America, Compromised: Lawrence Lessig Explains Corruption
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I've been driving around Africa for 2 years now, and at least here it's always really blatant and clear.
Because there is more of it.
In America, it happens behind closed doors in boardrooms and offices.
'Unlimited Campaign Contributions' is nothing more than newspeak for corruption. By very definition, it is about paying a person in a position of power to make a decision that is in your favor.
You are equating two different things. One, giving a politician money they can spend on personal luxuries for a political favor. Two, giving a strictly-regulated campaign money it can spend on advertising, political functions, et cetera, or less-regulated PACs.
Personal versus political benefits is one major diffference. Prevalence, and the necessity of engaging with corrupt organs to survive and thrive, is another.
Claiming corruption in America even rivals most of the world is unsubstantiated. The inverse is well substantiated.
Nobody cares about the little sticker you put on your license plate. It's a $5 fundraiser. In my state I think the non-LEO license plates you're talking about are an extra $30 or $40 on top of your normal registration fees.
The only thing I've ever heard having any affect like what you're implying are the "police courtesy cards," PBA/FOP cards, whatever they're called in your state. And I haven't heard of them actually preventing any punishment, just incurring more of it.
The only purpose they can serve is to corrupt.
The whole point of those interactions is to not talk about what happened.
Small gifts can have a big effect. There’s a reason drug reps always want to buy doctors lunches. It’s not for charity: that low double-digit “gift” pays for itself. And the out-the-door cost is $hundreds.
So when I call my elected leaders to voice up about an issue, that's bribery? Because what I'm doing is lobbying. Or, if I call my elected leader and patch in a friend in another state who's more knowledgeable about the domain, is that lobbying?
If it's not, then what if my friend and I both patch in an out-of-district friend? What if we form a formal club? If we want (a) freedom of political speech and (b) freedom of political assembly, it gets really hard to separate a grassroots interest group from a destructive commercial one. (And should civic interests always trump commercial interests? That's a political question, too!)
TL; DR Democracy can't exist without lobbying. With respect to paid lobbying, I might agree, but the devil's in the details.
"Here's a sports car for you if you vote the way I like on this issue": this suggests that the sports car bought the vote, and so is indicative of corruption.
"I like your position on this issue, here's some money for your campaign to help you get elected, and that can only be spent for that": this suggests that the position is the cause of the money, not the other way around, and so is not indicative of corruption.
The political benefits beget personal benefits. That's the point.
They are both corruption under two different names, no matter how you prevaricate.
Bob, who agrees with those policies and positions, gives a large donation to Alice's campaign.
Alice wins, and works toward those positions and policies.
Are you saying Alice is corrupt because her campaign took money from someone who agreed with her stated positions?
There's also the personal utility view of this - if it is power they desire and you finance their acquisition of power, isn't that in a sense bribery? If they want power, why buy them a sports car....
It's clear to me that we need real campaign finance reform. No more dark money or third party political action committees. The fate of our democracy probably depends on it.
These enormous sums are far outside the normal. It reeks corruption.
You forgot to add "for political favor" on the end of the third sentence.
I don't care how they're spending it, they're being given it because the person doing the giving wants a decision made in their favor. That's the very definition of bribery and corruption.
i.e. High Mr. Politician. I will give you $600,000 in "campaign contributions" so long as you vote against this particular thing that would be very inconvenient to my profits.
Why do you think that is? Is it Ideology? Or is it just profitable to get that decision in their favor?
Your comment makes no sense at all. Do you believe that in the land where military men carrying AK47 overtly demand bribes you don't see any corruption happening behind closed doors?
In fact, the only reasonable take from your observation is that there might be corruption in the US but at least society is effective at shutting down corruption by lowly law enforcement officers.
Sounds blatantly clear to me.
The United States and Africa are both enormous land masses. While the United States is nominally a single country, it has enormous differences in culture from region to region, and even between different populations in the same region. Africa has lots of different countries, climates, cultures, etc. "There is more corruption in Africa than the United States" is too general a statement to be meaningful.
You can make meaningful, specific statements about the corruption in each place. I've never been to Africa, but two glaring and public examples of what I would call corruption in the United States from recent years are:
- the current President openly patronizes his own businesses using public funds, in what appears to be a clear violation of emoluments laws. The parts of the government responsible for ensuring the executive branch follows these laws have failed to engage in oversight or curtail this practice in any meaningful way.
- law enforcement officials routinely take property from individuals (under the widely adopted practice of civil asset forfeiture) without charging the individuals with any crime, in what appears to be a clear violation of the fourth amendment of the constitution.
