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Comment by AstroJetson | Hacker News Reader

Uggg. This gives everyone that is trying to live on a boat a bad name. The boat's a mess both inside and outside. As someone that cruises around for fun, boats like his create problems. Florida, Georgia and South Carolina are all working / have passed restrictions on people anchoring out.

It's nice that he's trying to use tech and a cheap boat to stay debt free. But his boat looks like a floating safety hazard. There is an article about him from NZ where they cited him in 2013 for having an unsafe boat.

How hard is it to jump over the side and scrub stains off? How hard is it to package up electronics so they don't look like something off of https://www.reddit.com/r/cablefail/ ?

Come on Sean, a little help here buddy, the cruising world is seen through the lens of boaters like you.

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Ok I think his entire lifestyle is about freedom (FOSS, boat life, supra-national living) and you are kinda reiterating the point. Everyone shouldn't have to conform to a specific standard and he has the freedom to leave places where people such as you want to tell him how to live.

Yes there are probably safety concerns, yes you might find his boat unsightly but really this is closer to how people lived for most of history, totally free in the world unconstrained by government limited only by the relationships they choose to make.

When people leave this planet to live elsewhere they will be more like this guy and less like NASA, just like the Europeans were that left for the new world.

Hi, so I'm good with people "lived for most of history, totally free in the world unconstrained by government limited only by the relationships they choose to make."

However, the Inland Coastal Waterway (where the interview was made) is a very precious resource. Thousands of boaters cruise up and down the waterway from the Chesapeake to Florida. We would all love to live the nomadic lifestyle. Most of us take care of our boats, and try to be a positive reflection to the community. Issue is that when cruisers anchor out along the ICW, in front of someone's property, they look at us and go "Ok, boat in good condition". When they see a boat like Sean, they go "OMG, derelict boat, we need to have a LAW TO KEEP PEOPLE FROM ANCHORING IN FRONT OF MY HOUSE. Because there is a history of boats like that that are not able to propel themselves becoming derelict and then become abandoned.

And that creates a problem, because Sean and cruisers don't pay taxes, so the local government listens to the property owner. And pretty soon, nobody, Sean or other cruiser can anchor. And with boats like his, the local marine police are out looking for safety issues. So they stop Sean, and they stop cruisers and want to do safety inspections.

All of this is preventable by Sean. I don't want him to be a gleaming mega-yacht. But he can spend an hour and his hull won't be a mess. He can spend another hour picking up wires and cables and stuff and when he gets boarded it won't be a mess. And while I appear to be stepping on his rights, the real statement I'm trying to make is "This is why we can't have nice things." 1000's of boaters go up and down the ICW, and this guy, gets news attention, make's hacker news and he becomes the face and boat of cruisers. Closing anchorages where Sean and cruisers hang out are endangered because of this.

you’re only further making the OPs point.

NIMBY is at odds with freedom.

I'll bite since my fireworks got rained out. "NIMBY is at odds with freedom." What does that mean? The issue I was presenting has people that own the back yards that we used to be able to hang out in feel threatened by the owners of the boats. They want us to play nice in their "yards". They want to wake up, get their eggs Benedict and their Mimosa and sit on their McMansion deck and look across the pristine waters. Ok look there is a pretty sailboat, what a great day. Oh look there is what appears to be a derelict sailboat that hasn't been maintained and will sink in hours. CALL MY LAWYER!

They are doing this now across the ICW. Am I supposed to go, "He's cool, he's writing FOSS software, it's for the good of all?" I run OpenCPN and I love it. But to be honest, if I pick between Sean doing FOSS Marine Software) and closing the ICW to me to anchor, I'll be at Garmin's (front door with a credit card). Being part of FOSS doesn't give you a free "do what you want" pass with the rest of what you do with your life.

Mom says "Nice that you are important, it's more important that you are nice". Playing nice is a 2nd grade skill.

People with the really nice back yards have money. And unless you place nice, they use that money against you.

Help me in the balance with NIMBY in this case?

Thanks!

Your commentary on the man's life encapsulates many of the reasons that could make a person want to just ditch civilization and live on a boat.

