Greenland Lost 12.5B Tons of Ice in a Single Day | Hacker News Reader

Greenland Lost 12.5B Tons of Ice in a Single Day

smithsonianmag.com

32 pointspseudolus16 comments

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20597367

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=20606524

And there will be many more posts like this. And more denial.

It's maddening that this is happening and we could stop it if we collectively wanted to. Crazier still is that the Right appears to have made this a "liberal issue", and therefore revel in making this a joke.

If I was childless I could turn this into a big YOLO party, but I have kids and am heartbroken to have them inherit this mess.

Do you drive an EV?

Not yet. I take public transportation for the most part.

But ok, I'll bite: there's an implied "hypocrite!" in your question. My existence consumes resources and I'm therefore part of the problem.

I can do "my part" but this is bigger than any one individual. The policy makers are the one who have control to shape outcomes.

You're not a hypocrite. I still like to know the level of dogfooding someone practices.

I agree with you, but there are lies happening on both sides. And then there are people calling out the lies. At the end you can do nothing but doubt all that you hear.

Take for example the ipcc report that just came out. It is a resounding idea of a bunch of anti meat vegans trying to use climate change alarms to persuade the world into their world view.

It is manipulation at its best. And now I don't care about the the whole climate change drama. It sucks. They are trying to control me.

I will strive for green energy and stuff but not for climate reasons.

The anti meat vegans appointed by governments to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) by the notoriously and overwhelmingly anti-meat vegans running governments around the world? Err...

Don't rule out the possibility of group think. Some voices get silenced because they don't have an agenda. While others find truth to their opinions in thousands of research.

I don't think you know how the IPCC works. They're not some vegan activist group. It's an internationally appointed group that studies scientific consensus to inform policymaking. From the report (https://www.ipcc.ch/2019) you mentioned:

> The Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change (IPCC) is the UN body for assessing the science related to climate change. It was established by the United Nations Environment Programme (UN Environment) and the World Meteorological Organization (WMO) in 1988 to provide policymakers with regular scientific assessments concerning climate change, its implications and potential future risks, and to put forward adaptation and mitigation strategies. It has 195 member states.

> IPCC assessments provide governments, at all levels, with scientific information that they can use to develop climate policies. IPCC assessments are a key input into the international negotiations to tackle climate change. IPCC reports are drafted and reviewed in several stages, thus guaranteeing objectivity and transparency.

> The IPCC assesses the thousands of scientific papers published each year to inform policymakers about the state of knowledge on climate change. The IPCC identifies where there is agreement in the scientific community, where there are differences and where further research is needed. It does not conduct its own research.

> To produce its reports, the IPCC mobilizes hundreds of scientists. These scientists and officials are drawn from diverse backgrounds. Only a dozen permanent staff work in the IPCC’s Secretariat.

IPCC was a scientific organization. But the more it develops a position of influence, the more corrupt it tends to become. That's just law of politics.

> lies happening on both sides

There's compelling evidence that industrial meat production has significant environmental impacts. (I'm not a vegan but am sympathetic to it). Yes, the vegan extremists go too far but that should not detract from the facts.

This appears to be a case of false equivalency.

> They are trying to control me.

Is urging you to not eat meat (whether or not it's really "right") controlling?

Do you believe that people are driven by incentives, with money being a primary one? Think about all the money to be made from fossil fuels, might they be highly incentivized to keep those pumps pumping so they can continue to make money?

What are the incentives of people agitating for action against climate change?

There are no facts if everyone is interested in their own thoughts.

The individual still has control of himself. It's the more organized movements like policy creation and corporate activities that are outside the individual's control that indirectly affect him. Isn't that how we are trying to get the right to adopt green tech?

When a person sets up a niche shop, he has an incentive in getting people to adopt the niche as mainstream. Like vegetable made meat products.

I'll ask the silly question, with all the global warming happening and record ice melting why isn't there more islands being entirely covered by water?

12.5B tons increases the sea level by how much?

This is not that hard to figure out: 12.5B tons is about 12.5e9 m3 of water. Earth's diameter is 12700 km. The area of a sphere (Earth is a geoid, sure!) of that diameter is 5e8 km2. 70% of the Earth's surface is water, so only about 3.5e8 km2. If we add 12.5e9 m3, or 12.5 km3, of water to the oceans, that 12.5 km3 will cover a depth of 12.5 km3 / 3.5e8 km2, or roughly 3.8e-8 km, or 3.8e-5 m, or 38 microns, or basically nothing to worry about. It won't add up to one meter until it happens every day for about 2.5e4 days, or about 65 years. I expect glacial melting to mess things up through other means than brute oceanic depth increase. Things like albedo increase, current modification.

This is a stream-of-consciousness Fermi estimate level of precision, so don't expect it to be correct beyond order of magnitude.

Dummy question. I leave near the sea. If so many ice is melting why I cannot see the sea rising?

Reply on news.ycombinator.com