Comment by Tarks | Hacker News Reader

Comment by Tarks | Hacker News Reader

For anyone interested I did a fair bit of research into how I could step into the passable home espresso / coffee game as I WFH a lot.

Given that :

- I make at most 3 coffees a day, usually 1.

- I prefer espresso

I found the traditional options lacking. I'd need:

- a machine costing about £600

- a solid quality grinder.

- machine needs 20 minutes warmup minimum before you can pour a consistent shot (or you need to leave it on).

Instead I thought I'd go a different way and build an all manual espresso setup, using getting past the largest price tag using one of these :

https://www.flairespresso.com/. Takes some getting used to but I've been very satisfied with the quality. You NEED to pair it with a high quality grinder to get solid results (I'm using https://coffeehit.co.uk/products/lido-e-travel-hand-grinder).

Downside is I can't steam milk unless I break out my stovetop milk steamer thing ( https://prima-coffee.com/equipment/bellman/50ss ) but that's fine as I prefer black coffee, the steamer gets more use by partner for her hot chocolates.

My setup : https://i.imgur.com/6M9AT4O.jpg

Thanks for this.

I’m not suggesting you change what clearly works well, but anyone starting out should consider second hand gear. The best espresso gear ages well, is repairable and is readily available second hand. The machines Rancillio Silva, La Cimbali Junior and the grinders by Mazzer are all readily available and affordable if you are patient. Bought dirty, chipped and not working is best - then the price is lowest, sub $50US each is the best I’ve achieved.

I’m yet to find one that isn’t just a broken on/off switch or disconnected cable. All the parts are easily sourced and a careful respray is cheap. The above machines are commercial grade and designed to be pulled apart quickly using a screwdriver or two and maybe a spanner. Careful though. It’s a very slippery slope.

Where would you recommend searching for used espresso gear? ebay?

I've got a stainless steel Gaggia Classic I'll send you for the cost of shipping if you'd like. I got it refurb and was never able to get a consistent shot out of it, but I don't know how much of that was due to the machine vs user error. Anyway, I got tired of pouring sour shots down the sink, so I cleaned it and put in storage years ago.

It's probably $30-50 to ship given its size and weight.

My email is in my profile.

Claimed.

I use a local equivalent - Trademe.co.nz.

I have the Breville Barista Express and it takes like a minute to warm up and has a fantastic grinder built in, as well as a steamer for those who are into that sort of thing. And that's at a lot lower price point than £600, I think I paid ~$600USD for the whole getup.

I have this one too. It's a great machine if you are willing to spend ~$500. I've had it for over a year, and it's still making great coffee.

I went through a similar search for a cheap homemade espresso and ended up landing on the 3-cup Moka pot. It's not exactly espresso, but I find it's good enough for me, especially if I put it into a cappuccino or something else.

My wife makes her coffee in an moka pot. IMO it's fine for cafe cubano or maybe a latte, but I'd never drink it straight. It's much too bitter and lacks the natural sweetness and full body of a proper espresso shot. So while you can make passable espresso-type drinks with it, it's not really espresso.

Can I ask what grind you're using? I'm a big fan of the bitterness of what my moka pot produces, though I agree that it's not "espresso" per se. It's fantastic for mixing with vanilla ice cream or mixed drinks.

Espresso grind (fine). Just slightly finer than I grind for using in an Aeropress. To give an idea, my grinder scale is 1-34. I use 1 for Turkish, she likes 5 in the Moka, I use 6 in my Aeropress. Drip is ~12. French press is ~18.

My alternative for about $45 US in equipment. Buy an Aeropress (~$30) and a cheap hand burr grinder from Amazon. (~$11) Always buy freshly roasted beans. Read and follow the instructions that come with Aeropress. Water temperature matters! Stirring duration matters! But if you can simply follow instructions, it's very easy to get consistent results.

If you're a bit lazy, you can substitute a cheap blade grinder, and still have the same equipment outlay.

I’m super lazy. I skip all the beans and grinding and just use Cafe Bustelo. It’s great coffee and works really well in an Aeropress.

$4 per 10 ounce can.

You can make most anything halfway decent taste good or at least non-offensive with an Aeropress. Just reduce extraction time and increase or decrease temperature.

If you're looking for a good hand grinder that has almost no plastic parts, I've been using this Porlex one for maybe... 5 or 6 years now?

https://www.amazon.com/Porlex-Jp-30-Stainless-Coffee-Grinder...

I highly recommend getting THAT one and not the Porlex mini, or any of the cheaper brands. The build quality is not the same, plus you'll want the extra capacity in case you decide to do a big french press or something.

I do pourover as well, which is great, though I do love me a stovetop when I'm feeling old school! Pretty inconsistent though unless you really dial it in over time.

That Porlex just isn't consistent enough for espresso.

I'm just a rookie at making espresso but I would argue my <$100 DeLonghi espresso maker paired with either fresh ground coffee from a local store or illy Coffee from online is at least on par with most chain coffee shops.

I can't stomach drip coffee but have really enjoyed a nice espresso with steam/foamed milk.

The biggest lessons I've learned are don't over pack it, don't under pack it, stop when it turns blond, give it time to warm up & let it run for a bit to get the old water out.

- Edit - I would love to hear tips on what else I can do to up my espresso game though for a reasonable price.

Seconding Delonghi as a cheaper option. I had brought in a DeLonghi espresso maker for my team at the last job. We got a decent coffee grinder around 100.

It wasn't earth shattering. But the price to convenience factor was there. First person in always turned on the machine warming it up. We'd make a round of shots before stand up. Then switch to coffee + frothed milk.

For beans we maintained a rotation and all chipped in. We also had a french press, siphon and chemex.

Same here; I bought a used DeLonghi (10€!) and it's on par with a random espresso from a coffeeshop. It also doesn't take anything close to 20m to warm up, though I suppose that may be easier in Europe vs the US.

Machines will take a short time to get to proper brew temp, but the rest of the machine takes longer (the group head is most important)

Ideally you want everything the coffee touches to be at the proper temp - included th portafilter and cups.

I think it takes 2-3 minutes to warm up. It's ready before I have my espresso packed. I know the instructions say to run the water a bit before brewing to clean the pipes of any colder water.

Great point on cup temp! That makes a huge difference if you want your coffee to stay warm.

Your grinder will make the most impact.

get freshly roasted beans (within 2wks) grind with a high quality burr grinder before each run.

That will get you the best quality shot with your machine.

I'm curious about your hand grinder and if it does a better job than my automatic Baratza Encore burr grinder (priced at about $129 US). I've been hearing over and over that the grinder is the most important part of the whole process, but I haven't been willing to jump up to the $400-ish price point for something like a Eureka Mignon Silenzio....

Intruiging. How long time does it take you to make a cup? How long time for the grinding?

Pouring steamed milk over good hand-brewn coffee is a slightly disturbing idea. Why would you want to do that to your coffee?

That said I too love my electric milk frother its hot chocolate option.

Reply on news.ycombinator.com