Reviving an HP 660LX in 2019 | Hacker News Reader

Reviving an HP 660LX in 2019

blog.presidentbeef.com

75 pointsInAnEmergency23 comments

I was part of a project that helped bring a usable Linux distribution on this line of palmtops -- JLime (you can find references on the net, but the main site has since gone dark). This includes the 620LX, 660LX, 680 and 690 (based on SH-3 processors), as well as the 710 and 720 (based on ARM processors).

I personally had the 690, which was suprisingly usable (and probably still is), even with its 133MHz CPU and 32MB of RAM. Finding and porting software was, even in ~2006, especially hard, given the hardware constraints and unique screen aspect ratio (640x240 resolution).

I still have the page for the distribution up here[0], and a software repository set up here[1], in case the author (if they see this) or anyone else that has any of these machines stashed away is feeling adventurous...

[0]: https://deuill.org/code/jlime-vargtass/ [1]: https://repository.deuill.org/hp6xx/vargtass/

(Author here)

I did spend quite a bit of time on your site, linked sites, and webarchive. The files on your site did not work out of the box for me. I did eventually get a combination of kernel and configuration that kind of worked, but I think the CompactFlash card was too big. It stalled out on hard drive interrupts.

Ah, that's too bad! AFAIR zrafa's site[0] was the place to go for bootloader/kernel files specific to the 620LX/660LX, but the userland should work on any 6xx series.

[0]: https://web.archive.org/web/20150626030407/http://fz.hobby-s...

Thanks, I'll have a dig in the basement then I guess! Is the bootloader code open source?

Indeed it is/was, though I cannot seem to find an original copy on the internet, so I uploaded to the repository[0]. I'm not sure what the requisite toolchain is, though.

[0]: https://repository.deuill.org/hp6xx/misc/jshlo-1.1.0-CE-2.11...

Toolchain probably is Visual Studio 6 with the Windows CE SDK.

Hey, I have used JLime on my Jornada 728 back in the day, thank you for your work!

For those of you who want a modern machine along these lines there is the Gemini. It fits a useable keyboard into a pocketable Linux and Android machine.

It is modeled on a Psion 5mx with updated insides, and has some of the original team members from Psion working on it.

https://store.planetcom.co.uk/products/gemini-pda-1

But a big part of what was great about the Psion was the software, and the Gemini doesn't really have any[1] of that; it just runs Android with some small tweaks.

And didn't they build it on a SoC that was already EOL at launch, for which there are no FOSS drivers, meaning it will be forever stuck on an ancient kernel version[2]? I don't want to spend my money on a machine that will have be to thrown away in a year for lack of security updates. (Which is why I'm backing the Librem 5 instead, even though I loved the Psion series 3a and series 5 and would really like a keyboard.)

[1] Well, they have implemented Android incarnations of the calendar and database apps, which is something at least: https://planetcom.squarespace.com/software-1

[2] Their Android 8 update seems to use Linux 3.18, released in 2014: https://github.com/dguidipc/gemini-android-kernel-3.18-andro...

I know it's nostalgia speaking but the turn of the century was such a cool time with tech for me. I remember coveting a Psion after speak to a journalist that used one to file stories from remote areas though some kludged link up with a sat phone if I recall. It's not impressive to anyone today relative to what's available but it was so cool in my mind. I never did get one or really NEED one but it brings up memories.

I have an affection for Windows CE devices, particularly those wide-screen clamshell models. The keyboard without wasted bezel space around is deeply satisfying to my sense of aesthetics. It's a shame the DSTN screens are so unpleasant to use.

It does look like a miniature version of the platonic ideal laptop form, which is appealing, but the Psion 5 design was more practical since it didn't tip over backwards when you poked it with the stylus. :)

I don’t have any experience with it, but NetBSD still supports these machines (although the 660LX isn’t listed in the support table, not sure why)

http://wiki.netbsd.org/ports/hpcsh/

> I searched all around my office and dug through my big box of (mostly useless) cables, but still no luck.

> Just when I gave up (of course) I found it!! Yay!!

There has to be a name for this phenomenon or a 'law'. There is a whole world of emotions that goes with it, from starting out with expectation of failure to the 'yay' exhilaration of having found it. If it is found it will be in the last placed searched, not anywhere else.

I used to run NetBSD/hpcarm and JLime Linux on an HP Jornada 728 in high school.

Those were cool, but in retrospect they did not make sense at all.

Someone was developing a flashrom board for the Jornada 728 that would have greatly improved GNU/Linux support -- including real sleep and truly long battery life. Sadly they never delivered.

HP had internal versions of the Jornada 72[0,8] that used flash instead of mask ROM, they could run the handhelds.org distribution of Linux.

Any chance of having one of said flash boards? Or the design files?

I didn't work for HP and have never seen a flash Jornada 720. I think they were just manufactured with Intel StrataFlash on the main board instead of mask ROM.

The early iPAQ models had Windows CE in flash, so you could easily overwrite it. Back then NetBSD didn't have a flash filesystem so NetBSD/hpcarm just booted from WinCE and ran in RAM.

The handhelds.org distribution was a DEC/Compaq/HP project that initially targeted their Itsy [1] device, then added support for their commercial products as they were released. Later they allowed external contributions too. They build an iPAQ sleeve that contained accelerometers to be able to carry on the UI development from the Itsy, you scrolled the screen by tilting the device. Their Linux kernel did have a fair bit of power management built in.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Itsy_Pocket_Computer

I ported Nethack to Windows CE back in the days. I think I used exactly this machine then.

Funny thing is, someone asked me about it only some years ago.

"Sadly… or not so sadly… the world has moved to HTTPS and to stronger protocols than what lowly Pocket Explorer supports. Thus, most of the web is entirely inaccessible on the device."

This is what proxies are for. Assuming it supports proxies. It would of course be wholly untrustworthy as it's likely vulnerable to a whole host of functional middling exploits.

Long story short, because of this post I have a J720 sitting in front of me right now :D

Heh, I got a 620LX around somewhere. I believe someone managed to port Linux to it as well as write a bootloader that booted Linux from inside of Windows CE.

That is correct. I remember booting it up on 620LX.

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