Comment by morrbo | Hacker News Reader

Comment by morrbo | Hacker News Reader

I hope to god Deliveroo takes some of Amazon's customer service tips/experience. Deliveroo's customer service is the absolute worst of any company i've ever experienced. So much so that they've had news articles[1] published in the UK about how much they try and screw people over.

Deliveroo, Uber Eats, Just Eat also (again, speaking for the UK) do not list restaurants' food safety/hygienic ratings, which is a requirement to run a restaurant in the UK[2]. This has lead to people like a comedian here (Joe Lycett) making a restaurant in a skip (a big industrial waste disposal unit) and getting food delivered to himself to see if it would work[3]...and it did.

If that wasn't bad enough, in London, Deliveroo actively masks restaurants' locations. For example, you order from "my 5 star restaurant" but the food might not actually come from the restaurant, instead it comes from a metal shipping container, under a bridge, next to a train track. These, are made by Deliveroo and, again, have no safety ratings/hygienic information.[4]

[1] (example) https://www.independent.co.uk/news/business/deliveroo-food-o...

[2] https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-45888709

[3] https://twitter.com/joelycett/status/1085924299339452420?lan...

[4] https://www.theguardian.com/business/2017/oct/28/deliveroo-d...

This has been my experience, several times, it really isn't a unique experience. Their policy seems to be to cut corners and hold on to money as much as physically possible. Don't get me wrong, i love the idea, and convenience of it all and use all 3 apps pretty regularly. Given the amount of money they make they should all seriously step up their game in terms of just not being shady bastards.

> Deliveroo actively masks restaurants' locations

This is what allows you to order from a restaurant that is otherwise too far away from you. It's arguably of great benefit to those who do not live in that delivery area.

> it comes from a metal shipping container, under a bridge, next to a train track

The metal shipping container has been outfitted to modern standards precisely for this purpose, as opposed to down some stairs in a windowless Victorian cellar, under a bridge, next to a traintrack, which many 'real' restaurant kitchens are like.

> These, are made by Deliveroo

No they are not, the chefs are employed by the restaurant, and are making the same dishes to the same standards.

> This is what allows you to order from a restaurant that is otherwise too far away from you. It's arguably of great benefit to those who do not live in that delivery area.

So? They still do it, this is shady business practices which is what the whole point of my post was about. They've started adding a badge "5 star restaurant affiliate" or something similar. They only did this after they were called out on it by the mainstream news.

> The metal shipping container has been outfitted to modern standards precisely for this purpose, as opposed to down some stairs in a windowless Victorian cellar, under a bridge, next to a traintrack, which many 'real' restaurant kitchens are like.

It still comes from somewhere which is not where i ordered it from. Agree with me or not, the food still comes from (literally) a metal shipping container which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations, and is rented out to different restaurants/people from one day to the next. Also that "windowless Victorian cellar" WOULD have been given a food hygiene rating, otherwise it wouldn't be able to operate. Whether or not that rating is good is not the point, the point is that a government official has gone in and rigorously tested it, it is subject to surprise visits, etc. You should be able to easily view this information as you already can online at https://ratings.food.gov.uk. Can you say the same about the shipping containers which don't have a postcode (so you can't check)?

> No they are not, the chefs are employed by the restaurant, and are making the same dishes to the same standards.

I didn't mean the food, i meant the containers. But if we are talking about the food, you can almost guarantee that "5 star restaurant" isn't going to be sending their best chefs away from the proper kitchen into a metal box. Again, this is shady as hell and deceptive.

> which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations

That's factually wrong. Of course, the same regulations apply to those facilities as any other.

> Can you say the same about the shipping containers which don't have a postcode (so you can't check)?

yes.

The regulations may be the same but the FSA rating you can look up for the restaurant probably doesn't include an inspection of the shipping container, if it is inspected at all.

> the food still comes from (literally) a metal shipping container

1. This is only true in some cases, there are all variety of hire kitchens used in this program. 2. Much food you consume comes from a metal shipping container at some point, because they are suitable for many different purposes. Is one use okay but the other not?

