OK Seriously What Is BizSpark?
blog.wekeroad.com
blog.wekeroad.com
BizSpark consists primarily of two things: (1) a one-on-one contact to provide advice, to arrange partnership opportunities (marketing, etc), and to provide introductions to the Microsoft product teams as needed; and (2) free software licenses (which you get to keep at the end of the program). Loopt has also received other benefits, like access to their compatibility labs, conference passes, etc.
With BizSpark, Microsoft is confident enough in the quality of their offering that there's no commitment. You chose to use as much or as little of what is offered as you want, and there is zero pressure. We make use of various open source technologies[1]. It's not a problem. Also, at the end of the program they offer an extremely generous graduation offer[2] with no financial obligation.
After that, Microsoft's volume licensing is reasonable[3], the tools are well documented, and everything works as expected. Their stack is predictable, consistent, and dependable. If you want to be able to focus on your product instead of the tools you're using[4], then the Microsoft stack is great. Note: It's cheaper to have your tools work than to hire someone on salary to maintain and debug them.
[1] Ubuntu, PostgreSQL, MySQL, Ruby, Rails, etc.
[2] http://www.bizspark.com/Programs/Pages/GraduationOffer.aspx I can't discuss the details of Loopt's custom offer (we exceed the standard usage by a fair amount), but we'll be much better off after BizSpark than we were before. Microsoft has been very generous.
[3] See the SPLA program: http://www.microsoft.com/hosting/en/us/licensing/splabenefit...
[4] Not that they aren't extensible if needed. Back before ASP.Net MVC and WCF (and before Thrift, Protocol Buffers, and Rails) we wrote a ton of our own custom web and RPC tooling. ASP.Net is actually really nice but gets a bad rap because of web forms (which you don't have to use, and have improved substantially in the latest release). IIS 7 rocks as a transport agnostic application server, and can do MSMQ, TCP, UDP and more (it's extensible) in addition to HTTP.
If you want to know more before then feel free to email (in my profile).
I don't doubt all you say is true. But consider someone (like me for example) with a Unixy skill-set. I know PHP, MySQL, PhpMyAdmin, Python, Django, Unix text processing tools, etc, and while the MS equivalents may well be very good, when you factor in my time learning to use them, I'm not going to be as productive.
One of the reasons I know all these tools is that getting started is simply sudo apt-get install whatever and I'm off. If MS want a higher uptake of their developer tools, they might make them as easy to get at as that.
I understand that with BizSpark I can use Microsoft's tools without paying much money. But there's a bureaucratic process to getting on the BizSpark program, which I'm guessing takes days or weeks to achieve. By comparison, sudo apt-get install takes seconds.
And that's why I'm using Unix-based tools in my startup.
Microsoft offers free versions of their developer tools with the various Visual Studio Express editions and Sql Server Express.
If you're looking into more enterprise-y software, Microsoft offers free time-limited versions of pretty much all their server and productivity software.
apt-get is a whole different plane of ease. It adds about a 3-second fixed-cost to trying a new tool.
I'm no MS fanboy -- my current side project is PHP/LAMP all the way, but I have made money with their free tools.
Upgrading MongoDB is a five second job. Upgrading SQL server is nightmarish and scary.
Or do they not believe Windows requires OS restarts anymore (as of Windows 2008R2 it still does, for Microsoft apps too)? Try setting up a server with Office Web apps - it's about five complete OS restarts.
Why do we need BizSpark? While we would like for our customers to use our web app exclusively, the reality is the majority of practices run Windows and Office. So we built Exchange and Outlook integration using the tools provided by BizSpark. If we hadn't had access to those tools we still would have built the product, but we wouldn't have Exchange and Outlook support at launch. The benifit for us; We built a product better suited for our customers. The benefit for MS: They have another product on the list of thousands that has custom support and integration with their office suite, their bread and butter.
Clearly the biggest benefit for us has been access to thousands in software we otherwise couldn't afford. But we will be looking at the opportunities to network with partners and investors through BizSpark when we're ready.
I see it as a win for us and an ever so tiny win (because of our small user base) for Microsoft.
Is it just software, or do they provide any sort of assistance with doing the integration with their stuff?
I'm curious since I could see a use for Sharepoint integration and even Outlook / Office integration for some of what I'm working on, but I'd still be leery of the whole "it's a trap" thing with Microsoft.
There are a couple of ways to get support. First, you're basically getting premium MSDN account access, so you get a limited number of support requests, it gives you one-on-one access to their engineers to get technical help if you need it. Second, there is a general BizSpark contact. We haven't contacted them yet, I suspect its primarily for getting help with the parter & investor networking aspect of it.
As far as signing up, go for it! I'd encourage anyone that falls in their guidelines and wants to integrate with any piece of MS software to sign up. (Main guidelines: Your company or startup is less than 3 years old, privately owned, Less then $1M in revenue)
BizSpark doesn't impose any conditions like you listed, to qualify for BizSpark, you just need to meet the requirements listed here: https://www.microsoft.com/BizSpark/Faqs.aspx#Startup-Questio...
