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Comment by amelius | Hacker News Reader

Problem is, people of age 50+ will complain about working on unethical stuff like keeping people hooked to a feed of stupid videos, or tracking them across the web. In contrast, 20-somethings will either think it's cool, or they simply need the money.

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Finding a new job and living in austerity become harder as you age, particularly as you have less energy to deal with it and often more responsibilities. I think this explains why I've found that older workers tend to become more flexible with their workplace politics, not less.

Just anecdotal evidence, but I don't find this to be true at all. 20-somethings around me need less the money that older people (they are well paid, no kids, no mortgage, no old parents to support, no car...) and are more idealistic and critical of the system.

agree totally. Millenials (in my experience) are much, much more likely to turn down a job because of the ethics of it. People my age (I'm over 50) are more jaded ;)

Oh 20-somethings need money; it just hasn't occurred to them.

Upside:

> no mortgage

Downside: can't make down payment and perhaps never will.

> Oh 20-somethings need money; it just hasn't occurred to them.

Yes but software engineering pays enough that you don't need to go to Google or Facebook or other unethical ad companies to live decently. My salary is probably below market rate (which itself is way below google-level pay) and can still buy pretty much anything I want while having enough left at the end of the month to have near-0 concern about my future.

(Not living in the US, so not worried about a health problem bankrupting me or having to pay ~100k for my kids college)

Seeing that in the city where I live - a major metropolitan area with plenty of tech jobs - you can get a brand new 3000 foot house in the burbs, great school system for around $350K with an FHA loan and 3.5% down, a house is far from unaffordable for the average developer with 5-7 years of experience.

Representing $350k for a 3000 sq foot house as average is disingenuous. That simply isn't true in the places where the majority of tech jobs exist (major coastal metros).

In Seattle, 3000 sq ft homes go for a floor of about $750k, and that's in the extreme south end of town. In SF, try $1.5mil. $500k+ in the outer extremes of NYC. Average developers can't all move to whatever cheap metro you're describing; there simply aren't enough jobs there.

You really think that the only place you can find a tech job is on the west coast?

I must be imagining things that I’ve been doing pretty well for myself in Atlanta for 20+ years....

And posters on HN wonder why I always rail against the Silicon Valley/HN bubble.

https://www.glassdoor.com/blog/25-best-paying-cities-softwar...

NYC isn't on the west coast.

Do you think all the average west coast developers can move to Atlanta? No; there aren't the jobs. And if/when there are, housing prices rise correspondingly.

I'm glad ATL works well for you, but it isn't the average experience.

There are other cities in the US you know where software engineers work....

Why isn’t it the average experience?

https://www.matrixres.com/salary-surveys

more idealistic and critical of the system

Because they're 20, that's the point.

> ...no mortgage...

They rent instead.

Rents are usually higher than mortgages for the same kind of property...

I'm guessing you've never been near a defense contractor

Unethical people come in all shapes, sizes, and ages. Youth and idealism are often associated together for a reason.

You mean the entire exploitation of grey areas that is the source of most major commercial booms would be cut off at the 20-something enabling knees if older, and yes, wiser people were kept around.

Not so much the source, as the destination.

I'm sure there's no middle aged programmers working at defense contractors build unethical things.

thats not actually true. especially since the 50+ people are the "leaders". That have instructed everyone to do the unethical things. Actually in general, older people seem to be more racist, more homophobic, etc. So i'm not too sure they are magically more ethical.

Actually in general, older people seem to be more racist

I see a lot of young people making assertions based on race and other indelible characteristics, with the idea that doing so is somehow intellectually and morally worthy. Back in the day, someone proposed that people should be judged on the content of their character. I would urge young people to be wary of those who try to attach negatives to indelible characteristics, like age.

the comment i was responding to made a similar claim (except about young people). im just showing them how that thinking can be used

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