Blizzard Says It Wasn't Expecting Fans to Be This Angry About Diablo Immortal
kotaku.com
kotaku.com
>The explosion of outrage has many on social media discussing the extent to which video game culture enables entitlement. It’s not surprising, after all, that there’s been some pushback on the idea of a mobile Diablo game. What’s shocking here is the sheer amount of molten vitriol that’s pouring in over what seems to be a pretty cut-and-dry situation: A proper new Diablo has been and continues to be in the works, and Diablo Immortal is its own thing that’s not detracting from that. Also, the game itself is fine, if a little too shallow. No harm, no foul—aside from maybe some hurt feelings over unfulfilled expectations. And yet, people have decided that this is the ultimate betrayal, all because a single game isn’t hyper-focused on the diehard PC and console crowd. It’s fine and understandable to be skeptical of a big company, but the reaction here is wildly disproportionate to what Blizzard’s actually done.
Or see Mashable https://mashable.com/article/diablo-immortal-hands-on/
Or this https://twitter.com/WillJPowers/status/1058446033724694528
Gaming journalism is just terrible trash. The fact that these companies are trying to be immune and there are people who get paid to defend them is outrageous. No other medium does that.
And people wonder how the hell do they get away with p2w and gambling mechanics in games.
Because that business model is profitable, and entertainment is a business like any other. If you don't like it, you are free not to play it. Besides some potential for gambling addiction (about which state lotteries are a far more important target for your ire if that is your concern), mobile games produce no externalities whatsoever.
I continue to be completely mystified with the concept of outrage about video games. If you want to be outraged about corporate behavior, there are a multitude of examples of corporate malfeasance with actual negative externalities, such as the coal industry's contribution to climate change.
The "but climate change" is just whataboutism because gaming isn't important to you, so why aren't people paying more attention to what is important to you.
edit to clarify: This may sound a little hostile but it isn't intended as such. I'm just explaining that some people really do care about this stuff just as you really care about your own hobbies or pet cause.
For the last ~4 years, everything from game reviews that gamers disagreed with, to character stencils, have been positioned as the worst things to ever happen to gaming. Some in the community liken it to actual discrimination against gamers.
And yet you don't see people who follow those hobbies throwing an absolute fit like gamers are now doing continuously.
Because emacs-vs-vim used to a flame-war guarantee, and the stupid thing is that nobody is impacted by another persons text-editor, unless they are sharing a computer that can't have both installed (so anything with more than 30mb hd)
People are always going to be upset when something they're passionate about gets ruined. Being continuously attacked by the game press also sets up the whole conversation to be very hostile.
The internet is great for consumer rights. Consumers hold all of the cards and corporations are there to serve them. I don't think anyone should be feeling sorry for companies will multi billion dollar marketcaps or mainstream press. They are not ever going to be the victim.
And then the gaming 'media' calls theys guys out as assholes, which really shows how strings are really pulled behind the curtains.
Precisely this. It's not that feeble because you must remember what Blizzcon is. Know your audience. Blizzcon audience has paid $199 to get in. They are quite hard core PC gamers. If your main show for them is something they are not interested of course they are gonna be unhappy.
If Blizzard wants to change Blizzcon they should tell the audience that "Blizzcon 2018 is focused on mobile" before they buy the tickets.
Don't suddenly change the theme and expect a good reaction
What is unique in gaming is the feedback loop that happens. First the media responds by saying the guy is an asshole. Then the gamers respond with more vitriol. Then there is "Everyone hating the mobile diablo is a misogynist" kind of tweets. Rinse and repeat.
Do note I'm not justifying it. Merely trying to reason about why especially in gaming these outrages escalate into insane heights instead of dying in meh after a day or two.
We have been seeing this kind of vicious circle elsewhere too lately. As an example the latest Star Wars film where it ended up so bad that if you didn't like the film you were a Russian troll.
