The data security side of gdpr is strong, imo. Even before these fines, the disclosure requirement is "teeth." It's already having major positive impact.
The user consent parts of gdpr, are, imo, not good. Any wins though are better than nothing.
The user consent parts of gdpr, are, imo, not good. Any wins though are better than nothing.
But, I feel that assuming a pseudo-contractual relationship between websites and users is euphemism. I feel the same way about user agreements. The south park parody of apple's sums it up, for me.
Not even judges read it. It can't form the basis of a consent model. I think bans on certain types of tracking would be preferable to "consent."
If we are determined to have explicit contracts, we need to be realistic and take incentives into account. If the website controls the UI of the "opt in," language of the contract and such... they have a high level of control over outcomes... and these are highly manipulated to secure convenient outcomes. UI plays a far bigger role in determining the "consent" outcomes than user preferences.
So, if we are determined to go down this route, "consent management" needs to be "open" to 3rd parties chosen by users and allow central management, user selected defaults and 3rd party recommendations/defaults.
If user consent actually reflected informed user preferences, FB's tracking pixel would be disabled for >90% of users. What possible benefit is this to users?
The overlap between people who are paranoid that FB is listening to their conversations via the phone mic and users who have "consented" to advertiser cookies on a bunch of sites tells me that this model for consent is fundamentally broken.
On the flip side if you (or someone) doesn't mind....
I can tell from the downvotes (also on similar comments) that this is an unpopular opinion. Anyone care to defend gdpr "consent" as it exists currently. I don't mean the aspirational language of the law, I mean consent in the wild under gdpr today.
Indeed, this seems to be really lacking as far as I've seen.
Compliance with article 7 section 4 in particular (provision of service must not be conditional on consent for processing of personal data not necessary for provision of that service) is blatantly ignored by many actors, with a message of "accept our tracking or we won't let you see our content". Others pretend to be in compliance by having an opt-out which never completes, or other dark patterns.
Although, in saying that, given the lack of official opt-out functionality, using the site will probably result in tracking.
I wonder: what can we (as a community) do to change this? Can we:
- make applications to the information commissioner about the most egregious breaches - create enough nuisance value that these entities need to acknowledge and address this issue
I'm sure there are enough privacy minded individuals on HN that if we all agreed on a concerted plan of action we could make an impact?
In fairness, that's because it's a legislative over-reach that the EU wants to enforce extra-territorially, but a lot of businesses outside the EU's jurisdiction have declined to undermine their entire business model because a foreign government decided they should.
It is reasonable to say that people should have a choice about things like being tracked, and that such tracking may only be used with the subject's informed consent. This protects the privacy of those who value it by default.
However, IMHO it is not reasonable to say that organisations that fundamentally rely on such data processing to be financially viable must then continue to provide service to users who choose not to participate. That's an entirely one-sided deal, and it's logically unsustainable to require businesses to operate on that basis. You'd never tell a bricks and mortar grocery store that if someone came in but didn't have any money with them then the store still had to let them take a chocolate bar and eat it, and I don't see the effects of the GDPR in this respect as any better than that.
I'm not convinced this is true. Television, billboards, and print newspapers demonstrate that advertising can still exist and support a business model without invading the privacy of users. I'm also not convinced that user-targeted advertising is significantly more effective in practise than contextual advertising.
Maybe if we were faced with some severe and immediate threat to public health and the business were a manufacturer of essential medication, there might be some overriding public interest justification for adopting that sort of position in law, but I think it would need to be a crisis of that sort of level to justify such direct intervention. I don't think the situation we're talking about here is anywhere close to justifying it on similar grounds.
Nor do I see any obvious evidence that forcing the matter through regulatory action will motivate a shift to more desirable funding models for the affected businesses. First some good alternative models would have to be identified, and if we'd done that already, we probably wouldn't be having this conversation at all.
The advertising industry has been subject to regulation for a long time, especially in European countries. There is precedent for regulating the quantity and quality of advertising, banning classes of adverts (e.g. tobacco), and the use of personal data for direct marketing (telemarketing). Ultimately they have the option of providing their services within the bounds of the law, or not providing them at all. I don't see why web advertising should be exceptionally unregulated.
The GDPR does not prohibit advertising, and as a website operator you would be within your rights to block access to adblocker users. Advertising without the use of personal data is demonstrably successful (TV; radio; cinema; magazines; sponsorship). Personal targeting of adverts may improve revenue, but so would allowing tobacco advertising, increasing the length of advert breaks on TV, or numerous other regulated practises.