> this is shady business practices which is what the whole point of my post was about

As a customer, I truly believe this to be a innovative business practice that benefits me. The restaurants are marked as 'Editions' partners.

> a metal shipping container which has not been certified to the British food health/safety regulations

The only partners allowed to use Editions kitchens have a 4 or 5 star hygiene rating for their main kitchen.

You do realise that the ratings are based on the practices used in that kitchen and not the building itself don't you?

Essentially the exact same kitchen could be a zero or a five star rating based on what the chefs do with the food and the environment.

So the idea of the 'metal box' being somehow inherently unsuitable - when the interiors are fitted out to the highest modern standards and used by teams who have already proven they meet high hygiene ratings - is simply not true or useful.

> It still comes from somewhere which is not where i ordered it from.

If you have worked in a restaurant kitchen you will have observed that this is true of much of the food that goes on the plate. This includes: 1. additional unseen kitchens where the bulk of cooking takes place 2. entirely separate kitchen where prep takes place, often days beforehand 3. part-made dishes and ingredients ordered in and made in locations unknown to you 4. pre-made sauces, breads, entire dishes ordered in and made in locations unknown to you

Show me the hygiene rating of the kitchen where your fries or ketchup are actually produced.

> you can almost guarantee that "5 star restaurant" isn't going to be sending their best chefs away from the proper kitchen into a metal box

Most kitchens will use their best chefs at new locations precisely to ensure their success, the trainees will take over at the main location due to its ease and familiarity.

> I hope to god Deliveroo takes some of Amazon's customer service tips/experience.

My experience of Amazon and Deliveroo's customer service has been pretty similar. I don't get to talk to a human, but if I do raise an issue (late delivery from Amazon, missing items from a Deliveroo order) I fairly quickly get a response apologising for it and giving me some free credit.

Interesting points about the way they handle restaurants though. I've noticed a few of the ones that you describe, that are not actually real restaurants. Since Deliveroo is useless at showing reviews and ratings, I'll usually search for places online before I order from there, if I haven't heard of them. A bunch of the takeaways on Deliveroo in my area all have the same address, an industrial estate - as you say, by a train track, probably in a metal shipping container.

I've not had bad expeirences with those "restaurants" to be fair, but it does highlight that Deliveroo is cheating the system and hiding how they actually do things. I hadn't considered the hygiene aspect, that is worrying that they can get away with selling food without the usually required safety/hygiene levels.

It's interesting that Deliveroo has beaten Amazon at their own game in the UK. Amazon Restaurants was a thing for a while as their answer to Deliveroo, but it didn't take off. I think it still exists, but last time I checked there were about 5 restaurants available in my area, compared to 50+ on Deliveroo and Uber Eats. Deliveroo's tactics really don't feel that far removed from Amazon's though.

They're not _quite_ as bad as you used to be. They still do not show an address or registered business name. So many will still find it next to impossible to see a rating unless they do some sleuthing. As without this basic information you cannot search for the rating.

The thing I thought was most cheeky was that they put a link to the now useless FSA rating search page. Not to the kitchen rating page. That still seems pretty shady to me.

Yes and in London it's still significantly more expensive than grabbing food from a brick and mortar restaurant IME. It's crazy that they do not produce the food on restaurant premises, do not have to pay normal London rents and are still more expensive than normal restaurants, even when including delivery by restaurants which offer their own delivery. Is that extra money all going to their drivers?

This hasn’t been my experience. Any problems with an order, they refund immediately no questions asked and add an extra £5 as an apology. Over the years, this has been consistent.

Uber Eats customer service is like pulling teeth. Never had a refund after several incidents and we try not to use them any more.

Until they ban you for “abusing” it despite providing evidence every time. They shut down my account with over 4k£ spent in a year because of that. Haven’t regularly used them since then.

Not my experience with Eats at all. Refunds always, no questions except during a brief stint I was asking for a lot of refunds in a short time. YMMV.

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