We don't have a formal way to offer assistance to startups looking to integrate with our software. That said, I'd love to talk to anybody who is interested doing integrations with Microsoft software.
"You attempted to reach www.microsoft.com, but the certificate that the server presented has been revoked by its issuer. This means that the security credentials the server presented absolutely should not be trusted. You may be communicating with an attacker. You should not proceed."
Just FYI...
You can use this command to double-check the certificate on your local (POSIX) machine or on a remote server:
echo '' | openssl s_client -connect www.microsoft.com:443 | openssl x509 -noout -fingerprintPut another way - I'm imagining you have a "Add to Outlook" bit of functionality which makes perfect sense. But the format is quite open and it, after all, a text file. How does this jibe with your web offering and your need for Exchange?
The main reason I ask is that Exchange is (generally) seen as not necessary in a startup (company < 20 or so). Typically they'll use Google apps or another hosted service which will accept their domain (Live.com does this as well).
Can you detail more why you needed Exchange with a Web app?
Our software is for attorneys and many attorneys love outlook + exchange + blackberry server, even small offices.
Our company is part of the program and we basically get access to everything for 3 years. We're talking VS 2010, SQL Server, Windows, Azure hours and much more.
You can in theory, build Google on it, make $50B over 20 years, and never pay MS a dime, all while using MS software.
With that said, if you do want to upgrade to new versions of the software after 3 years, then you'll have to pay for upgrades. But that's like saying that someone giving you a new car for free isn't really free, if they don't give you a new car every year. Or if ATT and Apple give you an iPhone and service free for 3 years, its not really free unless they give you a new iPhone every 3 years (and free ATT service).
Which means you have to pop for licenses for VS, Exhange, Sharepoint, Office, SQL, Windows Server, etc. SQL and Windows Server is the big one... especially if you've built Google.
Note that if you keep your MSDN license, it doesn't entitle you to use much in production. You can't, for instance, run SQL Server in production using an MSDN license. Nor can you use Exchange and Windows Server.
So it's not free :).
"Startups may keep and continue to use, for development and testing purposes, all the software they received as part of their BizSpark MSDN Subscription. In other words, they have perpetual development and test rights to that software."
"The BizSpark Graduation Offer allows BizSpark startups to keep, at no charge, all the software they acquired through the BizSpark program"
"Under the graduation offer, the MSDN Ultimate licenses that came with BizSpark are perpetual, so startups keep all the tools and platform software they got from the program for development and testing purposes, including Visual Studio and Expression"
"Similarly, startups will also have perpetual rights to all of their Windows and SQL Server production licenses"
Now your claim may be that BizSpark doesn't supply enough licenses for you, but it is FREE. After BizSpark is done, you never have to pay MS a cent to keep and use the SW acquired in BizSpark.
In fact, I didn't realize they'd waived the $100 fee.
Like I said, if you want to upgrade or get additional licenses, you have to pay for those. You can build your $50B empire all on BizSpark, although you'll just have to write a very efficient backend to handle the transactions with only a couple of SQL instances, but there is nothing stopping you, but your ingenuity :-)
It's absolutely not a bait and switch.
I'm sure you guys had to work some licensing (which probably came under an agreement to enroll in another program). This isn't free - it's an engagement. If you left the program you would have to pay, I'm sure.
And if it works for you - that's good stuff. I'd be very interested in reading about your choices and why you went this route.
Loopt was paying for licensing before we joined, and will be paying less after.
I could be wrong, but as I understand it:
* The dev tools are free, and continue to be so at the end. This is a huge deal by itself.
* Some number of server licenses are perpetually free.
It's possible for it to be completely free, though it needn't be if you aren't careful or choose to exceed the limits.
That's like saying Apple gave me a 16GB iPhone, but I want a 32GB version, therefore its not free.
Of course we're talking about Microsoft so bizarro logic now applies.
> You can in theory, build Google on it, make $50B over 20 years, and never pay MS a dime, all while using MS software.
> That's like saying Apple gave me a 16GB iPhone, but I want a 32GB version, therefore its not free.
I agree, it would seem bizarro logic does indeed apply.
Unfortunately typing slower doesn't have the same impact as talking slower.
You CANNOT run production SQL on an MSDN license - neither can you run a web server on an MSDN licensed version of Windows Server. Well, you literally can but you'd be in violation.
It's not FREE. Microsoft doesn't make software to give it out to anyone claiming they're a startup. Read the entire FAQ in its entirety, then understand the licensing for web servers and web data servers - you'll quickly see that you'll need to enroll in other programs (ISV or otherwise) to get the discounts.
Quote me a single line that says thay the dev tools you have a license to must be purchased after BizSpark.
