A pop of color and more: updates to Android’s brand | Hacker News Reader

A pop of color and more: updates to Android’s brand

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65 pointsthsowers52 comments

Curious about the frequency of this negative feedback. The dessert-themed releases were iconic. Anecdotally, international folks generally seemed to love it even when they didn't understand a given name. Google campus has a neat collection of statues representing each one...

This really feels like letting the cart lead the horse. Someone will be unhappy with any choice. They could've added secondary designations (included in preferences and packaging) to solve most of the confusion problems.

But this anodyne, sterile style seems to be the best Google can muster these days.

Another example: I've watched their Stadia Connect videos in which they attempt to pitch their upcoming gaming service to the consumers. They too have come across completely sanitized and robotic -- reminds me of corporate entertainment news doing formulaic red carpet interviews.

Apple: Lets name our OS releases after random places in California, including some that aren't very well known

Google: We need to discontinue our naming scheme because Pie isn't a dessert in some countries.

This just seems like a bland corporate decision. Blaming it on cultural sensitivity and inclusivity seems almost insulting. Someone isn't going to refuse to use an Android version just because they're accustomed to savory pies instead of sweet ones.

Didn't Chicken Pot Pie consumers boycott Android Pie?

To be fair, Apple's California naming is off-putting even for people in the US.

How so?

I use Apple products at work, and am otherwise not very invested in the world of Apple. I frequently will have to look up how to accomplish a task or get a particular piece of software working, and the author will assume that I'm familiar with where macOS <some place name> fits in the chronology vs. macOS <some other place name>, requiring me to look it up.

Worse for me than the Android dessert names were, since at least those were ordered.

People laughed at me when I mispronounced Mojave.

This comparison is a bit biased, you could compare IOS and Android naming which will be the same from now on "name - version number".

I think the cultural argument is not the most important one for this decision, the important point is that old naming is confusing to newcomers and customers since Android has a lot of disparities between devices and supported versions[1] whereas Apple can count on a very high rate of adoption for their new versions[2].

It is for sure a marketing move even if it hurts Android users who used to love this naming convention.

[1] https://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/android/m... [2] https://gs.statcounter.com/os-version-market-share/macos/des...

> Pie isn't a dessert in some countries

"Pie" means foot in Spanish and it's pronounced something like "pee eh"

Edit: not sure why I'm being downvoted...

Also, Mexicans use "pay" to refer to a pie (not a foot).

To play devil's advocate, I can see the version numbering scheme contributing more attention to the lack of updates from OEMs from the average user. Although I have no empirical data to support it, I can imagine there's a lot of people that don't see new Android versions as "updates", but rather "editions" due to the dessert naming scheme. It's not immediately obvious to some of the people I know that their Galaxy phone, as an example, doesn't have the latest version of Android. Not too long ago, I've literally heard a friend say they have the "Lollipop edition of Android" and they were completely unaware they were two versions behind. They thought Pie and Oreo were simply alternative editions, depending on manufacturer.

I think the numbering scheme will be more obvious to the average user that they are behind from latest version of Android and that might add more pressure to OEMs (and carriers) to put more effort into updates.

Or Play Services could just pop up a notification that says "your phone hasn't received any security updates in 27 months and it's running a 3-year-old version of Android". Nah, that's too easy.

The dessert-themed releases were iconic

I'm not an Android user, but I always had a passing interest in what the new version would be called.

While going to a numbering scheme like iOS is good for Spock, I just can't get behind yet another example of how the world of technology is becoming more boring and bland compared to the way it used to be. Often, in the name of "internationalization."

Unusual words, or novel uses of existing words, used to be part of the whole intellectual curiosity of the tech sphere.

For example, I learned about Maxwell's Demon[1] because of the Unix daemon. Today it would be called something boring like "system auto-task" that doesn't really do it justice.

It seems like the more corporate technology companies become, the more boring they become. And since tech companies influence so much of the world, they make the real world boring.

