- audio and video capture has to start going before call is actually established at signaling level, in order to minimize call establishment delay. Audio maybe going through Bluetooth, for example, and waking up Handsfree mode of BT may take 1-2 sec
- most of the group calling functionality was developed by a separate team, and group calling signaling may be loosely integrated at UI level, where, once UI triggers a switch to a group call - internally, the whole new library may kick in and get the current 1-1 call state transferred to it.
- when this “transfer” happens, the state of the first 1-1 call gets affected (at either local or remote side (due to signaling), which leads to either remote side think that the call was answered (a lack of protection in the call signaling state machine to ensure it was users UI action) or local side thinks it’s ok that remote users answers the call (in this case FT must have streamed audio even during 1-1 call establishment phase)
- lack of a check for your own phone number added to a call. This, due to having the same IDs/tokens twice in a group call, may lead to unexpected call signaling state machine switch
- lack of manual testing with focus on edge cases (like the described flow to repro the bug may not be the main flow for how users start group calls on FT)
I never worked at Apple, but I built VoIP stuff for the past 20 years.
As a user, while I can accept capture starting before I answer, I cannot accept sending. I understand how it helps the speed of establishing calls.
But it means the only thing needed to spy on me from that is a software change ON THE OTHER SIDE. No way to know from my side if I'm good or not.
They supposedly have these chips that make your phone much more secure and they can't get stupid stuff like this right? LOL ... GO APPLE. My trust level was already close to zero before this...
Ha! Facetime is now a non-causal filter.
Maybe that's triggered by adding your own number? Since you're clearly on the call already, your own number is obviously going to answer immediately and that kicks the whole call into "active" (since you presumably want a call to become active when more than one person has answered) without considering that you've actually got A+A+B instead of A+B+C.
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/11/28/root_access_bypass_...
And this other MacOS bug, also from last year, where the password hint would contain the plain text encryption password:
https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/10/05/apple_patches_passw...
All within a month of each other.
Beyond this, the small but dedicated Slackware team is working daily to find and patch bugs when they do appear. You can look at the changelogs for examples of that workflow[1].
There's no such thing as a software project without bugs, but Slackware is consistently one of the most stable and robust OSes out there.
The vuln doesn't give you access to the actual accounts on the computer.
I think that if you hit Cancel there it would work just as well. You wouldn't get it logged into the domain though
So yeah, these types of vulnerabilities are very very scary.
[1] https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/unity/+bug/1777415
That said, I also don’t agree that this bug should never get fixed either.
Anything that caches anything to anywhere other than disk will be accessible. Your memcache, your redis, some databases, keychains, your non-userdata browser sessions.
In any case, half the examples you've provided there are server specific and you really shouldn't be allowing untrusted physical access to your servers (nor running Xorg to be honest).
So it's likely it won't ever be fixed.
The bug could then be that the feed is sent over the call too early instead of being used solely for this local feedback.
Extra creepy.
And I'll be honest, this is when I started losing faith in technology.
This is an outright lie.
However, I'm not sure a typical iOS user cares.
Audio only on the password screen, but all audible.
In particular it happens when attaching external monitors while the screen is locked. There's a flash of the unlocked desktop.
I am guessing this is because the screen lock is an application drawing over top of the monitor, like XScreensaver on Linux does. A more secure-by-default architecture would have screen locking built into the display server at some lower level: If the screen is not unlocked, it will not allow the data to be passed to the GPU. It's easy for me to arm-chair architect though.
"Why doesn't it take X seconds before I can start talking".
To which the engineers possibly explained the reasons and the product owner saying:
"But I want it instant, let's bypass all this extra stuff and get a proof of concept instant answer working"
To which the engineer said:
"But we'd technically be sending data before the call has even been accepted"
To which the product owner said:
"That's okay, the user can't actually see that data, let us just get this in for now, we can worry about the security/privacy side later".
To which the engineer said "but, but, but" saw the product owners eyes glaze over and just made the commit:
Commit 1279: Remove very important security/privacy feature of ensuring no data is transmitted until the call has been accepted. This is again my best judgement, do not come to me when this blows up, please speak to the product owner.
