I've been mapping my area as there was quite some drastic changes to my local park, but aside form that and the occasional post box I struggle to find meaningful edits.

Granted I live in London so it's fairly populous.

You might know this already but the app (Android only I believe) StreetComplete (https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/StreetComplete) can be used as a low-effort way to fulfill minor improvement quests in your area.

I’m focusing on a few elements to get started (other than a few old paths and trails that were not mapped):

- street lighting (helpful for people trying to make global maps of safer streets for walking at night)

- small features: benches, trash bins, dog waste disposal bins

- stores and shops with as much information as possible (opening hours, contact information, etc.)

Once I’ve finished those (there’s a lot left to do, so I expect it to take a few months), I’m not sure what I’ll do next.

If you are looking to contribute meaningful edits beyond your local area, the Humanitarian OpenStreetMap Tasking Manager always has things to do that can help folks working in areas affected by natural disasters: https://tasks.hotosm.org/contribute

In my area at least, I've found that even where the road networks are complete there are usually a lot of things that can be done to aid navigation. Some examples:

Walking: Tag roads for sidewalks, add footpaths and crosswalks.

Cycling: Tag roads for bike lanes, add bike paths.

Driving: Tag roads for turn lanes, and tag intersections for turn restrictions.

And of course POIs are always missing or need updating or additional info.

Out of curiosity, what type of feature are often left to improve?

I do a lot of geodata analysis where building footprints are important and there are a ton of buildings missing once you get outside the main city centers. Even just 15 minute drive into the suburbs from where I live and you go from every building mapped to less than 20% of buildings mapped.

There is an app for you :)

StreetComplete will suggest things around you that needs to be completed. Perfect for getting started.

I've added a couple of (non-clinical) buildings to my local hospital in London. I've also added some department locations. Tempted to say that counts as meaningful but the low-tech solution of good signage is, IMO, the best way to help people get around the place.

I've done some light editing on OSM and i was surprised by how usable the default web editor is. Uploading GPX tracks and editing them on the map is pretty easy as well. Can recommend to anyone who is even slightly interested in contributing: just start and add a couple of easy points of interest like trashcans, cafes, etcetera.

Thanks for the kind words! I'm one of the maintainers, and we are always eager to hear what new users think of it.

I recently started adding Points of Interest to OSM using OsmAnd during my holidays, and the biggest obstacle for me was the number of available categories. The list is huge! I haven't started tracking my GPS position full-time because I was afraid of draining the battery.

Yep, there's lots of options. And then the OpenStreetMap tagging isn't really capturing exactly what stores do in all that much detail.

Hopefully OSMAnd eventually implements the Name Suggestion Index, which was built mostly for the online editor (iD). It suggests how to tag brands, so you can map quite a few POIs just by putting in the name.

https://nsi.guide/

It's always impressive to me that OSM has (or at least exposes) better off road walking data than Google does.

I was very surprised by Google becoming aware of some hiking paths, but I sure would have been pissed if I was sent there in a suit and dress shoes... Walk-able covers a lot of different realities.

I was recently walking on Kinder Scout in the Peak District (UK) and was surprised and quite alarmed to find people up there following Google maps. Many of the "paths" are really just public rights of way, which in Great Britain means you have a right of passage, not that it is necessarily easy or possible in all weathers. One of these goes straight across a bog on top of the plateau with no sign of path in sight.

I suspect all of these "paths" are automated additions to their map, but without the proper accompanying information it is quite irresponsible to show these.

OpenStreetMap has the same problem from time to time. People want to add technical hiking/climbing routes but don't mark them very well and they show up without any differentiation from other trails in various OSM based maps.

Some of us can’t help it.

More than decade ago, I was completely addicted to adding Bay Area trails to OSM. It was a complete greenfield, and incredibly satisfying to see the map of your favorite mountain bike park fill up with trails. (Henry Coe Park is huge!)

There isn’t much to be done anymore locally: somebody even walked all streets of Sunnyvale to annotate the houses with their street number!

But when I hike in a far away place that has unmapped trails, the GPS comes out and the hike becomes a mapping expedition.

Not only that, but he OSM maps of the White Mountains in New Hampshire, USA have trails that the official maps don't have.

Why? Google is a low-quality road map for cars. They don't put much effort into walking. In the OSM community Google is considering a very low bar. We aim to meet or exceed the quality of mapping like Ordnance Survey.

I take the parent comment to mean it's impressive that a community project outperforms one backed by a multi-billion dollar company - i.e. it's a compliment.

Yep! The multi-billion dollar company doesn't see a commerical reason to get good at walking details. Cars are more profitable. So they don't put effort into it.

A goal of OSM is to map _what we want mapped_, not what makes commercial sense to map.

Which is also a reason you'll find rural areas mapped really well in OSM and not at all in Google Maps: Why invest in a place where you cannot run advertisements?

I'm not saying OSM is more complete than Google maps, just that the incentives are different and therefore the coverage is different.

I agree. Both OSM and Sygic are way better navigation apps than Google Maps, even more so if you don't have internet connectivity.

Aside from the altruistic utility, this seems like a great way to get to know a new place in a certain kind of deep detail, in the same way i find that taking a photo of something makes me really look at it.

I am starting getting used to mapping right now and I got much value out of this post. Ty!

Obligatory link to StreetComplete: https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete

The easiest way to fill holes in your neighbourhood. No further tools or knowledge needed.

I never really thought about contributing to OSM but after seeing this comment I downloaded the app. I just spent an hour answering questions about my neighborhood and it was quite fun.

I have some amount of work related travel, since I've found the app, I learned new corners of the cities I travel to.

Spread the word! :)

This is EXACTLY what I've been looking for. Would be great if this was on iOS too.

It doesn't look like it will happen anytime soon:

https://github.com/westnordost/StreetComplete/issues/43

This is from 2017.

It's interesting to see that Google translate will not stay within the Greek alphabet in a single word and will try to insert the closest matching letter from another alphabet. In your example, it matched "ΡΕΓΓΟYKOY" to "ΡΕΓΓΟVKOV", even though there is no letter V in the Greek alphabet.

Is that what that says? That road sign tripped me up so much, since it definitely looks like a "V" to me (the uppercase ypsilon looks nothing like a V).

This is a fantastic intro to OSM. As someone who's been wanting to do this for my own village, this post gives me everything I wanted to know, and props to the author for doing all of this without being able to read the language at all.

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