Remember when computer keyboards had red and blue and yellow keys? Modifier keys were labeled "meta," "super," and "hyper?"

And it's not just Google. Hey, Apple! Can I get the little Apple logos on my keyboard, and the light up beacon on the back of my laptop again?

Why is there this constant need within tech companies to make their products less special?

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maxwell%27s_demon

I think it's tough when it's an annual thing. One comment in this thread is, "Do you have Oreo?" "Don't know, let me check", but in Settings/About/Version it would show "7.0". Then I would need to Google what number Oreo is.

I use macOS and only started having that problem after they went to annual releases (or maybe I started making desktop maintenance less of a priority?) even though it does show both Mojave and 10.14 in the About.

Although, I do wish there was more whimsy in tech.

Maybe the better solution is for Android to list "7.0 Oreo" in its Version box, like macOS shows "macOS Mojave Version 10.14.15" in its About This Mac box.

It's still a problem for me in macOS and it wasn't 10+ years ago. I think it's the frequency of releases, not the naming.

Also how many people really didn't know Lollipop came after KitKat? I get that not everyone uses the Western A-Z alphabet, but in this globalized aged I'd expect most humans over the age of 8 to be able to recite it in order...

Maybe so, but how many people knew that the names were assigned in order?

Perhaps some meaningful alliteration like Karmic KitKat and Lucid Lollipop would have helped?

I'm not an Android user and I had no idea they ordered them alphabetically, never gave it any thought.

I agree. I haven't used Android since the ICS days, but ending the dessert themed names does feel like the end of an era.

I started using Android with the Orange San Francisco, as it was branded in the UK, "underneath" it was the ZTE Blade. It was a very cheap device, but you could unlock the bootloader, install a custom recovery and a custom ROM, it was great. The custom ROMs had much better performance than the standard software, removing all the bloatware that the operator included and you could upgrade to a later version of Android. It came with 2.2, iirc and you could get 2.3. There was a massive community surrounding that particular device on Modaco, similar to XDA Developers I guess, but run by a handful of people (or one guy, not sure) for those who aren't aware of it. I started programming when I was 13 or 14. The school I went to was pretty good in this regard, or maybe that was standard, but they taught Visual Basic as part of the IT classes. In my spare time I got a copy of Borland Delphi from a magazine and started hacking on Object Pascal. I created a GUI for an encryption library, for absolutely no reason other than why not and I even got some responses about it. I was browsing Sourceforge, Freshmeat and Slashdot around this time, to be featured anywhere there would be amazing. Well soon after this I completely gave up on programming for no other reason than I was a teenager and probably became more interested in Extreme Metal more than anything else. Android and the hacking communities on Modaco and XDA Developers got me back into programming. Early Android was a place where you could modify and experiment to your hearts content. I mean even back then you had to get the right device, i.e. don't get a Samsung. As time went on, then came along CyanogenMod, to be honest it was probably there when I had my ZTE Blade, it probably wasn't supported and I hadn't heard of it yet. But it was truly a golden age, maybe not secure. As time has gone on, Google has locked down Android with every release, it has become homogenised and now they are now naming Android Q, Android 10. Alongside Windows 10 and mac OS X (10), just how corporate and unoriginal can you get. I get that Google is a company and Android is essentially a product, I guess all I'm saying is, I just miss those early wild heady days.

I'm glad that version numbers will be more prominent with Android -- even right now I have no idea which dessert OS I'm running on my phone. I have an older (but still great) Android tablet and again I don't know what it runs either.

Almost every other product I own I can tell you it's major version number and it's relative place among versions. How many versions old is my tablet vs. my phone -- I can't tell off the top of my head.

It might also help consumers as there are still Android products being sold with "Kitkat".

People would ask me: "Do you have Oreo?"

And I would say "Don't know, let me check", but in Settings/About/Version it would show "7.0".

Then I would need to Google what number Oreo is.

Press the version number repeatedly in the menu.