- Constant worry about looking proper

- Constant worry about your reputation (when people are probably busy thinking about their own reputation instead of yours)

- A large amount of legal restrictions around anything at all

- Telling people what to do so that they conform to your expectations

- Wealthy people determining the legal and regulatory landscape according to their needs

- Less wealthy people losing sleep over whether they are pleasing those wealthy people

- Less wealthy people badgering even less wealthy people so that they do what the wealthy people want

I don't necessarily think that his lifestyle is the best idea or that he is an enlightened sage, but the contrast between the two world views is captivating.

> Mom says "Nice that you are important, it's more important that you are nice". Playing nice is a 2nd grade skill.

If you define "nice" as just doing what wealthier people want because of incentives to do so. In a more Nietzschean sense, being nice is what you have to be when you are powerless. If you turn the calculus the other way, it's worth asking what incentives the lad has to listen to demands. Can he be arrested or have his boat taken away? I don't have the answers to these questions, but I do wonder what the power balance is in this case.

Here is the deal. People own the land on both sides of the ICW. While the "riparian" rights are being fought in court, it's coming down to "do I own the water line". If I do then I can control the water line to the center of the channel. Before the nonsense of a Sean boat, they owned to the high tide line. But now they can point to a boat with issues (Sean's boat) they can make a claim out to mid channel. Blocking him from anchoring.

You ask "Can he / we be arrested and the answer is yes. Yes in Florida and a growing segment in Georgia and the Carolina's. There is no power balance at the Sean level. There is at the boater association level. But Sean isn't helping us going "We are responsible boaters with motive power and boats that look like they will last the next 36 hours.

Nietzschean sense has SFA to do with the GA legislature. You are throwing a theoretical against a "This Shit is Happening Now" The GA legislature is listening to tax payers not Nietzschean sense. This is a real thing, not some textbook quiz.

> Sean isn't helping us

The question is: why should he? Maybe he's OK with doing what he's doing and moving on when he's forced to, rather than following your appeasement strategy.

I see your point, I wrote a bad sentence. Let me try again. Sean is hurting us. He's setting an example about people that want to get away and do their own thing. And his example, of a derelict boat, sets the groups that can make it even harder against all cruisers. So he can come into an area, get the locals to pass laws to stop free anchoring, and he is "moving on when he's forced to." Lather, rinse, repeat down the ICW, and soon it's all closed to open anchoring.

This is actually happening, Sean and people like him is slowly getting the anchorages closed. I'm excited to live in a world where people think it's ok for the few to ruin it for the many.

If we all play nice, then we can have nice things. But people decide the want to things their way without thinking of the long term consequences. And while you think, sheesh it's one guy on a boat, the reality is he got press coverage and while a few are going Ohhh FOSS software, nomad life, this guy is styling. Lots of others with clout are going, Boat about to sink in my river and create a huge problem, let stop this guy and the rest from doing it.

They don't have surgical tools, they simply say "no more free anchoring within a 1000 yards of a structure", which effectively closes down most of the ICW.

Hope this was a better set of sentences.

@astrojetson

  You seem to be a snobby boater.  You remind me of the "yacht club" commadore in new jersey who waited around for me to show up so he could tell me about all  the things I couldn't do (that I hadn't even done)

I found this attitude only exists in the USA, New Zealand out of the 30 countries I sailed. All the other places people are more rational. Fortunately it's a small percentage even in these places.

The fact is, my boat is more seaworthy than many that cross the sea every year. All the really important things are sound. I do have a life jacket just so I can pass the coast guard inspection. Never used it.

The only thing you or anyone else manages to criticize me of are cosmetic issues. Saying my boat will likely sink is judging a book by it's cover. You can't tell if a boat is going to sink by looking at pictures of it!

The proposed "solutions" such as paint or scrubbing all consume resources and energy, and in some cases also cause pollution. So these are actually a negative impact for everyone.

If it becomes impossible to anchor somewhere from too many selfish people, I'm not sure why I would want to anchor in that place anyway. There are plenty of other places (and countries) where this will never happen.

>I'm excited to live in a world where people think it's ok for the few to ruin it for the many.

You already live in this world. Why does Sean get all of the moral blame, instead of the wealthy landowners who casually decide on a whim what the laws are?

