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Comment by mmsimanga | Hacker News Reader

I appreciate the attempt to bring another side to the debate but the point you are missing is that it is us black Africans who are being critical of Mugabe. We all experienced the oppression by the Rhodesian government. It his actions against fellow blacks after "liberation" that we are criticizing. He presided over the murder of 20 000 people[0]. A leader who presides over record inflation no matter the excuse has failed and should step down to give someone else a chance. He had to be removed through a coup as he was preparing to hand over the country to his wife.

[0]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gukurahundi

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It's tiring how any attempt to contextualize why some people like Mugabe (which I don't! I repeatedly criticize him in my comment!) needs to be represented as saying that he's not deserving of criticism or that the only people criticizing him are white imperialists. Yes, he did plenty of bad things, but someone who has only read a caricature of him will ultimately be flummoxed when they meet a fan of his.

If you've had many encounters with Zimbabweans, you've run into people who do think he is a hero. This would be perplexing to the average HNer who has only read (accurate!) stories of authoritarianism, human rights violations, and hyperinflation.

Makes me want to compare and contrast Mugabe with Idi Amin.

I understand the point you are making in this comment. The fervent support for Mugabe can be confusing. TO expand on your answer and to inform HN crowd here are some I think people support Mugabe.

1. Once a hero, always a hero. Africans struggle to turn on liberation movement leaders. We feel we owe them our freedom. For some people, liberation movement leaders can never do anything wrong. This leads to my point two.

2. Some families have always associated themselves with liberation movements. It maybe the father joined the party or a son, sister, cousin joined the party a long time ago and family feels obligated to support the party

3. Mugabe was gifted speaker who tapped into the anti imperialist/colonialist sentiment in Africa. He is loved by many Africans because he dared publicly speak out against the West. He always loved Europe until they put sanctions on him and then he turned towards the East.

4. Mugabe ran on a tribal ticket. You will find more supporters in certain tribes than in others.

The biggest reason he is still popular today is because of his anti West rhetoric. Which is a pity but to each their own. I hope this sheds some light to an HNer who encounters Africans who think the world of Mugabe.

The Westerners may well be aware of Mugabe's end of colonization. But, someone who has murdered is called a murderer. And should be treated as such. Stalin stopped Hitler and industrialized Russia, but he's a murderer. Lots of people in Russia adore him, and though I know full well why, I've never had anyone explain to me why that is. But we have here an African who killed Africans, so we are supposed to see the other side more clearly. Are the murdered Africans supposed to count less heavily on our conscience?

I totally get where you are coming from and I agree with you. I also see the point the parent comment was trying to make. If you meet 10 Zimbabweans you likely to find a few who adore Mugabe. The comment was just to inform those not so familiar with Zimbabwean politics and history. He is still a murderer but sadly there are fellow Africans some very close to me who only see the liberation hero. I just think it is important to understand where the other side is coming from. I strongly disagree and think some of the opinions are based on willfully ignoring facts but it is the world we live in.

Many Americans aren’t constitutionally capable of criticizing countries that aren’t America.

? Iraq and Afghanistan seem pretty criticized to me.

I think rayiner was speaking of the "many" Americans who complain about America constantly, but know nothing else well enough to really compare.

Which is probably sensible: for most people, criticism of their own country is the only kind of criticism that can be put into action. It's productive in a way that kibbitzing over Zimbabwe isn't.

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