I Dream of Canteens
dinnerdocument.com
dinnerdocument.com
I would love for nothing more than a basic, no-frills establishment that serves simple, healthy food, counter-service style so I don't have to deal with uppity yet somehow obsequious servers grubbing for tips, as I'm more than happy to bring my own damn food to my own damn table and am more than capable of filling a water glass when I'm thirsty. I'd much rather save money, enjoy my meal in peace and put my dishes in a bin on my way out than deal with the conspicuous consumption as a performance that so much of dining out has become these days.
However, you seem to have a real misconception about the industry ("money-grubbing", etc.). Margins in the restaurant business outside of fast-food are generally really low, and in the actual fine dining segment, even worse (3% would not be unusual there. Go ahead, try running a business successfully at that sort of rate). You are right, they are competing on "experience" but that is because it is what most people seem to respond to - and it is very expensive to deliver that experience. Besides, if not experience - what - convenience? That's where fast-food comes in.
To me personally the middle of the market, particularly the non fast-food chains are the worst trade-off, though I understand why some people love them. I'd much rather play $35 for an entree that was amazing and I have no idea how to make, than $18 for one I could have done a better job of at home for $5... but I'm a good cook and a lot of people aren't or don't have the time.
There are a lot of things not to like about the way it works (many entrees are a loss, margin made up on drinks/desert, servers ludicrously underpaid which pushes their reliance on tips, back of house just ludicrously underpaid, etc.).
I totally get why you might want to avoid the entire thing (and also why others wouldn't) and wish there was more available in the segment you prefer. It's worth remembering though, that to a first approximation nobody is getting rich doing this - most places struggle at best. There are also a ton of people in the industry that really believe (rightly or wrongly) in food and its ability to provide you with experiences you can't easily (or at all) replicate other ways.
Sometimes I want pizza and beer, and that can be 100% as good, too. Usually cheaper if only because it's more efficient, though.
Working hourly is a reasonable thing, though in my case I'm not. The other two are completely unrealistic. Working my job for that extra hour or two just leads to burnout.
When I'm at home preparing a meal my family is there, sometimes helping (watching your 5 year old cut something for the first time with a knife is a scary moment you don't want to miss), sometimes singing in the next room. Either way I make far more than $100/h when I make a meal for my family even though the only money exchanged is what I pay for groceries.
Your second point is, basically, that you like the work (on meal prep). But that is completely besides that point.
The way you should look at this is: would you agree to serve meals for $12 for a neighboor's family of 4? And I bet the answer is no, you would not.
If my neighbors decide that the meals they can buy are good enough that is their choice. I won't enforce "my good taste" on them. I find the value is not there.
The Parts Unknown Nashville episode also had a good look at cafeteria style dining that you may enjoy.
https://explorepartsunknown.com/nashville/when-all-you-need-...
I personally would love such an establishment in my small city.
Chicago version:
https://www.revivalfoodhall.com/
Raleigh version:
http://www.morganfoodhall.com/
And a bunch more:
https://www.thedailymeal.com/eat/50-best-food-halls-america-...
https://www.google.com/search?q=cafe+pyrus+kitchener&tbm=isc...
Healthy, inexpensive food. Order at the counter, they bring it to you when it's ready. Bus your own table when you're done. Extremely basic decor, but they're a community spot, with fairly frequent mini-concerts, a monthly poetry slam, etc.
Canteens (stolavaya) are alive and well in Russia, and were my favorite places to eat because of the variety and thrift.
Here's how one is arranged: https://i.ytimg.com/vi/Ml0F97OZu6k/maxresdefault.jpg
Here's what your tray might look like at the end: https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/0c/46/f7/cc/...
https://www.prlog.org/10985847-wwwbostonmarketcom.jpg
Or the inside of most any Whole Foods or other upscale grocer.
A food court is different. There are a bunch of vendors surrounding a common eating area. Sadly because it’s America, it’s the same 10 fast food or fast food like vendors in every food court, mostly. You might see more variety in an airport.
https://4.bp.blogspot.com/-IYKR9N0VneA/UZ96KquXbYI/AAAAAAAAD...
https://s3-media2.fl.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/b3jONzG2-_wI804mxVBX...
https://r.housebaltimore.com/ has become extremely popular, and several markets are being renovated with a similar approach. The prices vary somewhat depending on the type of stall, but in general they are within a fast-food price-range, not a restaurant.
Mall food courts also have a similar experience.
Unless you work next to the food court, and take the time to figure out what's good, your average stop at one will result in disappointment.
I know of at least one chain [1] in Europe that matches your description.
One of the great pleasures of my workday is eating at the local McDonalds, which is clean, run by nice people, and elegantly designed with plenty of natural light. They allow me to stay and use their free wifi for a couple hours if I wish. They have never even suggested that I leave, even after a marathon 3 hour visit. As a person who grew up not rich in a not safe place, I continue to be amazed such a thing is possible. My go-to meal is two cheeseburgers (substitute white cheddar) and unlimited fountain drinks for under USD$3.50, so I'm probably good for a few hundred bucks a year to them. Not exactly a prime customer.
For whatever reason, maybe because I get jacked up on 3 diet cokes by the end of a long visit, it's a fantastic place for me to learn challenging material. I bring a big iPad and a $20 Bluetooth keyboard/iPad stand, then study my ass off and take notes in vim. I am under huge stress lately, and having to absorb a massive amount of technical literature fast while I undertake rewriting a running, production site with a very tight deadline.
Don't think I'm not thankful for the opportunity every time it happens. It's a huge privilege IMHO.
I’ve also failed a lot, like the time when I spent $1,400,000 of my own money trying to beat craigslist.
Here's what your tray might look like at the end: https://media-cdn.tripadvisor.com/media/photo-s/0c/46/f7/cc/...