Well, absolute outrage is not absolute. This isn't something that's accurately metered. As with everything in outrage culture, the media tells us the outrage is palpable and we simply accept it. Users voicing their displeasure on reddit / twitter / youtube in any capacity is all it takes for the rags to twist this into an apocalyptic, mouth-frothing rage machine. It's a complete joke. The barrier to typing a few words for the world to see is paper thin. Displeasure isn't rage.
It's easy to manipulate discourse this way because anything can be construed as utter outrage.
The complaint here is that Blizzard is abandoning the people who made them rich, and the off the cuff remark about phones is proof of the latent disrespect they have for their customers. The fact that it was an awkward unscripted remark is what makes it sincere, and shows what lies just under the surface when they don't have their marketing staff to edit their press releases.
"OH, they're doing it to make more money" isn't a good excuse. They already make enough money. Blizzard should reciprocate loyalty to the people who are loyal to them, and that breach of respect is why people are mad.
"I can see" doesn't make it reasonable, nor rational. Maybe because you're deeper in it you're more acclimated, but to most viewers it's like saying "I can see my 5 year old throwing a tantrum, crying and throwing his clothes off in the middle of the grocery store because he wants to eat the ice cream now and not wait until we're home."
The “do you guys not have phones?” remark was in response to the crowd booing. It got a few laughs at the time.
I don't think it's fair to claim that. Lotteries have been around a lot longer and gambling addiction has had a lot more time to be studied. It wouldn't surprise me in the least if mobile games turn out to be as bad or worse than lotteries. The sheer amount of effort into creating addictive game mechanics and leveraging of statistical methods, such as A/B testing, puts traditional casinos and state lotteries to shame.
Having said all that, you don't have to look very far to see some alarming articles about the effects these products have on young children [1].
[1] https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/26/style/phones-children-sil...
What about the concept of outrage about programming languages, frameworks, web browsers, operating systems, laptops, phones, open source? I guess 99.9% of the population would be mystified with the outrages that we can see on Hacker News.
- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17221527
- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17413572
- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15940144
- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=18052923
- https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17927972
(just few recent examples, the list could go on)
Diablo is just a goddamn video game.
Not only that, they have an impact on democracy. The importance of FB, AMZN, AAPL, GOOG, and MSFT to society has never been higher. The relevance of ATVI to anything important is, to a first approximation, zero.
I simply can't help noticing the striking difference to the reaction to SyFy's cancellation of The Expanse.
The Super Bowl is "just a goddamn game" too. The Harry Potter series is "just a goddamn book" and Game of Thrones is "just a goddamn TV show". I'm sure whatever leisure activities you enjoy can easily be given a sneering dismissal as well.
Are we not allowed to have passion for our hobbies?
And Blizzard is free not to listen to the otherwise more than justified response.
And when they have to close because all the fanbase has moved on, and we get thousands of tweets about how great the developers working there were, and how sad it is they don't have a job any more, we'll be free to ignore them.
I already used the concert analogy but it’s good. If your rap music concert suddenly switches into techno the audience may be angry without being entitled edgelords. It’s about knowing your audience. And most importantly communicating it.
From the article:
"it’s a fully fledged Diablo experience on mobile, which everybody will get to play, and hopefully, which will bring new heroes to Sanctuary as well as welcoming our community back into it and something we’re very excited about."
Blizzard has simplified their games to grow their customer base, such as the Cataclysm expansion to World of Warcraft. These simplifications have not been well received by the existing players. My reaction to Diablo Immortal is skepticism about how much crunch there will be. Diablo 3 was not terribly interesting for me after you got past the first few playthroughs, compared to Diablo 2 or more modern ARPGs like Path of Exile.
It's not really anger, it's disappointment; if Immortal turns out to be a great game, I'll happily buy it. The noises Blizzard are hearing from the fans are basically a reminder that they have lost customers when trying to get new ones.
