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Comment by auiya | Hacker News Reader

It doesn't mean the list is going away, it just means people proven to be US citizens will be expunged (rightfully so). Anyone NOT proven to be US citizens (and located outside the US), and thus not protected by US Constitutional rights will likely remain on the list.

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I've commented on this before. It's a myth that the US constitution only protects citizens.

The constitution explicitly delineates between rules that apply to "people" and rules that apply to "citizens." Some rights apply to one group and some both.

From the article:

'A federal judge ruled on Wednesday that a federal government database that compiles people deemed to be “known or suspected terrorists” violates the rights of American citizens who are on the watchlist'

Pro tip: the best constitutional workaround is non-enforcement.

Non-citizens are not excluded from the U.S. Constitution or the Bill of Rights; for example, protections around criminal prosecution (the Fifth Amendment) apply to anyone in the U.S., whatever their citizenship. Non-citizen residents also get representation in Congress.

You are correct, edited to include foreign-based establishment.

>Non-citizen residents also get representation in Congress.

This creates bad incentives. Why would we allow foreigners to influence congress?

Because they live in the US, and therefore by law should have representation. (Note that they still can't vote, so the influence is limited.)

Permanent residency is very much a thing allowed by law. Dismissing them as foreigners is a bit harsh, when some of them have been in the US longer (and legally) than anywhere else in their lives.

>Note that they still can't vote

Isn't that contradictory? Why not require them to be a member of the club to influence the club?

>when some of them have been in the US longer (and legally) than anywhere else in their lives

And not electing to become a citizen.

You don't just 'elect to become a citizen'

Many would happily become citizens but can't because they're not here legally. That's the WHOLE thing the Dreamers group is, they've been here living for most of their lives but were brought here as children but they they can't become a citizen without leaving and waiting 10 or so years to start over from square one.

Sometimes it's not possible. For example an India does not allow dual citizenship, to become US citizen they would have to give up their citizenship. If your extended family and friend live in India, that might not be an option. Furthermore, for Greek citizens it is absolutely impossible to get rid of their citizenship. They can burn their passports, commit crime, but they will forever stay a Greek citizen.

As if most Indian citizens living in the US even have an option of getting US citizenship.

There is a 150 year waiting list for someone from India who is here on a work visa to even get a green card much less citizenship.

The fastest route to citizenship for someone from India working here is:

1. Get pregnant

2. Wait nine months for your child to be born in the US

3. Wait 21 more years until they are old enough to sponsor someone for a green card (and don't forget to make sure that their income is high enough to support both themselves and you single-handedly)

4. Wait another year to actually get the green card

5. Wait five more years to qualify for citizenship

They're not foreign if they're living here, working here, going to school here, paying taxes here.

If they are citizens of another country they are by definition foreign.

That's not the definition and also don't forget those with dual citizenships.

Non-citizens are afforded some Constitutional protections. As far as I know, there is a precedent for due process being one of them.

Only while located on US soil (or certain extensions such as US-flagged ships, embassies, military bases, etc...). Outside the US, they're not.

> It doesn't mean the list is going away, it just means people proven to be US citizens will be expunged (rightfully so). Anyone NOT proven to be US citizens (and located outside the US), and thus not protected by US Constitutional rights will likely remain on the list.

You are just making up fake remedies based on fake law: the Constitution does not protect only US citizens, nor has the court decided on a remedy, either the completely ludicrous nonenyou suggest or any other.

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