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Comment by josefresco | Hacker News Reader

A month ago my wife and I passed a business while on vacation to a location we frequent. She remarked "oh it looks like they closed down, that's too bad" Upon closer inspection there were in fact open, the two employees present had parked in the back, leaving a completely empty front parking lot.

The parking location is not all to blame, but at the time I remarked "the employees should really park out front to help it appears as though there are customers".

Obviously if your lot is frequently full this isn't an issue. This was in a rural location where most likely that never happens as it was a large lot, and not a business that would see surges of customers.

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It might even be an effective strategy to add a few extra cars to your parking lot, so it always has at least a moderate number.

When I worked at a mall food court, I noticed something interesting: during slower periods, sometimes one restaurant would have a line while other restaurants would have no customers at all. And not always the same restaurant. I attributed it to customers seeing that one place had customers, then inferring that it must be open and it must be one of the better places to eat.

Popularity isn't a very reliable indicator of quality, but it's not totally invalid either. If a place is always deserted, it's probably not very good. If it's always busy, it's likely that people are willing to wait for a reason.

Back when I used to tend open bars, I’d do something I called “priming the tip jar.” Throw a five and some ones in and folks seemed to be more willing to tip. Probably mostly because it didn’t just look like an empty glass sitting right-side up–it made it obvious it was a tip jar without having to put a tacky “Tips” sign on it.

Buskers do the same, priming their hat or tin or whatever to show what they feel an appropriate donation would be. They also regularly ‘groom’ their donations so as to not look too successful.

What do you suppose someone is doing when they have a box for "donate to save the animals" or similar, and they never empty it even though it is stuffed full of money? Some sort of manipulation that escapes me, or something counterproductive? I noticed today that they put a piggy bank on top.

Some of those boxes are placed and maintained by the charity, not the owner of the location. So if the charity hasn't been back to empty it for a while, it might fill up. I doubt it's deliberate.

That's rare. Usually it's actually just that the charity is selling "ad space" and the venue keeps the donations in exchange for paying a fee to the charity. It's a weird system.

Ha, I used to do the same thing when I drove an airport shuttle for a hotel while I was a bellman. Thanks for stirring up a crazy memory!

Ha, I used to do the same as a child when I took part in the yearly charity run. I had to ask everyone in the street to contribute either a fixed amount or an amount per lap - so I made sure to get my parents to sign up for a (relatively high) per round amount as my first sign-ups, then hope the next ones to take part would do the same.

Reminds me of a time I was searching for parking in downtown Washington, DC. Block after block was full. I eventually came to a street that had no cars parked at all. Jackpot, right? Must be some obscure rule prohibiting parking there. I kept looking. Still no luck, so I finally went back to the empty street. I carefully studied the signs and concluded that it was legal to park there. I got out of my car and paid. By the time I was done paying, the entire block was full of parked cars!

That happens in SF all the time. People will see a temporary no parking sign and drive on by. Half the time, if you read it, it’s either not in effect yet or has already expired.

If there are no cars there, people assume others confirmed you can’t park there!

Or you come back to your car and the tyres are missing, or it's been towed because of street sweeping/snow ploughing...

This is like the old adage. "If you truly believe in market efficiency, you would never bother to bend over to pick up a $100 bill because if it were real, someone else would have picked it up already!"

Except the market is very inefficient, blind, and poorly guided. It’s just always better than a central government.

Except sometimes you’re wrong and the market is right.

I've noticed the same thing... "A crowd attracts a crowd"

Popularity isn't a very reliable indicator of quality

Yeah, after trying the most popular Mexican restaurant in Gainesville, FL I can only agree.

As a student I worked in a restaurant briefly. The manager drilled into us that the the front should be full, maybe with one gap and the back should be cleared ASAP.

I see that a lot - and have the same behaviour, in that I'm less likely to go to a restaurant or pub when it has no visitors, that seems to give a subtle signal that they're not really good.

What I guess you could do as a business owner is wear plainclothes / take off the apron and have a coffee with your own staff. Mind you it'll look quite obvious in a lot of cases due to the staff wearing e.g. aprons or other accessories that infer they're staff.

But giving away some free coffee or something just to break the ice (or 'prime' as another commenter called it) will be a good strategy as well. It requires a bit of pushing which some people will find annoying but still, it'll be worth it.

I must have less faith in humanity because I always gravitate to the quiet place.

Then later on I find it has gone out of business...

I gave this advice to my local Subway, which was open at 7am for breakfast but everything else in their little strip-mall opened later. The place looked deserted, and I was often the only customer.

"Park in front in the morning, then move to the back before lunch, it'll make the place look busy"

From that week forward, there were often other customers when I stopped in for breakfast. Manager said breakfast business had easily doubled. I got a bunch of free subs out of that deal. ;)

Yeah, this article goes a bit overboard.