Gamers: "Is this a joke? We don't want mobile Diablo"
Game Press: "Gamers are whiny, entitled, toxic babies"
You can see it here for yourself: https://i.redd.it/6mgpttba94w11.jpg
It's been this way for a long time and was the reason Gamergate became a thing (see "Gamers are Dead"). The worst part is that because the journalists in the game industry are friends with the journalists in the mainstream media, their take on "toxic" gamers gets spread beyond the industry and their own actions never get called out aside from grassroots movements.
In the end, people who don't have time to research the topic themselves, believe the narrative they're told thus empowering the journalists to continue to attack their audience.
"In the end, people who don't have time to research the topic themselves, believe the narrative they're told thus empowering the journalists to continue to attack their audience."
I realize how stupid I was at that point, and while I don't think I went "full-on-mysogyny", I was definitely holding a somewhat dated viewpoint which I regret now.
They are definitely not representing the consumer here.
It's a shame watching the quite literal rage that has come about from a company announcing a product decision that wasn't the one that some portion, however large, of the community wanted. Assuming Kotaku is correct and there is still a new Diablo separate from this in the works, then it's a societal disgrace to watch grown adults raging out over a mobile game being announced ESPECIALLY in the context of the game that they actually want is ALSO in the works.
I find it odd that you demand some sort of standard from the game journalism community but find no need to expect a reasonable standard from the gamer community.
The largest, from what I gather.
Speaking as a non-fan, it was an egregious mistake to announce it at a conference geared toward hardcore Diablo consumers. This is conspicuously glossed over in social media commentary: had they announced it online in business-as-usual fashion no one would care. Instead we're directed to shame fans about not collectively giving a fuck about mediocre cash grabs.
"Hey, we're working on the game you want. In the mean time here's another game for different users."
"Noooooo! I've been betrayed! This is the ultimate insult!!!!"
And as much as people don't want to admit it, gamergate was the same thing.
I've spent a lot of time gaming in my past, but there's something unhealthy floating around here. If you saw this own behavior in your own son or daughter you'd recognize it instantly.
And now to take this one step too far, to where I'll get negative responses: It's almost as if the hundreds of hours spent in online cultures where flaming vitriol is spewed at the smallest slight has developed a subculture where (obviously not all) but a significant group of people can't handle when things slightly deviate from their wants.
It's funny, but I'm reminded of Willy Wonka's factory tour.
You know what pc gamers don't like? Pay2win. And any business model that usually runs on mobile that is not buy once (or monthly subscription), because in any other situation, the game is focused on pulling more money for you.
That’s why people feel betrayed by a mobile game. They created their average customer to be of a specific niche, then they create something that is completely out of that niche. What's your expectation there? Did you ever try to show a ballet instead of a soccer game at the stadium? I bet the problem would be much worse.
And to be fair, I don't care at all (and I stopped being a Blizzard fan long long time ago), I just find ridiculous that people can't understand why the fans are angry.
They created the fans, then created a game that is completely against their fanbase.
Compare this to Fallout Shelter. No-one minded as it was not made to be the prime of a show, especially one not focused on mobile gaming.
Even announcing it before wc3 remastered would have produced way less outrage.
It’s like having a classical music festival suddenly change into heavy rock and then whining about how the audience is entitled. There is nothing wrong with either music style. It’s just the sudden switch from what the audience expected that’s jarring.
Any publications out there that might be an exception?
That said, Niche Gamer is alright if you don't mind seeing a lot of anime in their articles. I don't care for anime games as a rule but it doesn't offend me either.
I don't understand why the response from people that should know better is to act surprised at them, and feel justified in stooping to such low levels and pettiness themselves.
Well, I guess I can make guesses as to the "why," but none of them are answers that would let me sleep well at night if I were the one doing it. Maybe the sleep deprivation is why they're so cranky.
A) We've hired amazing people and we're working super hard on the next big Diablo title on PC, and here's one cool cinematic / picture to show it.
B) A *separate* team of amazing devs has achieved the impossible and created a brand new diablo experience on mobile.
Instead of saying "don't you have phones?" they should have said "We are working on a new Diablo PC title but we aren't ready to talk about it yet".
Would have been a very different reaction.