You get charged per item, so it's higher quality than AYCE buffet. There's tons of variety, and you get to see your food before you purchase it. The closest thing I've seen in the US might be Bakeman's restaurant in Seattle, but it was sandwich-focused. The combination of hearty food with a plethora of options and minimal service is not something I've seen in the US. Some college cafeterias or museum dining areas are similar, but usually with less variety.
Cooperative living (very much in the same vein) sustained me through college.
'adulthood' is comparatively extremely isolating.
Where is one supposed to find a tribe, in a city, in this day and age?
We could use these in the US. I guess hackerspaces may come close in spirit, but I’ve never been.
Intramural sports, meetup groups, work, bars, gyms, etc. all work very well.
Hobbies are a good way to meet people. Volunteer work is better.
> You have to get off the computer and go outside.
That has nothing to do with it.
The kinds of institutions I want to be part of don't really exist in the US
Warm and welcoming places that invite all to step in from the cold and stay awhile.
Housing coops and canteens exist but are not common.
Worker coops on the other hand...
I sincerely believe that a well-organized tech worker coop would eat the world. The incentives are fundamentally misaligned for the average worker in the modern corporation. I'm well aware that I'm getting taking advantage of everyday when I show up to work, and that sets a pretty low upper bound on the amount of fucks I give about someone else's corporation.
'disrupt' that and you'll be unstoppable.
This make the B2B stuff easier, as many malls are owned my massive groups that run even dozens of malls - and they can make a contract with a large franchise operation to cover many/all of them (or a restaurant group that can provide different options). They also don't have to worry about risk on the rent much.
Notice how food quality etc. didn't show up in previous para?
http://www.morganfoodhall.com/
(“Morgan Street Food Hall is a new lifestyle dining concept; not to be confused with a food court.” Ugh I almost didn’t visit the place since the web site is so fucking pretentious.)
I first visited one of these in Chicago.
My preference is a city park surrounded by food trucks. But these aren’t reliable, only work when the weather is good, etc.
Other than urban planning, the abundance of street food and lack of tipping culture in Asia also probably helps.
Last year I was in Flushing, Queens NYC and visited this basement canteen. It had the desired features mentioned in the article. I'm not South-Asian, but I didn't feel at all unwelcome. It was raining that day, and I sat and drank tea for a little while to wait for the rain to shop. Cheap, decent food. Plenty of seating.
I wonder how that would do in the United States.
I think the time is better than ever for that kind of restaurant. People have mostly accepted the culinary necessity and dietary acceptability of salt and oil, so the forced dichotomy between the ethnic vegetarian restaurants and the insufferably bland ones is a relic of the past.
Maybe having this to fight about would distract some of our stupidity from real policy questions. That could be a win.
> Unlike in Homer’s Odyssey, there will be no massacre if people stay longer than they should or have more free refills than is calculated to be ideal.
This is funny but also grossly unfair to Odysseus and Telemachus.
After the war Conservatives dismissed them in parliament because they weren’t making profit. The canteens were allowed to decline, then disappear.
Where I live, and apparently where the author lives, there's no way they could survive without government support, because they don't extract as much money from the space as other styles of restaurant do. The restaurant business is very tough, even without serving affordable food to all classes and providing ample space for lingering.
It's mind-bendingly frustrating to me that eating out in the UK seems to be a fundamentally unhealthy affair.
I just want meat and two veg, a curry without a wad of oil, spaghetti bolognese, whatever. A standard staple meal without a ton of additives or other weirdness.
If anyone knows of places like this in London I'm all ears. The best I can think of right now is IKEA food court which isn't the healthiest and isn't next to anything else.
Basically anywhere I can think of serves bastardizations of real food. Polish milk bars, as stated below, are the only time I think I've ever eaten real food outside of a private home.
The military has canteens. Leaving the budget per meal per soldier aside, there is inherent difficulty to providing food for hundreds of thousands of people within a short period, and to providing such food at a relatively consistent level of quality. Most organizations tasked with providing such a large quantity of food over a short period of time resort to outsourcing supply to food service companies which generally provide processed food which is either frozen or shelf-stable. Fresh produce is difficult and "healthy and delicious" is practically a pipe dream.
There is a way to deal with this - hire an educated chef who can nurture relationships with many local farmers to negotiate supply, and actively manage the kitchen to make the best of the locally-sourced supply, not waste any of it, and put out a variety of dishes that, while not consistent in their contents from day-to-day, are consistently delicious. This is what Patrick Wodni [1] does for a Berlin hospital, but he's an exception because he was willing to take a large pay cut to work there. How many Patrick Wodnis are out there, for how many canteens would we need?
[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/05/world/europe/germany-chef...
And....they still exist today. Krakow has one literally right in the city centre, next to the most premium of premium estates, where a restaurant literally right next door will have "western" levels of pricing, and yet they continue to serve simple, basic food for ~$1-3 per portion[0]. Granted, a lot of them closed after the fall of communism 20 years ago, but equally they still exist and still continue serving people. They are not just a tourist curio either - they are the place to go for students and workers.
[0] https://www.tripadvisor.co.uk/Restaurant_Review-g274772-d269...
I always wondered why fast food was such a big thing in the west, maybe it's because they never had this?
https://www.facebook.com/pg/CaLaMama1/photos/?ref=page_inter...
We had thousands of them during the war - British Restaurants, operated by the local authority, serving a three-course meal to all comers for ninepence.
That the kitchens were run not-for-profit says absolutely nothing about whether those prices were actually sustainable for the food they were serving - if supplies are subsidized then NFP just means not taking in more than expended in subsidies. If anybody has details of how they were funded in the post-war period, I'd be happy to consider it.