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Comment by thomaspaine | Hacker News Reader

I've been doing brazilian jiu-jitsu for about 5 years, and would highly recommend it to anyone. I know a wide range of people who practice it, from professional fighters to little kids to a guy in his 60s.

I think it fits especially well for the HN crowd, because there's generally very little mystical bs that goes on, and although this analogy gets abused, it's basically human chess. There's a very analytical approach to learning jiu-jitsu as opposed to most striking arts (I also do muay thai and recommend that as well if the idea if touching people grosses you out) which are largely reflexive.

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While I second the BJJ recommendation, if it's the "human chess" aspect that you're after, the martial art you're looking for is fencing.

Totally agree. New Blue Belt here and I really appreciate the strategy and analysis it takes to figure out your own game and apply it to different opponents.

A note to those who are interested in starting: It is a highly technical martial art, but it's not going to feel like it at first. Other newbs who are bigger and more athletic are going to beat you most of the time. But if you pay attention, the smaller, less athletic upper belts will have their way with them along with you. Unfortunately, there is a steep learning curve. Stick with it and things get easier!

Programming for 8-10 hours a day can drive me insane, and it's very nice and therapeutic for me to hit the mats a few days a week. I get exercise, have fun, and am still mentally stimulated without thinking about technology or whatnot.

The comparison to chess is spot on. I used to play competitive chess when I was younger and I currently compete in bjj. One interesting book on the relationship between martial arts and chess is the Art of Learning http://www.amazon.com/Art-Learning-Journey-Optimal-Performan...

The author was a top ranked chess prodigy (remember the movie Looking for Bobby Fisher?) and now is a Marcelo Garcia student (one of the top bjj masters)

“[Fighting] is a problem solving activity, and the people who do best at it tend to be people with rational, inquiring minds, and so, the relationship between philosophy and mathematics has to do more with human beings using their rational faculties to solve problems, rather than, in the case of jiu-jitsu, blind strength, anger and aggression.”

- John Danaher

I started practicing BJJ a few months back. I loved it. It is like chess, but physical. Unfortunately, I was in the receiving end of a neck crank. I was injured (cervical hernia). So if you practice BJJ make sure that you are always safe and don`t hesitate to tap.

Whoever applied the crank on you, wasn't being careful (especially if it was someone more experienced or higher belt) - you can always stop short of finishing the move against someone and wait for them to tap.

That's really horrible :( It sucks to train with someone who is also a beginner as chances for getting hurt are much higher! I was rolling with a guy who was also new (and twice my size) who loved to lean on me when in my guard. We weren't going that hard but I started to notice a pain in my side and assumed it was a cramp. Turned out to be a fractured rib :(

To answer the OP's question, I take a mixed martial arts class that combines muay thai/kickboxing with bjj and has a cardio class as well. It's very well rounded, and our instructors compete in some of the smaller MMA leagues like Bellator.

Overall, it's a great experience and amazing workout when you combine kickboxing and mid to high level bjj. Just note that early BJJ (your first 6 months or so) will not work you too hard until you can start to free grapple.

Agreed about the neck cranker... he should have known to stop well before injury occurred, especially in practice. I would be slightly more forgivable in a tournament, but still should never have happened. BJJ is very technical, which I find awesome. Going to train right after a whole day of programming at work is a seamless transition. The mode your brain already is in lends itself to the jiu-jitsu ideas of thinking multiple moves ahead, and applying logic and technique to your art. Being stronger than the other guy helps too ;-)

Totally agree on this. I've been training for 5 years. It has a very low barrier to entry (you get to spar on your first day) and nearly infinite variations on a small set of moves.

A really cool thing about it is that, unlike most martial arts, it's not attribute based (eg: boxing, were you need speed and strength and weight) that it's possible to see 125lb players going against 205lb opponents and winning (or at least surviving)

It's very pragmatic, all the mystical components have been stripped out (it's actually a disadvantage in BJJ); in my opinion, the only other martial art that could go toe-to-toe with a BJJ practitioner would be a Muay Thai fighter - but then if the fight goes to ground (which is almost a given for almost any fight) then it's over.