The only "better" answer that I can think of would be a vague, general hint that Blozzard is working on more titles than those that are announced. But that would immediately be interpreted as "Diablo IV confirmed" and blown out of proportion.
The gaming community has in recent years developed a culture of latching on to smallest of hints, letting their imagination roam freely to create a kind of groupthink dream of what the project would be. And than they react not only with disappointment, but also with hate, anger and aggression against the developers when these dream bubbles are busted. This lack of moderation in the community is disconcerting and if we don't find efficient ways to dampen that, we will see this get out of hands.
Games are made by companies for profit. If they release something that you like, enjoy it. If you don't like it, move on. I don't understand any need to fuel hate to the levels we are seeing repeatedly these days.
I'm almost certain it was partially rehearsed.
I know, that's why you usually prepare a series of answers for QAs.
And sure, some things you can't prepare for, but a PC question from fans of a PC game is inevitable.
The people handling marketing and products at Blizzard, and EA, and Bethesda aren't in touch with their most loyal fans. I can only imagine how much money there must be in in-game transactions, given that all three companies continue to upset fans that don't mind paying $60 for a new release.
"Vault-Tec has noticed many overseers prefer game icons with faces screaming to the right. In an effort to raise your enjoyment and thoughtlessly blend in with the crowd, we’ve updated for a limited time. You’re welcome!"
(this is from a Reddit comment)
Blizzard's claims that this thing is built from scratch from the ground up are laughable.
Of course Blizzard, Diablo, and ARPG mobile games, have a long history so there is more context. For one Blizzcon is something this crowd could compare to WWDC and similar conventions. Tickets start at around $200, with travel, food, lodging, and other expenses pushing the cost of attendance to over $1000 for many people. Keep in mind that unlike WWDC or other conventions your employer will likely not pay for you to go - so its straight out of pocket and people expect to get what they pay for. In addition Blizzard has been pushing "Virtual Tickets" for $50, where most gaming conventions stream for free to users on Twitch or Youtube.
It's been over 6 years since Diablo 3, and there was a 12 year wait for that game after Diablo 2. Naturally seeing Diablo as the topic of the keynote, many Diablo fans hoped and prayed it was the Diablo 4 announcement.
Finally ARPG mobile games are massive in the Chinese market, with fremium and micro-transaction models that would make candy crush and Pokemon Go blush. With a blatant re-skin it was clearly designed for a starkly different marketing segment then would be present at the keynote at Blizzcon. To force your developers to pitch that game to that crowd is sheer incompetence, yielding what will surly be timeless internet memes such as "you all have phones right" [1], and "this is an April Fools joke right" [2].
[1]: Response to the question if they'd be porting long-requested features present in the mobile game back to the Diablo 3 PC version.
[2]: Question asked directly on stage by a brave fan.
https://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2018-06-10-as-the-interne...
https://www.reddit.com/r/commandandconquer/comments/9nbrfm/c...
I think the bigger issue here is that companies are being greedy and want to use their flagship games as marketing to profit on microtransactions (which are very common) in mobile games.
This is what fans are mostly upset about.
So that's why people are angry - they were waiting 5 years and got this.
D1/D2 has a sizable backstory that sucked people into the hack-and-slash gameplay. The pseudorandom map generation made it very playable. The fact that the game sucked you in and made it hard to stop mashes well with the story.
D3 kinda forgot about the backstory and the tone.
A mobile phone would simply run out of battery maybe an hour into that kind of game play.
I can’t be outraged of course. I gave up on Diablo a long time ago.
The article briefly mentioned there was some outrage when they announced the console version too. Well, that’s quite understandable, because the game is really shallow, Zynga-style.
Diablo was never a RPG with depth of course, the gameplay being basically a mindless point and click, but there was a lot of fun in character development, and there are entire websites devoted to guides for developing your character in Diablo 2 and all of that is gone in Diablo 3. Blizzard somehow managed to completely miss the point of what made Diablo 2 awesome.
