Comment by ZeKK14 | Hacker News Reader

Comment by ZeKK14 | Hacker News Reader

Renault Megane owner here (the small Talisman), i want to address some of the criticism in this thread and the article.

> The steering wheel contains two dozen buttons

The buttons on the wheel are pretty well designed and usable. The left side is all about cruise control, one button for each action: faster, slower, ON, OFF. That's it, look at the picture to check it. All these buttons are close to your hand, have great feedback, and very simple to use. It's really nice to have them here. Right side is about phone handling and the (crappy) "Siri" or the car, I only use the button to answer the phone. Behind the wheel is the radio control, which is actually standard for a Renault car.

> The cruise control buttons being next to the handbrake button reminded me of the worst car I drove

The button in the middle of the car is only to choose between "Cruise control" or "speed limited". People rarely change it and I end up mainly using it after I moved it while cleaning the car. It's okay to place it here.

> Touch screens in cars should be banned.

I have to agree the UI on this car entertainment system is terrible and slow. Some controls such as the light power on the dashboard requires 3-4 presses, which can be difficult while driving. It's a shame they never addressed this problem, this UI can receive OTA updates.

All in all, this is a really nice driving experience. The main feature are available on buttons and really fast to reach. I've droven a lot of rental cars, and I remembered fumbling several minutes in the menus of a GM to change the steering wheel settings, which is WAY simpler on a Renault.

> It's okay to place it here.

Not if you can activate it accidentally by resting your arm.

What other controls can you accidentally activate in such a manner? The closest I can think is the e-brake pedals on the floor but even then you have to draw your foot pretty far back.

You don't. To activate it, you have to click on the "ON" button on the wheel.

If you go from "cruise control" to another mode (off, or "speed limit"), it disables it.

Ok so accidentally activating speed limit mode will disable cruise control and you'll immediately start decelerating? That doesn't sound good.

Yes, that seems to be by far the biggest issue with it: it's a flip switch so you can easily toggle it by resting your arm on the center console, which would be especially likely when cruising on the freeway.

The “on” button on the wheel does not work if the button behind the parking break isn’t pressed.

And you can easily turn the cruise control off entirely by just resting your elbow on that button.

Have to agree. Moreover the cruise control reactions are petty fast.

Also switch radio station is possible with the wheel on the stick behind the steering wheel.

How does one discover that wheel.

Also: why the hell is it a wheel when there are no wheels for any other control on the steering wheel?

The manual or dealer? Most people aren't renting, I think it's fair to place function over discoverability in something you could spend years of your life operating.

If you need a manual to discover what is arguably the most commonly used function in the car, it’s a design failure.

Thanks to comments on HN and elsewhere I finally discovered the wheel. It’s horrible to say the least:

- literally nothing else in the entire car is operated via such a wheel.

- literally nothing else in the car feels like the wheel (what happens when the wheel “clicks” twice? Is it one operation (like everywhere else) or two?

- For some reason it pops up a modal window on the touch screen that shows the current song, takes a while to show the next song, and the moment it shows the next song it disappears. Why can’t it behave like next/previous buttons on the touch screen?

There’s no bottom to the abyss that is Renault design.

I just have to disagree. A car company can and should expect the users to read the manual. If you only use what's visible in the driver's seat, you'll never find the sump plug, service plan, tyre spec, engine bay...

The alternative is worse ergonomics for people who do read it to give better discoverability to those who won't.

No, a car company should expect users to read the manual for rarely used and undisciverable things. Controlling the radio is not the same as looking for the service plan. Controlling the A/C is definitely not the same as changing tyres twice a year.

Discoverability is an important part of UX, and if you can’t solve that for the most common tasks, what good is your design?

I’ve driven over forty car models over the past 8 years (I don’t own a car, so I’m always driving tentals, friends’ cars, car shares, carpools etc.). Renault is the only one that continuously confuses me with their choices (after two weeks and over 1000 km). It takes a special, oblivious kind of designer to achieve that.

Try Peugeot as well:)

Agreed, the UI is far from perfect. I would like to have buttons for lots of stuff or at least shortcuts in the dashboard.

The stick including the wheel is most likely a stock version as it is used in nearly all Renault cars for the last 10 years. I have one in my 10 year old Megane and nearly the same in the 2 year old Scenic.

The popup might be there to be able to switch Radio Stations/Titles etc. when you have something else in full screen mode (like navigation).

I would like to know what is the OS of this thing. Android? Tizen? I have this "Arkamys 3D Sound Demo" in my Bose-Scenic. But it is only a Demo. How to activate this permanently?

I'm Renaut Laguna 3rd gen (Talisman's dad) owner.

I never had any problem with the switch next to the handbrake. Maybe Talisman have it different, but I never had a thought that it could be accidentally switched. Even if I slouched so low. Talisman has to have wrongly placed arm rest or something. Also one probably should not slouch too low on cruise control, because there may be immediate need to take control.

I love how central dashboard is made in Laguna, because climate control is the thing I use the most and it's so simple: https://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plik:Renault_Laguna_2008_Dashb... Just an up/down switch to change temperature and constantly visible temperature setting.

> Behind the wheel is the radio control, which is actually standard for a Renault car.

I’ve yet to find radio control on the steering wheel. The inly controls behind yhe wheel are colume up/down and mode (IIRC), whatever mode means.

No way to cycle through radio stations or change tracks.

I have radio control on the steering wheel on my Citroën C4.

They feel like they have been thoughtfully designed, they work well and they seem easy enough to use (the thing they lack is a "next track" button, which is only on the central console) but for some reason I almost never use them and usually use the buttons on the console instead.

> I’ve yet to find radio control on the steering wheel. The inly controls behind yhe wheel are colume up/down and mode (IIRC), whatever mode means.

On some cars there's some sort of wheel in that stalk (sometimes embedded in the stalk itself so can be easy to miss as it's hidden behind the steering wheel).

Also if the volume up / down is on the radio stalk, maybe the track up / down and stations change is the arrow buttons on the handsfree controls? Or does that always just scroll through the contacts list?

I assume the mode is to switch between inputs e.g. radio / bluetooth / USB / ...

There's actually a little wheel at the back of the volume thingie where you can "scroll" to the next and previous track, etc.

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