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Comment by xwdv | Hacker News Reader

This is why I always advocate for people to look into a BARF diet for their dogs, but too many people are squeamish about it. Some of the most powerful and healthy dogs I’ve seen all eat BARF.

Some seem to go to great lengths to watch what they eat for their own bodies, but never their dogs.

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As I had to Google it - apparently BARF is "Biologically Appropriate Raw Food".

I have to say I get the concept. Dogs just didn't evolve to eat the weird hard little grain-based pellets that a lot of people feed to them. Then again, humans didn't evolve to eat a modern Western diet either. Considering the number of fat and unhealthy dogs I see is starting to rival the number of fat and unhealthy people, perhaps that tells us something.

Just as a short aside, IIRC there is evidence that because of the very long association between humans and dogs, dogs actually _did_ evolve to make good use of some of humans' throwaways, compared to their wild relatives.

I don't have a dog, so didn't save the link, but for dog caretakers some literature review might do good (also, maybe consensus improved since then).

EDIT: obviously that doesn't necessarily translate to modern dry food.

Consider also that dogs have a shorter generation time than humans. Most dogs have eaten a grain-based diet ever since their domestication, because it's cheapest.

Back in the early 90s when I first saw the term, it was "Bones And Raw Food"; i.e. literally raw bones with meat.

But most of these are non-traditional low-grain or no grain feeds. Why would you advocate something even more radical in the same direction as a solution? If removing grain is correlated then BARF would not be the answer. Not that we know grain is the issue even, but why do you think BARF solves the problem in the FDA report?

Raw food spoils. Kibble lasts a disturbingly long time.

So does jerky. Your point?

Pickled veg, cured meat, canned veg all last disturbingly long times and yet we eat them. Just because something has a long shelf life doesn't instantly make it bad. Similarly, something that spoils (kids fromage frais yoghurts are just sugar relaly) isn't necessarily good.

A good source of information raw food is the Skeptical Vet blog (written by a vet who tries to take a scienced based look at veterinary medicine).

http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2013/11/raw-diets-for-pets/ (this is a summary page linking to all of his posts on the topic)

We tried a raw diet with our dogs for about six months, and while there were some minor benefits (less stinky poops), we ultimately switched back to kibble.

The Skept Vet also has a post on the FDA report:

http://skeptvet.com/Blog/2019/06/fda-update-on-grain-free-di...

His thoughts:

"Further data collection and research will be necessary to determine the precise relationship between diet and DCM in these cases. There are likely multiple factors involved, including the ingredients in the diet, the genetics or particular breeds and individuals, and others we may not yet know about. Pet owners feeding these diets don’t need to panic, since far more dogs on these diets do NOT have DCM than do. However, if you are feeding one of these foods, or a diet similar in composition, and especially if you are feeding this to a golden retriever, it would be a good idea to talk to your vet about screening your pet for DCM and considering a change in diet."

Thanks for the Skeptvet! Reading through all these comments, all I could think was, "Maybe I should rethink Blue Buffalo, where can I get some good information?"

We don't feed our cats grain free, so they're probably getting enough taurine, but it might make sense to have them screened for heart disease.

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