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Comment by ptd | Hacker News Reader

How do you control the content your children are exposed to once they go to school?

I remember being shocked about a decade ago that a group of 3rd graders had seen The Hangover(a rated R movie) without the permission of their parents. When I asked how they were able to do this without their parents knowing, they almost laughed at me.

The idea that their parents could effectively censor the content they consumed was not something they understood. There was always someone with a phone, computer, laptop, USB key, DVD, etc.

When kids are young and you(or a loved one) has eyes on them 24/7 it’s easy to control their lives, and the content they are exposed to. I’m very curious as to how parents effectively censor the world for older kids who are around other kids, without turning into the dreaded “helicopter” parent.

It seems like an overwhelming challenge.

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I hate to break it to you but children being exposed to "unsavory" things outside of parental supervision is part of growing up. It's called street smarts.

Ever watch watch south park? Then you know who Kenny is and how dysfunctional his family is. Every kid meets a Kenny in their lifetime. They're the kid who knows where his parents porn stash is kept and by 13 is raiding their parents booze and drug stash. He's the kid whose house you go to watch R films and look at hustler magazines (I'm dating myself here). They also most likely had a hacked cable box with the playboy channel. In their bedroom.

Of course your parents told you to stay away "from that boy". But after school you tell your parents you're "going to John's house to study" but instead you and a few other friends meet up at "Kenny's" place ;-). Though, It's not all porn and bad things. It's just a great place to hang out and play ball or nintendo or whatever because no one is telling you to study or do homework. It's pure rebellious freedom and it's exciting.

You can't shield your kids forever. And the more you shield them the worse prepared they are for the harsh realities of the world. The best approach is to educate your kids of dangers and and hope for the best. Teach them about sex, drugs, alcohol, smoking, violence, abuse, behavioral issues, etc. Make sure they know what can be potentially harmful. My mother and father did a good job of that so I knew when to hang back and say "no thanks". I stayed away from drinking and drushguse my who adolescent life.

So I'm broadly sympathetic to that point of view, but I think you also have to account for the changes in the world since you or I grew up. I didn't grow up in a world where dozens of PhDs were using massive targeted AI computations to figure out how to manipulate me. I didn't have online Skinner boxes backed by, again, a horde of PhDs or equivalents with every motivation to separate me from my money, time, and attention. You need to present your children with some challenges and help them overcome it, but you can't put them in a cage match with the entire modern advertising industry, or expect them to figure out YouTube and the rather exploitative practices and dodgy videos kids can dig up, all on their own at the age of 5 either. I didn't grow up in a world of social media, and all the pathologies that come with it, many of which are probably much worse for developing minds than when I finally had a chance to get into it. (And, in fact, I've never had a Facebook account, and my Twitter account was created just for a couple of stupid sites that used it for auth; it's unused by me. The adult me rejected those sites from the get-go.)

I did grow up with some smart people trying to manipulate me in between cartoon breaks. (Personally I tended not to watch the most exploitative "cartoons that are just ads for toys" sorts myself, but YMMV. It wasn't my own brilliance, though, just my personal taste.) But it was very amorphous and poorly targeted at me personally. There's no AI chewing over my video preferences and figuring out what I'm most vulnerable to. It made for much better practice in becoming a bit cynical about such things. I also grew up in a world of video games, but again, the feedback loop was too big and amorphous to manipulate me very effectively. It was still potentially addicting, no question, but much, much less so than a modern mobile gacha game or something.

I'm taking a staggered approach myself. I know they have to learn themselves. I'm literally budgeting for them to buy a few things of their own free will, and then be disappointed in the result. It's part of life, and like many things, better experienced young while it still doesn't really matter. But I'm also moderating the rate at which this stuff comes in to them, because I'm not even particularly convinced it was a fair fight in the 1980s when I grew up, and it's not even close today.

Show them a patient on dialysis machine and say “this will be you if you if you think I’m bsing you”

On top of that, kids develop differently at different ages. Pre-school is extremely important as it's foundation building time. Get the, addicted to tech from day 1 and they'll have lots of issues later on. But if they learn the ropes in a healthy way, they'll have a good foundation once they meet "Kenny" later on.

> How do you control the content your children are exposed to once they go to school?

Not OP, but in my opinion it should be pretty easy to control undesirable content. Nobody likes ads; I see no reason for the kids to actively seek out ads once they know what ads really are.

As far as controlling "desirable" content like movies, games, etc, I'm not sure it should be, but that's a rant for another day!

> Nobody likes ads

Right, adults who are fully aware of the purpose of advertising don't, e.g., actively look forward to Superbowl half-time ads.

There's a difference between being curious about Super Bowl ads (which cost millions to air and are vetted) and the garbage that are internet ads where anyone with a (potentially stolen) credit card can publish anything they want with no oversight.

The former can be considered a form of art; the latter is just cancer.

There's also a difference between entertainment and mere engagement. Superbowl ads are entertaining. They may be trying to influence your decisions, but they ultimately leave you with the feeling that you have your own free will intact.

The mere engagement of internet ads is often just a crude attempt to program peoples decisions by pressing all the right psychological buttons.

Of course, Superbowl ads arguably press those same buttons, but I tend to think that typical online ads are optimized to press those buttons as hard as possible all the time. Being subjected to that is exhausting and frustrating.

Incidentally, that's why I decided to quit playing MMO's (and most video games) 10 years ago.

It’s about the stages of brain development, and providing choice and education to kids at the level they’re ready for. The hope is that by the time they are exposed to things on their own, you’ve equipped them with the skills and habits they need to navigate the world.

The reason for my gray hairs is that the kids are always ready for the next level of freedom before I am :) Whether it’s the taller swing set, climbing that tree, etc.

It’s a fine line between helicoptering and protecting. And the line is always shifting. My two year old isn’t ready to climb a tree on her own; but soon, she’ll be able to.

So, you can’t protect forever — nor should you. But you can continually stretch their personal responsibility and prepare for what’s coming up on the horizon.

Has another commenter said, and I agree with him, as kids grows into teenage age, supporting and explaining is more efficient than controlling.

>I’m very curious as to how parents effectively censor the world for older kids who are around other kids, without turning into the dreaded “helicopter” parent.

If you don't let kids above the age of 6 play on their own with no adult supervision, then you're already a helicopter parent. You might be a milder version of it, but you'll produce some of the same dependence.

At the age of 7 go to school on their own and come back home on their own. They often play unsupervised and walk around town on their own. You cannot stop kids from being exposed to content you disapprove of without being a helicopter parent.

Well, that is a strange school, such a viewing would cause nationwide outrage if it happened in my country.

Even in the best schools, it’s impossible to have eyes on what every kid is watching all day. You can ban technology, but even then clever kids will figure out a way to get them in.

I also don’t believe the viewing was done in school, but the kids were classmates who met in school.

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