If they announced a remastered Diablo 2, I’d stay in line for it. Otherwise I don’t see the point of a new Diablo, as I know it will suck.
And yes, for diehard fans, I completely understand the outrage.
So naturally the anger gets directed towards the game. Had they announced anything else with it such as D4 news, D3 dlc, D2 remaster...literally anything else, it would have been fine.
Also remember Blizzard is not Blizzard/Activision and many of the old guard has left. Mike Morhaime and Chris Metzen departures were huge. I wonder if the writing is on the wall.
Let me paint a picture. You buy tickets to see Rage Again the Machine perform, and RATM come out, and instead of performing their set, the do a mime act and that's it. They are done.
You'd be pissed. Now, let's realize for a second, they performed for you, and they're performance might be something some people are interested in. Just not the audience that paid to see them. So yeah, people are going to be insulted.
People don't care that Blizzard is making a mobile game. What they are upset with is that the audience they are presenting to, the fans they are reaching out to that still play Diablo, that were literally present, were completely ignored.
Finally, let's not ignore the fact that this is really just a cash grab at a Chinese market. That's fine if that's what they want to do, but it's being driven by that market (this is clear because they are adopting patterns popular in China and not the West). Just don't pretend that another audience is going to cheer for the fact that they are being ignored.
IIRC fans paid $200 tickets and I imagine even some traveled to go to the conf because there was so much hype around a new Diablo game.
If you really want something, build it yourself. If you can't do it on your own, open source it and build a community. If you can't do that then your just begging to be disappointed. Relying on complete strangers to continually entertain you in exactly the way you want to be entertained, otherwise you'll lash out - it's sick and dystopian.
Remember COD:MW2 protests?
https://kotaku.com/5403286/what-modern-warfare-2-boycotters-...
1) those who can extrapolate from incomplete data
Many, though certainly not all PC gamers are serious about not having their platform choices manipulated by exclusivity deals. It is interpreted as bullying, and we have had plenty of practice sticking to that belief against attempts to coerce people to buy every console. Red Dead Redemption 2 was just released, but even though it looks like an actually good game, it simply doesn't exist for me until it comes to PC.
You don't know what the monetization scheme will be but you are sure it will use dark patterns to drain peoples wallets.
You apparently didn't read the article to see what the similar GUI patterns they replicated were but you are certain it's just another pay to win game.
Your bias is showing.
In some ways it also tarnishes the Android and Apple brand, which is why I think Google reacted with multi-accounts device sharing and YouTube kids. I wonder how much mobile gaming revenue is because parents signed in with their credit card and there aren't multiple accounts on iOS, and you can't update a game without the parent signing back in, and Family Sharing has no granularity. I have to think that Apple has walked over every inch of their UX and knows this.
On Blizzard, I'm feeling what they mismanaged was the fact that their conference is expensive and anticipated enough to travel to, but what they announced is for a different audience.
As corporations become ever larger, it becomes harder to make demand-side opinions observable, and so it becomes necessary to employ more extreme forms of protest to avoid being overpowered by the sell-side attempts at influence. If that influence is not opposed, the market will become entirely dominated by the sell-side and will allow trust-like abuse of power, destroying the equilibrium pressure by which markets are allegedly regulated. This kind of market abuse does not require monopolies, and appears to be a blind spot for many proponents of market economies.
This is not just a problem with gaming, and one could reasonably argue that there are more important battles to fight. That said, this is probably one of the few markets where that kind of demand-side mobilization is still possible, as many others have already been neutralized by divide-and-conquer tactics.
> Your bias is showing.
Your ignorance of the market is showing.
Sure, because it's not just a reskin. They are creating new models, too. When people say "reskin," they sometimes aren't literally talking just about skins. Rather, they are talking about making another game on top of the same basic engine that exists in other games. And considering who Blizzard is partnering with to make this game and the other games they've put out, you can see there point.
And maybe successful COD example is due to the more casual gamers who wouldn't attend a conference (given that there are many more of them, it doesn't take as much engagement for financial success. )