O'course.

Obviously it could just show both: "7.0 (Oreo)".

My first thought from whatever announced by Google nowadays is either along the line of “Hmm... some PMs or visual designers got really bored” (Gmail for example) or “someone needs a project for a promotion” (Allo for example while Gtalk or Hangout was great)

Never liked the sweets names because they are confusing and is hard to tell how old a given release is from the name. I'm for the numbers, also the new logo is better. Good changes IMHO.

Looks like Google couldn’t think of a good dessert that started with “Q”.

That's obviously the reason. No question about it. No one at Google would be able to google for dessert names starting with the letter q.

I'm not a fan of any of these options: https://www.theverge.com/tldr/2018/8/6/17655790/android-p-q-...

Why not go savory tho.

It could have contributed a decent amount. Maybe it's not that they couldn't think of any names, but that they couldn't think of any good names, so they asked what else they could do. One option was a branding change.

There are lots of software companies that use named releases, but if you try to stick with a narrow category and use every letter sequentially you're going to run into some problems eventually. Even if they got past Q this time, there are a lot of letters at the end of the alphabet that were going to be hard to come up with good dessert names with.

They could have partnered with Nestle and used Quik, similar to their partnering with Hershey for Kitkat

This is like the "no Windows 9.0" reasoning, isn't it.

Seems like they missed a golden opportunity to come up with a new Google Branded dessert.

Queese Cake.

Quark https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quark_(dairy_product)

Add a sweet topping and you have a dessert.

Android Quaalude

I'm in India. Nobody here has ever eaten a Nougat. But everyone knew (at that time) that their phone was "latest Nougat"

I dont understand why they couldnt have done both. Apple has precedent here "Mavericks 10.9", "Yosemite 10.10".

Google could have mandated brand guidelines to adding version number - "Oreo 8", "Pie 9", "Quiche 10". There is the aspect of fun and brand and a cognitive construct together.

Incidentally, this already happens - check out this phone https://www.amazon.in/Nokia-6-1-Plus-Black-Storage/dp/B07T4V...

Android v8 Oreo operating system with Qualcomm Snapdragon SD 636 quad core processor

Combined with [1] I get the sense (wiff) that Google is in full on marketing (propaganda) mode right now. Time to distract and polish all the things.

This update to the logo while bringing a simplified consistency, lacks strategic focus or any refined brand narrative.

[1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20767891

How does "Android Q------" translate to "Android 10"? Q is the 17th letter of the alphabet.

Oh, apparently the code names often changed with a point release. I am looking at [Wikipedia's list of Android versions](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Android_version_history) and there seems to be absolutely no pattern to whether or not a .1 release changed the version name - 4.1 through 4.3 are Jelly Bean but 4.4 is Kit Kat.

This bugs some part of my brain far more than it ought to.

Windows 10

Android 10

Mac OS X (10)

Hopefully Android will move past version 10?

10 is the biggest number. After that, you need to start back at 1.

Browsers have gotten past it. The versions of current major browsers are 11, 12, 18, 62, 68, 76.

Mine goes all the way to 11, for that extra push over the cliff.

They should have switched to year based versioning. It makes a lot of sense for products that have a major version every year like Android, iOS, and macOS. "Android 2019" would be far easier to remember than a random number, and you can tell how old a version is right away.

It's a bit boring and serious, but I think that's exactly what they were aiming for. Specially since Google is now taking app reviews more seriously in both the Play Store and the Chrome Web Store for Chrome OS. Android has a reputation for being a wild west compared to iOS.

I am surprised that this did not come up when the branding of the releases started. Localization / Product Marketing usually has a hand in everything.

Why accept this when we can defy the master? Let's continue to choose (vote?) a dessert name, use and propagate it (even to media) as if nothing has changed? We create our own reality.

mostly, there just aren't any desserts that start with Q.

Quince?

The quick queen of quincy and her qwacking qwackeroo? (Seuss)

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