Do people actually buy laptop/desktop from system76? I tried to price a laptop from them before and it was quite expensive compare to main stream vendors like Dell.
Its cheaper just buy a OEM laptop and slap ubuntu on it.
Its cheaper just buy a OEM laptop and slap ubuntu on it.
Look at it like you would a Macbook; Apple charges a premium but the benefit the buyer receives from that extra cost is hardware and software that feels cohesive and works perfectly together. I'm not saying System76 has reached that same mark just yet, but it's what they are working towards and they have made great progress in that endeavor.
With all of that said, there's something to buying a used or marked-down Thinkpad and installing your distro of choice; you'll (usually) get a great device with excellent Linux community support, and in my opinion the industrial design of the Thinkpad series is more appealing than System76 machines. Personally I don't care for Lenovo because of their past malware shenanigans, but they do make solid hardware.
I'm giving Dell a try. You can buy them with Ubuntu factory installed or buy with Windows and 'slap the distro of your choice' on it. I have an XPS-13 9370 and after nearly a year, the WiFi finally seems to be working reliably (using Debian Testing.)
I got the XPS15 and installed Ubuntu 18.04 (best choice of laptop I could find that had an i9 8950hk, although only Windows is officially supported).
I had heard it was best to replace the Killer WiFi with an Intel mini card. However the Killer WiFi has been rock solid for me with Ubuntu (I have read that Windows has more problems with Killer WiFi than Linux!).
Regular Linux BIOS updates from Dell from within Ubuntu 18.04 - I'm a happy customer.
Edit: comment from elsewhere in this thread: "only three years ago I had to replace the default wireless card in my Dell XPS 13 because the broadcom one was flaky as hell in Linux"
I think that Debian is getting the firmware updates too, though for the last one it didn't apply so I just booted Ubuntu and it worked w/out issue. (It uses EFI which is another benefit of that.)
02:00.0 Network controller: Qualcomm Atheros QCA6174 802.11ac Wireless Network Adapter (rev 32)
Subsystem: Bigfoot Networks, Inc. Killer 1435 Wireless-AC
Kernel driver in use: ath10k_pci
I have had a few Dells and I think hardware-wise it is the best, but that dual video card setup never worked quite right. Also until Fedora 29 came out (with a newer kernel) the only distro that I could install was the stock Ubuntu that came with the laptop (which didn't have full disk encryption, unfortunately).
I would recommend a Lenovo T580 or Dell XPS 15/5520. I think the Dell hardware is actually nicer than Apple, which is a high compliment.
I have also used regularly a t450 and t470 for work, and last year bought an anniversary t25 as a Xmas gift for myself :).
Prior to that, I've used T530, T410, T60p, T41, T30, etc.
My boss has been put on notice that a Thinkpad is a "condition of employment" for me - I cannot imagine using anything else.
All of them have been absolutely positively rock solid. No issues as daily drivers for a travelling consultant - lots of plugging and unplugging, moving, backpacks, etc.
Mostly various Windows versions, but T450 and T470 are RHEL full time, and I have a T61 with Lubuntu as well.
That being said, for any brand, there'll be people with good and bad luck/experience. You have to look at your preferences, and stats...
Just bought an X230, put OpenBSD in it and it is just perfect in the summer house. Put a SIM card in it and connect to the internet from everywhere. Superb keyboard, fast, small, durable, everything replaceable.
I also have a T25 at home for development and can't say anything bad from that either, albeit a bit too big for carrying around.
Check the APN from your operator's settings.
- Try the card first in a phone. Preferably turn on the SIM lock and change the PIN code.
- Insert the card to the laptop, boot.
- `doas ifconfig umb0 apn your.apn.com`
- `doas ifconfig umb0 pin XXXX`
- `doas ifconfig umb0 up`
- Confirm the gateway from `ifconfig umb0` when it appears, should say inet and it's the second IP.
- When gateway is visible, `doas route add -ifp umb0 default XXX.XXX.XXX.XXX`
- Confirm the DNS works, but you should now be able to access internet.
Sometimes when you turn off the power or suspend, you might need to enter the PIN to the card, turn the device up and set the route again. A player automates this with a script. :)
You can store the settings to `/etc/hostname.umb0`.
