I was offered a job at Foxconn to assemble iPhones for $1.7 per hour
scmp.com
scmp.com
Many damning things in the report but this straight up racism demands a firm response from Apple.
Board: Will that make us more profitable?
Tim: We will become less profitable, but in the long term, people will see that we-
Board: No.
> These conditions on ethnicity do not appear on the Foxconn website, but do adorn the walls of private job agencies hiring directly for the technology giant
isn't it cute that FoxConn doesn't make that as a policy but subcontractors do?
Fight with racism is purely white peoples concept. Racism is a term usually doesn't even exist outside of Europe/North America. So we shouldn't try to put our mentality on top of China, as we are not the sole source of truth in this world.
But me, an European, saying to Chinese how they must live and behave - this is just neo colonialism. They should figure this out on their own.
As for Israel, I am sympathetic to a small, democratic nation populated by the descendants of a western genocide, which is surrounded by hostile autocratic or theocratic neighbors. However that’s my opinion. If Israel’s existence is somehow against your ethics, I won’t force you to trade with them. I would just criticize you more directly.
The production of intelligence in this thread :)
Not to mention that the numbers are meaningless without a sense of price levels. My cousin is a lawyer in Delhi and lives a life that would be recognizable to your I as very upper-middle class, and yet his equivalent USD salary is roughly one tenth of mine.
Are they in fact starvation wages? I'm the last person to defend Apple, and I'm all for emotional appeals about ethical issues, but they're useless without an understanding of the facts, and none of the complainants on this thread seem interested in understanding whether what they're saying is accurate, presumably on the off chance that they'd lose the opportunity to pay themselves on the back for their outrage.
Saying that Foxconn workers are being paid "starvation wages" is an infinitely different question from whether they're getting paid "adequately" (a squishy term that contains several orders of magnitude within it) relative to Apple's margins. It's very difficult for me to believe that people who are as uninterested in understanding the facts of the situation as your comment implies actually care about the situation or these people at all.
Understanding the factual landscape of the situation is separate from having an emotional response to it, but it is a prerequisite. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, and economically illiterate (or willfully ignorant) emotional appeals like the one you're making have done immense damage to humanity.
I'm not even just talking about the standard examples of Communist dictatorships: there are a million less dramatic examples, like the straightforward Indian child labor law that did almost nothing but damage to the people it was supposed to protect: metrics across the board worsened for the families in question, including years of education, calories consumed, and most damningly, _hours of child labor_ (which increased).
By the way, I'm not insensitive to the notion that the balance between capital and labor's share of income could use some improvement. My point is about the damage that disinterest in understanding the distinction causes.
From what I've heard, Foxconn is a highly desirable place to work with top of market pay and benefits. A lot of people move just to work for Foxconn.
So clearly there's a dynamic going on here that'll take more nuance to understand than can be painted with a broad brush stroke from a Western perspective.
That doesn't seem to be the case. Of course the "market rate" will always depress wages as much as possible, because that's what markets are supposed to do - and also to excuse.
But there are human externalities, and it takes a rather strange view of the value of human life to ignore them.
https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2017/jun/18/foxconn-l...
I'm amused that you're saying this about Communist China. :D
There are complex geopolitical, social, and economic factors involved. In the system that exists, Foxconn is actually one of the better if not best actors.
But of course HN wants to boil it down to Apple cutting a check to Foxconn employees because iPhone.
Yes let's severely gimp a domestic company that generates over 5% of America's GDP (and 1% of the world's) in favor of paying Chinese manufacturers much more - when China incessantly steals American IP without care and prevents foreign companies from competing in their domestic markets. Great idea.
I think there's some parallel with Uber's contractor-vs-employee situation but it's much more apparent when you consider these people are exclusively working on Apple devices, within Apple's supply chain, subject to Apple's rules and rulings, even some of the components and the software come from Apple employees.
Their $1.70 an hour should be compared to the US federal minimum wage or something because that's the number Apple decided to skip out on, even as they hoarded a quarter trillion dollars.
- Anonymous Chinese Worker
https://www.theatlantic.com/technology/archive/2012/01/many-...
Again, I don't point this out because I think the conditions are OK. I simply point this out to provide context and relativity to the situation. Do you really think Apple is responsible for fixing China's problems? I don't think so. But they DO take responsibility and have made strides in improving conditions for workers that work on their products. And that, I can appreciate.
The article states differently:
>> Foxconn is known for its high staff turnover, largely because of the low monthly salary of 2,100 yuan per month (US$313) in Zhengzhou. By comparison, the average salary in the city of Zhengzhou in 2018 was 6,929 yuan (US$1,035) per month.
That's why they still hire humans. If the above statement wasn't true, they would be replaced with a robotic system.
Just curious.