Yes, yes we all get that. It's all theoretical nonsense. This is about actual laws and the damage they can cause to every other boater. You want to escape civilization, you can't. Tie a rock around your neck and dive at the Marianne's trench. Guess what you'll find on your way down? Plastic. Civilization is everywhere at this point so you can't escape it or it's rules. And at the end of the day, same with every other anarchist pipe dream, the strong one wins.

It's Sean's case it's not really nonsense. I can't know for sure what's going on through his head, but he seems to have clearly made up his mind to live life on his own terms as much as possible, even at the cost of a shorter lifespan and much comfort.

If everyone chose the "rational" way of just adapting to everything and keeping their head down, we would never have civil rights, regime changes, embryonic labor rights, and any number of struggles where people go beyond a utilitarian calculus at a great cost to themselves. This is how power balances have gotten overturned historically.

You also have some leeway of personal adaptation. It's one thing to stay within the bounds that society sets forth. It's another to grovel and revel in your servitude. For instance, looking at Astrojetson's comments, at no point did they blame the riverside landowners for their selfishness and nosiness, the blame was all on Sean for daring to do what he's doing. They were no longer psychologically able to criticize the true source of the problem.

This is completely wrong. The waters boats sail on are not law-free and you don't have the right to do whatever you want in them. There's a society of boaters using them and as such everyone has to abide to social contracts in the form of rules for the benefit of everyone. Sean has the "right" ( ethically) to do whatever he wants, everyone else has the "right"( again, ethically) to take his boat and chop it up to pieces. But instead of that we have specific rules to dictate that.

This is very true.

I've traveled the ICW from Moorehead City, NC to Dinner Key, Miami. Derelict boats bring a very bad reputation to the cruising community and have real repercussions. Also, this boat is very unlikely to pass a coast guard inspection, making it an illegal vessel, putting other boaters and rescuers at risk, as they are legally obligated to render aid if he needs it.

This is why I am concerned for his mental health. Nothing wrong with living in a boat, as I've done with children. But one must be responsible and respect the danger of the water.

Yeah, that was my thought too: it looks like a floating shanty. It's a mess, and the article linked at the end of the story shows someone else who's doing a much better job of living at sea on the cheap without turning it into a hobo squat: https://towndock.net/shippingnews/prinses-mia?pg=1

Thanks for that link. Very pretty boat, well maintained, looks just wonderful. Love all the interior woodwork that's got a nice coat of varnish on it to keep it shiny and new.

That's the kind of boat that helps the cruising community.

To be fair the “shack” guy is younger, no previous career / savings, and lives off small donations for his open-source work, while the other presumably is living off savings or family money (no offense meant, it’s a damn good use of it, but feel free to correct me here). What we see might be just a reflection of their priorities.

That was your takeway from an article mostly about how someone fixes up and runs a boat on a small budget?

This is my reply to the parent comments on how his boat looks bad and this other guy’s is better.

The article on the Dutch sailor mentions a 12-year career, family history of sailing, flights, etc; plus even with the savings his boat costs a good decade or two of the other guy’s income. As I said, feel free to correct me and I’ll be happy to retract my comments.

The edited version of your comment comes across less negative, so fair point. The initial wording about "long vacation" seemed far more dismissive.

Yes! Martijn Dijkstra is the sort of resourceful, technically-minded person that inspires the hell out of me.

Is a windlass something else or does that man have a ballista on his boat?

> Uggg. This gives everyone that is trying to live on a boat a bad name. The boat's a mess both inside and outside. As someone that cruises around for fun, boats like his create problems. Florida, Georgia and South Carolina are all working / have passed restrictions on people anchoring out.

uhghhhhh, yes. This is basically the floating equivalent of the trashy RVs that are collecting in Seattle's south of downtown industrial area.

Agree with this. Part of boating is upkeep, which is never ending.

If you like working with your hands, that upkeep can be therapeutic. But otherwise it can be drudgery. The ongoing cost, and effort, of upkeep has taken many enthusiastic boaters as eventual casualties of the pursuit.

I had a ski boat for a while. Half the upkeep problem is due to poor design of the boat.

Classic inboard ski boat with a fiberglass cover over the motor?

Sea Ray outboard, a little ski boat.

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