[0] Lenovo H5321 gw
(my ideal complement to current stable would be a 10" or 11" think 8GB linux-compatible... and while dreaming, with a trackpoint. The whole netbook market seems to have bloomed than disappeared - but if ever there was a place to use the little red nubbin instead of tiny trackpad, that was it I think:)
I really feel it's much nicer to travel with this than my slimmer T25, but of course it's subjective.
Same. My Thinkpad 25 has already been back twice. And both their field service and their factory service have really gone downhill.
As much as I love the keyboard, this may be my last Thinkpad.
I got my X230 and it's so fast I really question the need for the new CPU generations...
Kudos to them for doing so.
https://cassidyjames.com/resume/
Having used ElementaryOS for two years I had thought that if my next laptop was a System76 I'd give Pop a go.
I do hope they become the Mac of Linux.
System76 does much more than just pre-install the OS. The below comment is from a system76 developer:
https://www.omgubuntu.co.uk/2019/04/system76-launch-pop-os-1...
"System76 laptops aren't rebranded. Clevo is a manufacturer of standardized chassis models for OEMs who lack the sales figures to warrant high volume orders. The individual OEMs get to benefit from lower prices because every OEM is pitching in together to allow Clevo to design and commit high volume orders of chassis on their behalf.
Using a Clevo chassis does not make your laptop a rebrand, in much the same way that a Gigabyte motherboard or Vivo desktop case does not automatically make your custom-built PC a rebranded Gigabyte/Vivo desktop. They manufacture the chassis (incl. battery and motherboard), and then distribute these to OEMs, who then select the components to assemble the chassis with. This also has the benefit of giving the customer a highly serviceable laptop.
This really isn't all that different from what Apple, Dell, Lenovo, HP, etc., are all doing. Many of them are even getting their laptops manufactured in the nearby vicinity of Clevo in a similar fashion. They're just a step closer to the designing stage of their chassis models, because they are able to purchase high volume orders by themselves. They still often outsource firmware development to third parties, rather than writing their own firmware for the hardware they sell.
In comparison to other Clevo-based sellers, System76 also goes the extra mile to select Linux-compatible components during assembly, writes patches to fix drivers in Linux for the hardware selected, flashes custom firmware on them, and are now even driving the process of writing open source firmware for them. You're not going to find Clevo writing open source firmware."
The build quality is not MBP standards, but support has been great (replaced a keyboard no questions asked when a key failed, helped me debug some updates that I screwed up) and the price premium is higher than total DIY, but certainly nothing in the range of say, Apple hardware.
PopOS is pretty nifty and I like it more than stock Ubuntu. I also like the amount of work they are doing to advance the Linux ecosystem hardware wise, software wise, and evangelism wise.
I could quibble about some of the laptop tradeoffs (heavy AF and pretty awful battery life and fan noise) but I knew those going in, and decided they were worth it for a dev machine that mostly lives plugged in on my desk.
So far, yes. Once they start shipping coreboot, the balance changes. They provide something that no other OEM (other than chromebooks and purism atm) do.
There's LAC Portland and they were super friendly, I might try to buy a computer from them if my computer dies (and ask for debian or something).
Also, thanks for the heads up about LAC Portland.
They have the newer thinner versions of that laptop (we use them at work), but they have no enterprise-grade support and they all have different quirks (I mean at least have the same quirk, right...?!). If you're trying to replace a keyboard during business hours, and you're a high-level engineer charging hundreds of dollars per hour, and it takes a long time to change the keyboard and learn one skill one time, it will cost the business a pretty penny.
I'd get the Dell Precision 5530 or XPS 13 w/ Project Sputnik for a business setting. It's Dell, and it's the highest-level laptop they sell, so at least they'll take the machine back if it doesn't work (I believe the XPS/Precision line follow a special QA process from other commodity stuff), and I don't think Project Sputnik will disappear anytime soon (actually expanding IIRC).
Keyboard was so terrible and wifi dropped out in so annoying ways that I end up smashing mine (I reused the CPU and other components in a barebones later). This was 2013, though.
It is large and heavy so I still use my MacBook when traveling.
My laptop had a bad video chip.
My manager's desktop had either a bad SSD or a bad SATA bus.
I won't buy from them.