Then went to the pub in despair.
Maybe their code is a mess for orthogonal reasons - management, profit-motive?
Aside: I thought I'd heard devs have automated analysers that step through and find all possible code paths, allowing complex code to be audited for security issues and such? Presumably that's how these sorts of bugs should be found in testing.
Also - maybe they inherited the code from a startup and never had the chance to refactor and so there was a mess from the start.
Either way, bugs happen. Of all kinds, even bad ones'.
More circumspect than a 'bug' is that this got through their tests. Their end-to-end testing should have picked this up.
And some of the world's very worst. There are not 10s of thousands of world-class developers to hire in the first place and they would be focused on much higher-level details than implementing basic features and maintenance.
That gruntwork requires solid reliable workers with experience but the current screening processes do more harm more than help in getting that talent.
People have to stop putting these types on a pedestal. Some of the least intelligent people I've known have worked for some very big names. You shouldn't trust someone based on who they work for or what name is attached.
https://www.apple.com/business/resources/docs/iOS_Security_O...
This phrase is used several times on their current website:
https://www.google.com/search?q=%22secure+by+design%22+site%...
Super easy and not remotely malicious. It’s a failed state check.
The actual bug here might be different but that’s an easy example. But it may also effectively be the bug since all the examples mention adding yourself to the call.
If you're curious, check out this flowchart slide from a Google I/O WebRTC talk:
https://image.slidesharecdn.com/2014q2-geekandkranky-scalabi...
Not really. The reason the PTT was virtually instant connect has nothing to do with optimization tricks, but rather is a purpose built design of the network tech it was using.
Nextel PTT didn't go over a normal cellular network, it went over something called iDEN[0]. iDEN provides a trunked radio service[1] which has a similarish feature to a conventional two-way radio. Sprint acquired Nextel and as iDEN wasn't as relevant anymore with the advances in cellular networks (despite those who actually used the PTT functionality), in 2013 Sprint shutdown the network to use it for additional LTE bandwidth in the 800mhz band[2].
[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IDEN
It was obnoxious at times, but very different than the kind of privacy invasion that the receiver's sending data without active involvement is.
Source: https://www.apple.com/business/docs/iOS_Security_Guide.pdf
https://googleprojectzero.blogspot.com/2018/12/adventures-in...
If you consider what happens when you add a third person to a call: You start sending them everyone's audio!
That's the desired behavior and exactly what happened here.
Except the client should have probably checked if the call had been accepted first. That's why I say it's a state machine bug: The "Send audio" function should have never been activated in state "waiting to accept".
Not before they accept the call connection request you don't.
Takes the engineering right out of software engineering if you ask me.
The Apple Watch walkie talkie feature allows you to talk with anyone who has approved you and has walkie talkie switched on.
But it appears to use FaceTime under the hood as when it was launched it failed if FaceTime was switched off on your phone.
So the “auto answer” mechanism is already in there, just getting triggered at the wrong time?
Apologies in advance for my ignorance, I haven’t written code for a long time.
I doubt there would be a specific test (or maybe there would, real testers are better than me at thinking of this stuff), but there should be logs for events like "microphone turned on" and "user joined group chat" and the testers should be monitoring those logs.
I've never worked at Apple but neither have I in 10 years seen people truly appreciate any attempts I did in defensive programming. On the contrary, usually I hear - sometimes loud - complaints about that. Usually from fellow engineers when they see it but on occasions also from non technical people.
It's a joke that everybody is so sad about bad application security but at the same time virtually nobody cares about it at all when involved in an actual development project.
Classical case of NIMBY. FWIW Apple's security is far over average compared to other companies. But I guess they cannot isolate themselves 100%.
I believe they have been working on FaceTime Group for 5+ years now.
In 2015, Modern Family had an episode where the entire plot focused around the family using FaceTime on their iPhones --- but they had the Group feature[1]! I remember being blown away when I saw that, figured it'd be coming in the next iOS update. It didn't. 4 years later, they finally released it..then recalled it immediately
[1] https://www.mlive.com/entertainment/index.ssf/2015/02/tech_r...
edit: managed to find a short clip from said Modern Family episode: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vy3jUOBxQuI
Though in the full episode you see a lot more of the Group feature
Imagine a method for group calling that returns whether or not the call should be considered active or not by seeing if the number of callers is equal to the number who have accepted the call. But now imagine the method that tallies up the number of callers does a unique count by phone number, while the method that tallies how many people have accepted the call does not.
