Comment by hermitdev | Hacker News Reader

Comment by hermitdev | Hacker News Reader

In my experience, the dogs ive been around dont generally look sad. The totality of their facial expressions show their emotion.

Ive a one year old pup, border collie/labrador mix. I can take a quick glance at his face and know exactly how he's feeling. Probably 80% of the time, its pure joy. Happy to run around, chew on toys, jump on the furniture and try and play (unrequitedly) with our cats. About another 10%, he's scared of other animals he can see out of the Windows of our townhouse and barks incessantly. The other 10%, I have no idea.

Eyes on a dog don't tell the whole story. Need to look at eyes, ears, back position, tail and legs to tell.

As I write this, my dog is laying against me, calm amd near sleep. Depending on perspective, I could see his face as seeming sad, but I know he's just sleepy. He's only awake because I am and I've not put him to bed yet. But his face says to me he's calm and content. His breathing is also slowing. His favorite chew toy is inches from his mouth and against my arm and he's content to let it stay there; that's how I know he's tired. If you were to just look at a photo of my dogs face right now, he might appear sad, but I know hes just calm and sleepy.

Damn, I cannot wait to have a dog.

Getting a dog should not be an emotional decision. I have a dog and sometimes it's a lot of work. Feeding, pooping, pissing, neverending fur in the house and on my clothes, vet, constant attention seeking etc. Just to mention a few things. And if you need to travel you need a babysitter for your dog. It's easier if you have a backyard where the dog can chill.

Can confirm. I am sitting here with a 9 week old puppy that I've had since Friday. It's relentless at first.

It gets better, but the first weeks are hell. I'm so glad my dog is not a puppy anymore, even though he was really cute.

For me it was the first 3 months. Still a handful and i got more than i bargained for, but one of the better decisions ive made in life.

I feel you. When we got our rescue puppy, we were told he was around 8-9 weeks, but turned out he eas about 6 weeks old when we took him home. He was transferred to a no kill shelter outside of Chicago from a kill shelter in Kentucky. We took him home the day he was transferred. We had to bottle feed for a few weeks with formula before he was able to transition to wet food and them a few weeks later gradually transitioned him to dry food.

I spent about the first week sleeping on the floor next to him to make sure he was comfortable and to take him out if he started whining.

We were also told to expect him to top out around 35 lbs. We had him neutered on Black Friday last year. Figured he was born about May 1st last year. When he got fixed he was already 45 lean pounds. A year after bringing home, he seems to have peaked at 60 pounds, nearly twice what we told to expect. He definitely has tons of energy and is very athletic (he can easily jump entirely over our couch). He could easily clear the baby gates we have to keep him in the living room/kitchen in our townhouse. He did it once without thinking, chasing one our cats upstairs.

First 3 months or so, there were a lot of accidents with urinating and defecating in the house. And he had worms when we first brought him home. I had to carry him up and down the stairs for that period, as well. At firat because he just couldn't get up and down the stairs on his own, and then later to prevent him having an accident before getting outside (never had an accident while I was carrying him).

A year in, he's fairly well trained, but we still have some problem areas like barking and jumping on people. He's crate trained. He sleeps in his crate overnight and when we're away from home for a bit. My wife works from home and sleeps in a bit and he's gotten used to me taking him out early in the morning to do his business and goes right back into his crate on his own after having a bit of food and water until my wife wakes up an hour or so later.

Yeah the stairs was something I wasn't quite prepared for - I live on the 4th floor and have 60 steps to my garden, I have to carry our pup up and down every 2 hours at the moment (or less if she's eaten recently). She's never peed in her crate or on either of us, which is great but she has done so in the house a few times when we're ever so slightly distracted, but we're getting slightly better at it.

Glad to hear things are working out for you :)

I've often equated proper dogcare to childcare-lite.

Want to go out after work? Gotta go home and tend to the dogs first

Weekend getaway? The cost just increased by however much it's going to cost you to board the dogs or hire a sitter.

Surprise! One of your dogs has developed a thyroid condition and will require daily medication for the rest of its life.

Time for that annual teeth cleaning ($$$$$)

That said, next to fatherhood, it's one of the more rewarding things in my life.

I am fully aware of this, that's why I'm waiting until I own a home to get one. I have two kids.

Good choice. Landlords in most countries can't deny you a lease because of your children.

Thanks for the laugh.

Think about a cat instead ;)

Seriously, dogs are a shitload of work and especially, no matter how fucked the weather outside is, you gotta take the dog to walks so that the dog can take a dump. In addition, many of the larger breeds are working dogs which means that they require massive amounts of attention and daily exercise so they don't literally go mad. Please do proper research upon the characteristics of your desired breed, and don't take in a rescue dog as your first dog either. Rescue dogs can and will have psychological issues.

I've had cats over the years, and currently have 1 cat and 3 dogs (my wife is part of a dog rescue). While cats are easier, IMO they do not give the same emotional reward that dogs give.

You are absolutely right about understanding the breed and the work a dog requires. It makes my wife and I sad whenever we see someone get a 'cute' working dog puppy that requires proper exercise, and then barely letting it outside 2x/day.

Any dog can have psychological issues, so all dogs should be trained. I highly recommend taking a training class with any new dog. The basics are easy, and generally work.

EDIT I wanted to also add that insurance is a good thing to have with a dog. I never want to be in the vet and have to make a medical decision based on cost. My 2 year old dog had to have back surgery and the vet explained that many people just put the dog down when this injury happens even though it's completely fixable and recoverable otherwise.

I'd go a step further and say pet insurance is basically a requirement if you want to give your pet a solid existence without needing to hold a big chunk of money in case of emergency. There are few things sadder to me than someone putting an animal down for a fixable issue.

