What do you propose they do? Shut down?
But I'm not here expecting that to happen...
Instead I think we should just know that what they are saying and why they are saying it is 100% a cyncial play to make more money at the cost of the environment and people's health, and regulate them as such.
2. juul is bringing millions of new people to tobacco products, not just providing a way for smokers to ease off cigarettes.
this claim is not uncontroversial. they don't cause physical dependence in the way we think of with drugs (ie, no physical withdrawal syndrome), but eating junk food can be an exceptionally difficult habit to break. humans can become addicted to almost anything that gives a moderate to strong immediate reward.
I don't disagree with your broader point though. as long as you are focused on preventing new users rather than making the lives of existing users needlessly difficult, you'll get no argument from me.
2. If Juul offered nicotine from non tobacco sources, would that change things? Calling nicotine tobacco still doesn't make vaping anywhere close to being as deadly as cigarettes.
[1] Lennerz, B., & Lennerz, J. K. (2018). Food addiction, high-glycemic-index carbohydrates, and obesity. Clinical chemistry, 64(1), 64-71.
2. everybody in this thread is conflating nicotine and tobacco, but the difference is moot. the point is health risks and addiction. Whatever is in your vape is an unquantified health risk, and is definitely addictive. We won't know if vape chemicals and usage patterns cause more or less damage than cigarettes until people have been huffing them at scale for 20-30 years at least.
Even if they do cause less damage than cigarettes, how much less is ok? half? a tenth? a one-hundreth?
You ask how much less damage is ok. Half would be great! But it is likely to be more than that. The sun causes more cancer than Juul, that is worth keeping in mind. It's a free country.
[2] Olekalns, N., & Bardsley, P. (1996). Rational addiction to caffeine: An analysis of coffee consumption. Journal of Political Economy, 104(5), 1100-1104.
Addictive alone is not necessarily a problem, but it does mean there is the potential for companies to exploit that addiction to make money while causing great harm along the way.
> It's a free country.
A "free country" and regulated capitalism are not mutually exclusive. It's a free country and you need a license to drive a car. It's a free country and you can't sell someone baking soda disguised as flour. Regulations, done right, have the potential to make us all safer, and protect us from exploitation by capitalist interests. For example, stealing is very profitable... but we made it illegal in order to discourage corporations from forming around theft as a business model.
All that said, to be perfectly honest, my actual biggest beef with juul is the stupid disposable plastic pods. Everything else is... well, capitalism exploiting addiction for profit... at the cost of people's health. Which as you point out, is not exclusive to juul.
Cigarettes have few positive side effects and heavily contributes to the #1 preventable disease in the US: cardiovascular disease. AFAIK there are no outright bans on nicotine or tobacco products. However, the places you may consume them in public are shrinking (and often the same restrictions are placed on marijuana). Also the kind of products that are attractive to kids are being targeted (again, AFAIK companies are not allowed to market marijuana - or alcohol - to children).
It seems to me that tobacco used to be much more prevalent but is being re-categorized from "acceptable everywhere" into the same group as alcohol. And marijuana is being re-categorized from Schedule 1 to the same category as alcohol.
We do demonize alcohol makers and sellers -- Scotland has introduced Minimum Unit Pricing; there's a push to get that introduced in England (unlikely with a current PM who doesn't believe in regulation for anything) and alcohol is taxed and has controls on who can buy it and who can sell it.
Artificial sweeteners are not harmful.
Red meat is no where near as harmful as either tobacco or alcohol.
> I’m sure everyone has some bad habits that will lead to a premature death.
Tobacco kills huge numbers of people in a variety of ways. The number one public health issue at the moment is getting people to smoke less and then to stop smoking.
The moral thing to do is not to sell the thing you openly admit is bad for the people you sell it to, even if you end up losing a profit making machine. That is oddly often the case that morality doesn’t quite align with profits. But let’s not pretend like you are option-less to do anything but maximize profits.
I can be mad at the system that motives you, and also think you're a dick for valuing money over doing something that is a net benefit to the world.
I can also seek to control your ability to do damage using laws and public discourse.
I'd also prefer that arms dealers shut down, that whatever Philip Morris calls itself these days shut down, that food manufacturers stop using high-fructose corn syrup, etc, etc.
edit: I do understand that some people are concerned about juul's alleged marketing to minors. if that's really what you're upset about, why not narrow your focus? I don't think many vape consumers would object to having vape advertisements strictly limited or banned.
I've got a few friends that went this way and it's a bit... odd.
in a way, it kinda reminds me of the pc overclocking community.