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Comment by shusson | Hacker News Reader

> Rather than blaming a greater system of patriarchy and white supremacy for these double standards, under which we all suffer, he blamed feminists like me.

I can't help but feel that even through a tragedy, the author still hasn't budged from her side of views.

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In what direction do you think she needs to budge? Does she need to admit that women do, in fact, prefer assholes? Or that the domestic violence she suffered was her fault?

> Does she need to admit that women do, in fact, prefer assholes? Or that the domestic violence she suffered was her fault?

no and no.

> In what direction do you think she needs to budge

One in which the author does not assume her brother should blame a greater system of patriarchy and white supremacy.

The article is obviously subjective but the statistics show that racism exists and the correlation between height and your salary/job.

What does that have to do with what the parent is saying?

Did I interpreted the parent wrong? How did you interpret it?

He said "One in which the author does not assume her brother should blame a greater system of patriarchy and white supremacy."

My interpretation was that the person was not affected by the racism or the society norms and the author is wrong, I pointed out that her stories about the racism and the rest are confirmed by statistics, so I am not sure why the OP is so sure that the author is wrong, does he have more information?

Yes the article is subjective and the author can be wrong but a random guy wants to disprove the author because his political views disagree with the author.

But her emphasizing with his point would logically only lead her to put further (even all) blame for his death on him, and wouldn't result in writing more "balanced" or wise but simply spiteful and patronizing, which I think this does a good job avoiding.

Where do you think his insecurity about his physical appearance might otherwise come from?

People within their group or even people of the majority pop in near homogenous countries still have all kinds of insecurities. If those people grew up in other societies outside their group they may or may not have different insecurities, but we can’t know.

Interestingly the USSR used to be known for limb lengthening surgery, although I heard it was very much in a Soviet tradition.

Just to clarify this position, do you believe that insecurity about physical appearance is the result of patriarchy and not a hundred thousand year genetic predisposition to find desirable mating partners for survival?

I'm insecure about my looks because I'm happier when I see attractive people and I know I can't give other people that happiness.

> result of patriarchy and not a hundred thousand year genetic predisposition to find desirable mating partners for survival?

What makes you think these two can be cleanly separated?

I believe that's my position. If the social structure of humanity is based on genetic necessity, I wouldn't think to frame it as any one group of individuals making decisions that harm others.

I think people in these discussions over-assume that patriarchal is consciously intentional. So we're confusedly agreeing?

> The social structure that results is emergent, not designed.

... yes, and the undesigned structure that has emerged we are labelling "patriarchy".

> the social structure of humanity is based on genetic necessity

... requires a lot more unpacking. Is this asserting that culture doesn't exist and material conditions are irrelevant? All behaviour is only genetic? I don't think that's what you're claiming, but I can't parse it otherwise.

> So we're confusedly agreeing?

Definitely. It feels like there's a difference in our interpretation of the context of the word "patriarchy". I have most often heard it used as a condemnation of a group of individuals who are also disadvantaged by the social structure. Similar to the way "idealism" is commonly used to disparage positive future thinking.

I would sure rather a society where no one has to feel like they're in a fight for survival where the only way to win is someone else losing.

The same sorta pattern repeats a lot. Even a lot of quite toxic MRA stuff is basically dudes redescovering core feminist concepts but then not seeing the forest for the trees.

Patriarchy hurts men too!

I don't think he is insecure. The author admits that she barely talked to him during the time he wanted the surgery. It seems equally likely that he was secure while wanting the height extensions to get a leg up in life. You don't have to be insecure to want something better for yourself.

You think her summary of their differences is charitable?

I'd hope that this isn't going to become the story, but .. is she wrong?

I don't know, and I don't think which side is right is really important. More that I felt that neither side compromised even through tragedy (just basing it from this article).

I'm not sure there's an inherent value in compromise.

I certainly see value in a greater understanding of the alternative perspective, but not in accepting it if you disagree.

> I don't think which side is right is really important

Sometimes one side is just right. Compromise isn't always appropriate.

Consider that she is a senior reporter at Jezebel

I think it adds to the existential devastation of the story...

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