Privacy not included: Holiday gift list for privacy and security

I think it's an important list, even if somewhat sloppy. It would be to everyone's advantage if product reviewers like Consumer Reports, various tech columnists, blogs and so on, got the message that privacy matters. They need to start including privacy as a component of their review.

Pressure for companies to go green has worked over time; pressure for companies to go "quiet" -- that is pro-privacy -- could have the same effect.

Perhaps, but I don't think the solution to the ever-increasing number of devices collecting and distributing ever-increasing amounts of personal data is to shrug and say "well, at least it's not as intrusive as my toaster. Now there's some Orwellian shit". I think it is useful in and of itself to make people aware of the sorts of data that is collected and shared by devices most people don't consider at all related to privacy.

take the nest

'has parental controls': can't determine

well, it's a blooming thermostat. You can lock the thing out.

That's more 'parental control' than any standard thermostat.

creepy meter? as a gift for a non-family member? yeah, that's weird.

We know there's a disconnect. That's exactly the problem.

Without discussing these things, the bar for 'normal' will simply continue moving.

Consider that in 2018 the term 'spyware' has essentially become meaningless because outside of FOSS products for power users and a few systems for enterprise _everything_ is doing it.

I won't buy my family products that spy on them and will recommend them against buying such. They need a moderating influence that understands the issues and doesn't have a vested interest in screwing them over like advertisers do.

Agreed. Just for starters, there are two tied bad practices here. One is that the "creepy mater" is based on "user ratings" apparently despite being a curated Mozilla branded list. That immediately opens it up too all the normal random masses using it as a medium for non-relevant opinions, trolling, etc. Further it means that they have a list with nothing at all that isn't "A little creepy" so even if someone thinks "well then what should I buy?" there is no answer, which invites a "well whatever" attitude in and of itself.

Further as you point to, a lot of the "creepiness" factor is a function of the delta between expectations and reality, ie. how surprising it is, and the extent to which it's perceived to be avoidable. That can be different then absolute measures of how objectionable something is. To take your example, an internet connected game console these days has some upfront expectation of data collection by virtue of the profile and social features that are right there front and center. Since it's also generally static in a fixed location and used only for a specific purpose, the surprise factor of most of its privacy issues is inherently lower, and the data collection less passive. A cooking tool though might be a lot more subject to surprise at what it's doing.

This list definitely feels very shallow and disconnected from any deeper reasoning about specific security practices, business models, whether a net connection is actually required or not, etc. It's a popularity poll at best, and the actionable advice is minimal. It's a bit disappointing coming from Mozilla, at least to the extent that it's a wasted opportunity on something that the public is growing more aware of.

It's a poll because this way Mozilla wont have to, be held responsible for, not defend any of the opinions presented there.

> We created this guide to help you buy safe, secure products this holiday season.

Because "we created this poll so you can see what other people think is safe, secure products this holiday season" doesn't sound nearly as good.

So they made a guide, that's really a poll. What do you mean you can have your cake and eat it too?

I think you're being unfair.

"This add-on was installed and set to ‘OFF’ and made no changes in the user experience unless it was explicitly turned on by a user, but it was added. Even when turned on no user data was collected or shared."

Do you trust the xbox one to keep its microphone always off? I own one but do find it a little creepy. I keep the kinect turned around away from the room, and have the setting to make it turn fully off. This means annoying waits sometimes when it insists on a software update when turned on, but I think the setting is worth it.

Disclaimer: I work for Fitbit but speak only for myself.

The guide says of Fitbit Versa, "Shares your information with 3rd parties for unexpected reasons: yes". This is false.

The rating may just be by vote, but there's no excuse for getting the facts wrong.

Tracking your location and speed is fine. What is creepy is sending that data off to fitbits servers where they do whatever they want with it. Fitbit have also been known to hand over your health data to police when requested.

There is literally no reason a fitness device could not do everything locally.