Now - here's the thing: I've said the same thing 5 times, and you refuse to see it - which is that the software isn't free. The dev tools are covered under MSDN - so yes I'll give you that. And you can engineer it so that your dev team stays very small and you don't need to purchase additional slots.
But that's where it stops. If you run the MS stack with VS, you'll need IIS, SQL Server, and all the other bits that go with it. These are the money-making SKUs friend - and that's my point.
They. Aren't. Free.
So which is it? Devtools? Or can I build $50B Google for free, as you said above.
Double talk indeed.
So again, you do get licensed production servers for free. Not an unlimited number of them, but you do get FREE production licenses of WinServer (which includes IIS) and SQL Server.
And yes, you can build, in theory, $50B Google for free with it. Of course, I did say, in theory, and I make it blisteringly clear later when I say, "although you'll just have to write a very efficient backend to handle the transactions with only a couple of SQL instances, but there is nothing stopping you, but your ingenuity".
There's never an obligation to pay MS a dime. You can use the tools to write the new BigTable, to write a web server, a NoSql engine, a package manager or whatever else you like as well to compliment the free software you have.
IMO, I think we've done the job w/ this conversation. You've made the "claim" that BizSpark is not free (although you've backed away from this a bit and now at least seem to grant that the dev tools are). I claim otherwise. BizSpark very clearly calls out what is free and what is perpetual. Sure, you don't get a washer and dryer with BizSpark, but they never said you did. Likewise, I don't believe BizSpark gives you a free Kinect either. But it is very clear what they do give you and the licensing and cost associated with it.
Again, you haven't pointed out where I'd have to pay for a single thing with BizSpark. You've only pointed out that if I want to do MORE than what BizSpark suggests, I'd have to pay. To that I say, duh.
If I were Microsoft, that would make sense to me.
Regarding MS's lack of self-promotion. They tend to self-promote what they believe and are mum on other stuff. Like WP7 and Azure -- they won't say its the best, but that its a marathon, not a sprint. But with Visual Studio, they'll happily tell you that it is the best. SQL Server, they'll enumerate the scenarios where they're the best. And with Office, they have no problem making the claim that it's the best office productivity platform.
While Rob would like more self-promotion... I think its fair to say that if you don't know what your tools are good at and are looking at a company to tell you then BizSpark (or any other program) probably won't help you.
It is a great way to get noticed by Microsoft. If you do not already have lots of contacts at high level, this will help.
All you can eat software really helps.
I develop in C# because my visual studio ultimate edition makes it extremely convenient. I can write code directly as a result of creating a UML model.
Bizspark accelerates startups by removing software barriers. We integrate with Exchange and Dynamics CRM, so for us it was an obvious strategy.
Bizspark One is like an incubator.
Most commercial software vendors have similar programs and analogous offers available to developers, and seemingly most featuring the "for development and testing purposes" restrictions.
If you're operating within the particular vendor's realm and particularly developing over a longer horizon, these programs can be reasonable.
But these programs are also sticky-traps or "free samples" leading to addictions or vendor lock-ins or whatever analogy you'd prefer. (Which is why they exist; duh.) Once entrenched on (Linux, Windows, Mac OS X, EC2/S3, hosted services, whatever) porting out or switching from development to production use can get costly.
Looking forward, consider if the end-users are even particularly going to know or care what software is running under the hood in a few years. While it's a now very successful model, what are the growth trends in three or five years? Between hosting (Azure or slices or otherwise) and virtual machine guests and embedded clients, the operating system and the bag of drivers that it provides is becoming a component of your application, or something you (or somebody else) runs for your customers.
Pick your bag of drivers and choose your particular software addiction(s) appropriately. If that's BizSpark, go for it. Just don't get dazzled by the word "FREE!" from any vendor.
Joel is a Perl, *nix hacker with a dash of Lisp mixed in. He's been working startups for years, and he helps organize Super Happy Dev House in Silicon Valley. He joined BizSpark because he thought he could help a broad cross section of startups.
Joel doesn't push the Microsoft stack very hard. He's very much a soft sell kind of guy. But, if a startup is interested in working on the Microsoft stack, he's a phenomenal resource.
ref:
This requires testing on Office 2007 and 2010, as these apps don't implement the OpenXML spec exactly so there are quirks.
Not sure if the rejection was because it was whether the component that touched the MS stack was OSS, whether MS don't realize that Python runs on Windows, whether they don't want people to use OpenXML on other platforms, or some other reason.
Weirdly enough, I actually started in IT as a Windows NT 4 MCSE when I was 17. I had a very different view of Microsoft then.
This page (http://www.bizspark.com/one/Pages/default.aspx) tells me otherwise, some hot startups are using MS bizspark. So it's not really invisible in the valley.
But if I didn't, I would know pretty quickly that ridiculous buzzwords like that could only come from a place like Microsoft.