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bencollier49

Looks like we'll have an election now as a proxy second referendum.

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Corbyn just said he wont allow it (and they need him due to the FTPA) unless they vote for blocking no-deal first.

This is starting to be like one of those trading card games like Magic the Gathering or Pokemon.

Special ability: Prorogue. Interrupt with special session. FTPA.

Boris can allow the blocking bill and still has time to repeal it if he wins the election.

No idea if you follow British politics, but a few years ago the Cons and LibDems went into coalition, and one of the things that was meant to help was the FTPA. Under that the government cannot just call an election, it needs the support of 2/3 of parliament or a vote of no confidence.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fixed-term_Parliaments_Act_201...

They can sidestep that with a simple bill which just says "Notwithstanding the FTPA, there will be an election on date x", passed with a simple majority. Would need to go through the Lords though.

The FTPA was a terrible piece of legislation.

Regardless, the point is that Boris can accede to Corbyn's demands, hold an election, and still leave on Oct 31st. If he wins.

Technically it can pass a short bill that requires just a majority, but it then has to go through lords and is open to amendments https://www.instituteforgovernment.org.uk/explainers/early-e...

Proxy /third/ referendum.

- We had the Brexit referendum.

- We had the EU elections, by which (according to the BBC) pro Brexit parties including the Tories came out overwhelmingly on top.

- We can have an election now as a proxy third referendum.

Honestly, as a former remainer, I'm tired of this. The vote was to Leave, by about 1.5 million people.

People who don't like the result are trying to thwart it and weakening the UK's negotiating position.

If I want to buy your startup, and some MPs decide you must make a deal, I'm going to offer you next to nothing for all your equity.

Don't like that? Well you should have had no deal on the table.

How can they weaken their negotiating position? The UK is already at zero.

If the people really want a no-deal Brexit (which is what they are going to get at the end of October), then they can vote for it.

The US can weaken their negotiating position by having to agree to any deal, as mentioned in the comment you're replying to.

The UK isn't at zero. The EU export to the UK. Surely you know this?

The UK doesn't have any negotiating leverage. It's May's Withdrawal Agreement, or no deal. Boris Johnson is pantomiming negotiations with the EU, but there's no basis on which to negotiate. Surely you know this?

This is true, but the UK has very little leverage to begin with even without no deal of the table. So it's the difference between a bad deal and a worse deal. That's just how it is negotiating with a major power imbalance.

What are you talking about? We're the second biggest contributor to the EU.

UK Trade with EU as a percentage of GDP / EU trade with UK as a percentage of GDP. You were never going to get a favorable deal.

Yes, there was a brexit referendum. In 1975. For some reason, the ERG oligarchs decided they need another one.

Wasn’t there already an election? Can you explain why there is a second proxy referendum and what the two outcomes would be?

I assume it’s Wait for Deal Brexit or Doing It Now Brexit, ya?

I believe the idea here is that people would vote for MPs who are for/against Brexit rather than voting directly for/against Brexit themselves.

In parliamentary democracies there aren't any formal barriers to having elections as often as people feel like it. It's unusual but far from unheard of for countries to have several in a year during difficult times.

There was one over who should carry out the negotiations, the result of which was that the tories lost most of their advantage.

There hasn’t been any election that is close to being about the actual leave conditions, on account of the only concrete deal being written down in spring this year.

There are now a fairly large number of MPs who are no longer aligned to the policies of their party, or who have moved party. An election should shake all of that out.

This, combined with the speaker's constitutional innovations have led to a situation where we have a government which can't govern. Again, an election should sort this (and may allow the removal of an activist speaker as well).

And yes, it will be about voting for a party which matches your preferred strategy. Tory = no deal. Libs = remain. Labour = ??? + radical socialism.

The recent election was an internal party election, similar to the Republican or Democratic National Congress. This is because in a general election in the UK, the Prime Minister is not directly elected by the people - they vote for a party, and the leader of that party can change at any time, which is what happened when Theresa May stepped down.

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