There is corruption in America. It is really blatant and clear. The extent to which you experience it may vary, but at a minimum, reasonable people have to agree that it exists, and it exists right on the surface for everyone to see.
A society that aspirationally pretends it has less corruption than it really does can often better contain corruption. The magnitude and practices of corruption can be confined to certain sectors & ritualized, obscured mechanisms – and its expansion checked with a surviving norm that "here, we don't do that".
There is a reason why the masses are clamoring to get to EU or USA, immigration hurdles notwithstanding. And clean governance without much hassle to your daily life is a big part of it.
Will they retaliate against the zones that don’t vote their way?
The recent tax bill was a good example. It was constructed to inflict the most pain on blue states.
In response, I would just say that, yes, I do understand the recent tax bill. At it's core, it's part of a long term plan to reduce government by starving it for money, at the same time it is a giveaway to large campaign donors. These are not speculation, but directly acknowledged by the spineless and craven Speaker of the House Rep. Paul Ryan.
Blue states tend to spend a lot more money on government services, especially education. This makes the taxes higher, but it was evened out somewhat by a reduction in federal tax burden. With that gone, it adds a lot more pressure to tax payers in states with higher property taxes. Those states tend to be blue. When evaluating the wisdom of this change, keep in mind that those states also tend to be net payers into the federal system, while red states tend to be net takers from the federal system. There are exceptions but the trend is clear.
I care less about this and more about the fact that the federal government isn't bringing in enough revenue to cover its responsibilities.
The cynic on me thinks this is by design. It's much easier to press for the removal of programs when you can point towards how we're continuously unable to avoid a deficit because of them...
And Mitch McConnell is talking about making cuts to the big three social insurance programs to address deficits [0]. This comes after he championed and passed major reductions in tax revenue last year, to the benefit primarily of corporations and the very wealthy.
[0] https://talkingpointsmemo.com/dc/mcconnell-calls-for-cutting...
Certainly the popularity of the social insurance programs makes politicians, regardless of party, wary of cutting them but I expect that there have been cases where a bill with cuts has passed the House but failed in the Senate only because the need to get 60 votes to avoid a filibuster.
Now consider that the tax bill makes private school tuition tax deductible, but state taxes that pay for public school non-deductible. Hardly progressive.
The addition of other subsidies is orthogonal to the capping of the state and local tax deduction.
No, the context is important. The republicans would look a lot less hypocritical if they also capped tuition deductions, church donation deductions, etc, because the services those fund overlap a lot with what state taxes fund.
As it is, the tax bill largely looks like a trampling of states rights to determine their own taxes, and a pushing of the conservative model of "private schools are better than public schools", "homeless shelters should be run by churches, not by the state" etc.
And if other parts of the country are poorer, the Federal government should address that by its outlays, which it does:
https://wallethub.com/edu/states-most-least-dependent-on-the...
One of the most annoying aspects of social discourse right now is that everyone is redefining words and very few people have a common meaning for important words. Lessig's definition of corruption is different than my definition and different than the legal definition. I see this happening all over the place "hate speech" is also a good example every time I have a conversation or read an article about "hate speech" the definition has changed.
How are we supposed to have civil discourse when the meanings of words are constantly shifting?
Maybe technology is speeding that evolution, given the rate at which we're able to converse, you could convince me it's more difficult to keep up with the evolution today than it has historically been.
We aren't. To some parties, that's the whole point of doing it. I don't think that's what's happening here, though. He isn't changing the meaning of the word. He's contradicting a previous re-definition of the word by restoring the traditional meaning.
from TFA:
> The courts and their ideological backers -- the Chicago School economists who used shitty math to prove that greed is good and that corruption consists solely of direct quid-pro-quo bribery -- have served as enablers and even cheerleaders for this new Gilded Age, celebrating anonymous political cash contributions as a form of speech protected under the First Amendment and arguing that the Framers of the Constitution would have agreed wholeheartedly with them.
> Lessig walks a fine line between academic and activist as he rebuts this argument...
a review would have been nicer rather then simply stating Chicago School is evil and setting up for the foundation of his argument. If this is suppose to read asd a review for some reason it feels like it is missing something that I cannot put my finger on yet.
Yea, I stopped there. Interested in other's reactions though.
> Lessig walks a fine line between academic and activist
Society doesn't need (and can't afford) more people conflating activism and academy.
Montesquieu, Burke, etc...
Academic ideas renew society.
> Lester Lawrence Lessig III is an American academic, attorney, and political activist.