WRT cats, I'd argue that perhaps you just haven't met the right cat. :P I've come to think there's an expectation incongruity at play in that people who are used to dogs are thrown off when a cat wants his/her alone time, whereas a dog is pretty much always "on" socially. Becoming the target of a cat's affection is imo emotionally rewarding in a special way partially because they don't give it away to just anyone.

> I'd go a step further and say pet insurance is basically a requirement

No argument here. It's saved me a few times now where sudden very large bills would have been hard to stomach.

> WRT cats, I'd argue that perhaps you just haven't met the right cat.

My original comment was too far on one side. I debated how to say it for a few minutes while writing. I had one cat for almost 17 years and he was awesome. My connection with him was just different than with my dogs. But you're right that it is more different than better or worse.

In terms of emotional reward it really depends on the cat, I have two, a boy who is about 17lbs (not fat just big) and a little girl who is maybe 7lbs, the boy just does his thing with the occasional headbutting on the way past but the girl, she just wants to sit on my knee all the time, she'll snuggle up across my shoulders and go to sleep (and stay there when I get up for tea), when I'm at home her purr is my constant companion.

We got them really young (rescues) and she just bonded to me from the start :).

This meme of not getting rescue dogs is so harmful and needs to stop. Good adoption agencies will foster the dogs for a while and let you know if the dog actually has behavioral issues. Plenty of them don't. I'm convinced my rescue's previous owner was a little old lady who died or something. He has no issues at all.

Every time I look at my amazing rescue dog (my first dog ever) and think about how he was almost put to death in a kill shelter it brings me to tears and I'm so happy that I have him.

Agreed 100%. There's nothing magical about pure bred dogs that makes them behaviorally superior, and furthermore there's a world of breed-specific health issues that come with pure bred dogs, not to mention the difficulty of making sure you're not inadvertently supporting a puppy mill. Any rescue worth their salt will let you do a trial anyways, so if you find out you've got a serial killer on your hands it's not like you're stuck.

Dad's a vet and regularly says he's very thankful for the work purebreds provide. If everyone had mutts, there would be a lot less need for vets.

You're both correct.

It's not purebred vs rescued mutt. It's the age of the dog and whether or not it was mistreated and developed problems that new owners are unlikely to know how to fix.

Young rescues are usually fine.

As you noted, a good rescue agency will do their homework before placing dogs. Not all rescues are good.

And of course, all dogs should be put through a puppy skills course of some sort, even if they're not puppies. Most pet stores and many boarding facilities run classes. They're as much for the owner as the animal.

I've owned three dogs as an adult, the first two from breeders, the 3rd from a rescue. The rescue has had more behavioral issues than the two I raised as puppies. All the behavioral issues are directly linkable to his previous owner (a puppy mill, where he was kept crated most of the day). It's been a TON of work to get him to a point where he's mostly well-adjusted (and I knew going in this would be true). If he had been my first dog, he likely would have been my last as well.

> Not all rescues are good.

Yes. Any one can call themselves a rescue. And rescues can have a wide variety of beliefs and procedures.

It is not a meme. Rescue dogs often have issues. While not all, probably >50% in my personal ~10 dog sample size. At 50% it is worth a warning to new dog owners and shouldn't be outright dismissed.

Rescue dogs are usually surrendered because the owner didn't train them. So even excluding any emotional issues, the dog has to be broken of bad habits. A new puppy won't soil where it sleeps, so house training is easy. But a dog that's been locked up most of it's life will, and extra effort in training is needed... not the best for a new dog owner.

I don't know how to say this without sounding like a jerk, but it's not the tone it's intended in: Getting a dog should not be an emotional decision.

This goes double when it comes to larger or more powerful breeds like ASTs, Dobermans, boxers, etc. A Pomeranian that's bitey is regrettable, a Rottweiler that's bitey is dangerous. Getting a shelter pet is a lot like buying a used car in that you're signing up for a lot of unknowns.

Also, unless you live in a metro area, you're probably limited in your choice of shelters. There is nothing, absolutely nothing, wrong with a reputable pet store (read: one not supplied by puppy mills) or breeder if you're the slightest bit uncomfortable with the shelter or their selection. This also means you're more likely to get a breed that fits your lifestyle and living situation.

No offense taken at all and I think this is all great advice. The actual decision to get a dog should be deliberate and thought out. I just hope that people will at least consider shelters / rescues and not rule them out immediately because of what my parent comment said.

in LA, i had a good experience adopting my dog last year through the NKLA adoption center (https://nkla.org/) which is organized by https://bestfriends.org/, a national rescue organization.

they told me as much as they could about her from the 10 days they’d had her (for spaying, vaccines, and microchipping) after rescuing her from the county shelter (who found her wandering the streets).

her main behavioral issue was anxiety, probably partially due to prior abuse (she’s cautious around bigger men), which manifested mainly as nervous diarrhea for the first two months, along with panting and self-scratching/gnawing. it took some work to get her to trust me so she could self-regulate her anxiety and calm down at home.

but she’s a bundle of joy, eager to please, very playful & friendly (with dogs & people), and so attuned to me, that i feel immensely lucky to have found her. i wouldn’t trade her for the world!

> This meme of not getting rescue dogs is so harmful and needs to stop.

I said nothing against rescue dogs, just that it is very, very unwise to adopt one as your first dog with no dog experience prior to it.

> Good adoption agencies will foster the dogs for a while and let you know if the dog actually has behavioral issues.

That's the first thing, how does one find out about the quality of the adoption agency? Plus fostering seems to be a US thing, haven't heard of this in Germany.

> and think about how he was almost put to death in a kill shelter

That's the second problem. Kill shelters are a horrible concept, in Germany this is prohibited by animal welfare laws.

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