BJJ is akin to playing Chess.

Have you tried other martial arts like karate or taekwondo? How does it compare? I recently moved to Toronto and have yet to find a great (ie. non belt promotion based) school downtown. I've found a number of potential BJJ schools though and have been curious.

I did taekwondo when I was little and I know some people who still do it. All martial arts are technical once you get into them, but grappling is different from striking in that what you do with your body is very similar to following a decision tree. Eventually these decisions get internalized into your muscle memory, but there's still a high degree of "if he does A, I'll do B, which will leave me open to C and D, which I can counter with E, F, and G, etc". Basically getting better at grappling involves filling out this decision tree.

Striking arts operate at a much faster pace so you really can't do that, the depth of the decision trees are much shorter, which is why I think bjj is more analytical and appropriate for most HNers.

I don't want to get into a flame war, but I personally don't find taekwondo and karate to be particularly realistic to fighting. Everyone has different motivations for training though, if you enjoy the fitness and athleticism of those arts, go for it.

Yup, no flame here. That's the problem I'm finding here in Toronto (or any major city I would imagine). I lived in a much smaller city a few months ago and was fortunate enough to have a really great instructor and an even better master. Thanks for the advice though, I'll be sure to check it out!

but I personally don't find taekwondo and karate to be particularly realistic to fighting.

I have fairly high level belts in several arts. My father put my in Judo when I was 4, jiu-jitsu and Taekwondo by 6. While there are some Karate styles that have become obsolete with more contemporary arts surpassing them (Kempo comes to mind). I believe that Taekwondo is still a very relevant art even for combat.

Taekwondo while extremely difficult due to the technical kicking requirements is by far the most superior kicking art. The problem is that it is not a rounded art. In combat you cannot rely on the fact that you will land the kick ever time and Taekwondo does not really focus on that fact, it has to be augmented with another art. Which usually in Taekwondo schools is Hapkido. The problem is Hapkido is inferior to Aikido or jiu-jitsu.

That being said, my son is now 4 and the first art I enrolled him in was Taekwondo. Doing so will allow him to develop superior kicking technique which take the body the longest time to develop and some people after aging are never able to achieve the limberness required to master Taekwondo.

I agree with you to the extent that Taekwondo on it's own does not round a person enough to be confident in a street fight. But as an augmentation to other arts it will give you superior leg work over any other art and is very relevant to modern street combat. In the few altercations, that I could not avoid getting into, 2 where ended by a single kick and both where head kicks that are only taught in Taekwondo, so it is effective you just cannot rely on it as your only weapon.

I think you provided a great breakdown of grappling - the decision tree analogy was great.

I think the opportunity to practice something with the analytical element discussed here is great. Really, all martial arts are highly analytical, but different martial arts afford different opportunities to use these skills. I think all martial arts (or martial art sports) involving competition have similar levels of analysis, but lots of martial arts instructors require you to reach some sort of physical foundation before teaching you any true technical aspects. So, as said, it all depends on what you want.

I think that if you are in Toronto, it's worth checking out aikido seishinkai. I used to go there before I moved and missed it ever since. They don't have a website but:

http://www.torontoparentsguide.com/spid/1400/details.aspx

Another good reason why BJJ is good for the HN crowd is it can be for anyone of all sizes.

I am 155 pounds soaking wet and can compete with guys that are 200 pounds.

I have been training for about a year now and am a 3rd stripe white belt

Here's another vote for Brazilian Jiu Jitsu.

It's also good to be able to fight pretty much full-force in training as well - which you can't really do in a striking art.

This is the most appealing thing about BJJ in my opinion. Not only does full-intensity training entail a better workout, one also improves more rapidly due to the constant realistic feedback. BJJ is to The Little Schemer as karate is to Learn Python The Hard Way.

I just started 3 weeks ago (so did my 6 yo daughter). Love it so far.

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