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Comment by ec109685 | Hacker News Reader

Even the us is super cumbersome. They should just support ApplePay, Google Pay and a credit card and be done with it.

Remembering the password for some finicky app just makes the quick fill up too much trouble.

Even better would be if the car had secure handshake so once you’ve registered once for a network, you can just plug in and be done.

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> "They should just support ApplePay, Google Pay and a credit card and be done with it."

They should take cash.

With cash, what happens if I put in $5 and my car only uses $3 of electricity? Or if someone pulls out the charge cable after my car's only taken $1 of electricity?

With electronic payments, you can pre-authorize a reasonable amount, then charge the customer for the amount they've used - no excess charges or change required.

> With cash, what happens if I put in $5 and my car only uses $3 of electricity? Or if someone pulls out the charge cable after my car's only taken $1 of electricity?

What happens is the same as when filling a car with gas.

Which is the attendant or cashier gives me change.

I haven’t seen a human attendant near any charge point stations.

Wait, have you never paid cash at a gas station before?

You go up to the teller, tell him which pump your car is in, and get your $2 back.

Or if you buy a ticket for cash at a train station from a vending machine, it gives you back change usually in dollar coins.

Or you could even buy a pre-paid RFID card with cash that keeps your balance on it. Many cities have vending machines that dispense these for bus fairs. There are numerous ways to do this, it's a solved problem many times over.

> "Wait, have you never paid cash at a gas station before?"

That seems to actually be a distinct possibility. Some people seem to use cash so infrequently they forget it even exists.

To be fair, paying with cash at a gas station is annoying if your objective is to fill your tank completely rather than spend X amount as it forces you to guess your prospective spend.

That depend on where you are. This started about how it is in Europe, where it is common to first fill your tank, then go inside to pay if you want to pay with cash

I suspect that most new college grads have never used cash to buy gas (myself included).

Automated fuel stations are always the cheapest. The only reason to go to a manned station is for the shop or cafeteria and you're paying 5-10 cents more per litre for the privilege.

These stations can be unmanned.

Most car chargers are standalone devices in a parking lot. There is no teller to pay. I have never seen one with an attendant.

They could take cash automatically like a vending machine but that's going to require new staff to go around and collect money and deposit it. Probably much more expensive than taking credit cards.

Have the dispenser display a code for a $2 future credit. Or to be redeemed for cash at a later time somewhere cash transactions with humans exist. Or just use a standard vending machine module and give change with a restocking employee.

The market will decide if it's more expensive. Customers exist who will commute to another charger so they can pay cash. If the money left on the table is more than the cost of the cash module and attendant, it will be adopted.

what happens if I put in $5 and my car only uses $3 of electricity? Automated change has been a thing for ages, see: vending machines, public phones. Or if someone pulls out the charge cable after my car's only taken $1 of electricity? Mind your property.

Do the charger standards pass any data?

Like could you plug in, the car identifies itself as whatever VIN (add whatever anti-tampering challenge-response you want to armchair-design), and the electrons just start flowing?

That's how the Tesla chargers work.

It also looks like CHAdeMO has a 'Plug and Charge' protocol defined:

https://www.chademo.com/chademo-releases-the-latest-version-...

But that's pretty new, and not the SAE standard used in the US. So, it'll be a while...

I know ChargePoint stations in the US accept standard tap-and-pay, so are compatible with Google/Apple Pay.

> Even better would be if the car had secure handshake so once you’ve registered once for a network, you can just plug in and be done.

I'm really surprised this isn't how it works... Surely if they can figure out autopilot they can make charging seamless. Wait... never mind.

This is how the Tesla superchargers work - authorization and billing is all in-car and takes place automatically, so all you do is plug in and it immediately begins charging.

For other charging networks, however, it seems to be needlessly more complicated.

Even the us is super cumbersome.

I just present my RFID Chargepoint card, and it pretty much just works.

That is how Tesla's superchargers work.

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