There is a balance with small businesses of helping let people know you're in and available, and giving them prime parking.

You park within distance of the building and visible, but not directly outside if possible.

I've actually recieved calls about whether I'm open today, because my car is in the shop and thus the parking lot is vacant.

I think the real point it's making isn't about the parking, it's the countless little things that business owners do that add friction to the customer transactions.

Something as simple as not parking right in front might not make a huge difference, but that mindset, compounded over months and years, will.

In terms of really literally interpreting this article... please do make sure not to park (or allow to be parked) really shifty cars in your lot. If a car has dust on it so deep that a passing leaf leaves its story on it then the lot gets a sketchy feeling.

Also, psychology is weird... if there are a bunch of spots near to your business pick one reasonably close but always leave the best one for customers - if there are cars parked close to the entrance but the best spot is open then customers will walk in with a bit of a buzzing high from managing to nab the primo spot. Aaaand if there is a tree that drops crap during spring/fall, park under it so no customer gets stuck with sap on their car since that can colour their entire interaction.

Isn't psychology fun!

I worked in an auto shop and we would frequently park our own cars in the bays when we were empty for this reason and/or to appear more popular.

Having the lights on and a few cars out front to let customers know this is a safe location is definitely important in a lot of businesses. This article seems to want to make a point about subscription cancellation instead, though.

Great point! Sort of like the club line. If you run a dance club you want a line of people out front to show that place is hopping.

Also hire some luxury/super cars to park out front (this actually happens in china).

That happens in San Jose also! (Santana Row)

Santana Row is fascinating. It looks to me like it was manufactured to please the "traditional" rich crowd. The people going there are very distinct than the typical engineers of Silicon Valley.

That's why the trick of parking a nice car on a street wouldn't work in SF, Palo Alto or Mountain View.

There isn’t a lot of traditional rich in San Jose, they mostly hang in Atherton through Palo Alto, and then in the city and north bay. Santana row attracts (or did 15 years ago) a lot of Chinese and Indians, but they are mostly new rich.

In Thailand they have supercar/superbike parkings outside malls.

That's what corner stores in Berlin do, it's mostly related to their not-so-stealthy money laundering activities though.

Nutella Cafe tried to pull the same thing when they opened their first location in Chicago, and would stop taking orders until the line built up out the door again. I'm guessing the strategy (rightfully) backfired, as the cafe looks generally empty these days.

Lines are great for hype, but don't try to artificially create them at the cost of customer experience.

I was interning in Chicago when they first opened. I remember looking at the menu and it was so thoroughly boring (i.e. normal bakery/diner goods, but made with Nutella) that I didn't even consider going there.

It always blew my mind how long the line was when I walked by. It had to be just tourists who were willing to wait in that long of a line just for the novelty of being able to say they've been inside an official, Nutella-branded store.

Former VIP host here. The club line isn't really for advertising. Paying people to stand in lines at clubs hasn't been an effective strategy since the 80's maybe.

Now the line is a (punishment + holding cell) for dudes who have to buy their way out of the line by opting for bottle service.

Ideally for the club it moves just fast enough that the patrons in line don't give up and go somewhere else.

Are you saying at any point in time someone in line can indicate to the bouncer they will buy bottle service and enter immediately? That sounds highly improbable...

Clubs in my city don't pay people to stand in line either, you either reserve your group in the guest book or didn't and are waiting longer for an "opening". Some clubs are at legal capacity and a line builds up but mostly they frisk everyone and ask for ID which takes a while and causes a line to form, which also benefits the club as a sort of popularity advertisement to others on the street.

Yes that is what I am saying. No one waits in line outside when they could be inside spending thousands of dollars.

The line is for low value customers only.

That's like the restaurant trick to always seat the few customers by the window so it looks like a thriving and popular business.

Also because customers prefer to sit by the window?

In a world of Ubers and Self-driving cars, are cars in a lot a great indicator of popularity? What kind of visual indicators from afar can a business put out? It may be more of a future question.

Am I missing something obvious, but can’t the perception of being open be solved by having bright shop lights next to your store window?

The back of the lot is usually where the shade is.

Except on the other side of the road.

Exactly. This guy is wrong and you are right.

If there's tons of customers lining up each morning at opening, sure, park elsewhere. Otherwise the owner should definitely take the best space to show someone is there.

Empty parking lots are more common than full. Empty means there's nothing there.

Most lots have multiple rows. Staff should park next to the road to be seen, and let the customers park next to the building to destroy their health.

> Empty parking lots are more common than full

That’s not been my experience in most major cities I’ve lived and traveled in.

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