Since adding your own number is adding a caller who has already accepted a call, you end up with unique_callers (2, you and them) == total_accepted (2, you and you).
This could be tested by adding a third person to a group call twice (if iOS will let you do that) instead of adding yourself to the call.
Furthermore, if the interface on the recipient's phone only looks at whether or not they've accepted the call, that would explain why the call doesn't auto-accept on their end and go into the call before they've accepted or rejected the call.
The steps to reproduce is trivial so I'm shocked.
Anybody working in security will tell you the same. Piles of abstractions make it impossible to find out these bugs. You need a month of work to understand these codebases, often only the main developer has the architecture in its head.
That's a lot of confidence…
(people have complained about it approximately since it was released)
Desktop iTunes is a dumpster fire, but their iOS software is what I was specifically referring to.
and I ain't gonna stop complaining until I find a suitable music player to replace it!
I think it's programming practices themselves that have fallen off a cliff, at least in the non-FLOSS world, and nothing specific to Apple. You can even see this in the dumpster-fire that's popularly known as "Windows 10", as well as in the latest versions of Mac OS X which are a lot slower and less user-friendly than their predecessors.
Sure, that could be argued. But with Objective-C, you still had exposure to the "metal". You had to understand what a pointer is, and why you would want to use it. You had to understand memory management, even though ARC does the job (mostly). It was firmly entrenched in the world of memory efficient embedded programming that mobile started out as, but now that developers coming from Javascript/Python land see a familiar syntax they've brought their patterns with them as well.
Yes. But it has nothing to do with pointers specifically, just the mindset and training of the average developer who has had experience with them, vs. the average developer who has not.
There's an entire generation of developers now graduating from CS programs, hiring into Apple, and getting dumped on these application teams with zero real world experience and their only language being Python or Swift. The result is you have tons of brilliant people who can quickly whip up a DFS algorithm, but don't understand that using 4MB of RAM for a JPEG is unnacceptable, or that whatever dynamic thing they are asking the runtime to do might not always work as intended. That's why we get these massive feature lists nobody asked for with every iOS release, and zero emphasis on performance.
I’m not sure where you’re getting this anecdote from, because I have not found it to be at all true in practice.
It’s a nightmare for security and performance - the number of obvious, blatant security issues I’ve spotted and fixed just through luck alone is horrifying.
But coming back to your point, there have always been new engineers with weak skills, just like there have always been smart engineers as well. I don't think the choice of programming language changes this fact significantly, although certain languages may have a slightly higher proportion of inexperienced programmers than others.
As programming gets easier to learn, people spend less time learning programming. This has a number of negative knock-on effects, eg less understanding & focus on correctness, performance, security, etc. Obviously there’s lots of wider benefits too - but I suspect that the average person writing objective-c today spent more time studying programming than the average person writing swift today.
It sounds like we generally agree on that - but my claim is that this effect size is big enough to dominate almost all other considerations. I suspect the average C program is more secure than the average JavaScript web app, despite how the absurd difficulty in writing correct C, just because of the ratio of new and old programmers in both communities.
There are going to be engineers that have to deal with driver-level code that know full well the limitations of memory constraints, thread overhead, etc.
No doubt you're describing the other half — the app engineers that use the API/SPI's. It might even be argued though that, given a well defined API, they should not have to worry about how much memory a JPEG requires ... the API decompressing the image only when rendering to the destination or what-have-you. Pointers, memory management should be managed by the low-level parts of the language or OS/kernel.
I happen to like the bit-banging, pointer walking, free-wheeling world of straight C but I don't begrudge higher level languages that are designed to tackle the more modern pressures of concurrency and "asynchronicity".
Most of iOS is still great. The problem is all the cruft that has developed since around 7.0. It just seems like an endless march of features at all expense.