So it's pretty clear that he's both.
Others have rightly pointed out that there have been many examples of academics who were also activists, and you're pointing out that Lessig is an academic on paper (as are the "academics" I referenced in the previous paragraph, although Lessig may be legitimate). Both of these are valid, correct observations, but they miss my point (which isn't to say that my point is good; only that it survives these observations! :) ).
take their snark in stride — focus on the big picture
Mr. Lessig and I were both born in the same place: Rapid City, South Dakota. Mr. Lessig hasn't lived here in a long time to my understanding, but I've lived here for most of my life. If the Electoral College were to be "abolished," South Dakota and basically the rest of the nation would be entirely beholden to the whims of the most populous centers of the country: New York and California. The Electoral College system may not be perfect, yet it gives a voice to those outside of a few major metropolitan areas with incredibly dense populations, and for that I am grateful, as the United States is a Republic of States and not a single, homogeneous population.
The fact that he's repeatedly made claims against the validity and importance of these aspects of the Electoral College system in recent years gives me pause when evaluating his political views going forward. In the past I would've purchased his book immediately upon hearing it existed but now I'm definitely hesitant.
I am open to hearing alternative solutions for the Electoral College system that take into account the incredibly diverse Republic of States that our nation consists of, but his repeated claims of "a vote from a citizen of Montana is essentially worth [n]% that of a vote in California" seem disingenuous at best—even if literally true—as they ignore the reason for the Electoral College's existence to begin with, as well as how it fits into the rest of our system of government and elections.
My South Dakotan vote for President may be "worth more" than that of someone in California, yet California gets fifty-three Representatives whereas South Dakota gets only one.
Yes, almost 90% of people debating the Electoral College neglect to mention it was originally created as an alternative to citizens directly electing the president. It was never about giving citizens in Montana more power, it was about giving Montana more power. Thinking otherwise is hugely anachronistic. It wasn't even technologically possible at the time to take a nationwide popular vote.
In 1789, 1.8% of America voted. Four colonies didn't even hold a popular vote. [1] In 1800, 10 of 16 states had electors selected by state legislatures. In 1824, Andrew Jackson lost despite having a plurality of the popular vote and the vote as it would be assigned today (electors voting by the state majority). [2]
BTW, California gets 55 electoral college votes while South Dakota gets 3. South Dakota gets exactly as many senators as a state over 45 times as large.
Further, your argument that the rest of the nation would be helpless in a fair fight with New York and California just doesn't hold up. You have to include the 10 largest states to reach a majority of America. Ironically, while you claim opponents of the electoral college overlook the "incredibly diverse Republic of States", your argument only holds up if you ignore any diversity between those ten states, and the people inside them. Can you honestly say that California, Texas, Illinois, Michigan, Ohio, Pennsylvania, New York, Georgia, and Florida are significantly more homogenous than the rest of America?
Furthermore, the electoral college does worse than nothing to protect local interests. America under the electoral college doesn't ensure every state gets counted. It ensures that swing states get counted. Are you really better off being counted as a member of a state that's gone red all but once since 1940, rather than as a person with an actual stake in the election?
Opponents of the electoral college don't primarily take issue with the weighting of votes. We take issue with the incredibly toxic effect winner take all states has on politics and policies.
[1]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_ele...
[2]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Electoral_Colleg...
I can think of several states that might jump at a gubernatorial candidate who said "I will take no political positions. I'll fix/repeal these faulty laws, reform those finance and districting issues, then resign." And a few towns have actually done it already when their budget issues got bad enough.
Obviously it's going to draw opposition from whoever thinks the finance or districting problems are benefitting them, but some places do hit the point where process issues look like a bigger deal than political ones.
In social change this is the only one that matters:
"(what is profitable)" all other "forces" are bound by this at systemic level.
> "(what is considered ethical)"
it can only function if you go back to "what is profitable" because if it is not ethical and there is no law to prevent it then it will be done because it is profitable.
If it is ethical, and it is not profitable, you can rest assure it will not be pursued not matter how good you feel.
Example: Feed the hungry, it is a great ethical idea, but it is seldom profitable so you do not see any company going out of their way to invest in feeding the hungry.
> "(what is legal)"
this also runs only on what is profitable. If it is not legal, but it is profitable then you can be sure that the laws will soon be changed to accommodate. i.e. Cannabis movement.
> "(what is technically possible)"
also runs on what is profitable. We can technically do anything we want but is it profitable?
Don't be fooled by these articles that find a "novel" way of looking at the problem. It is just noise. If you can't fix the monetary policy in the world, then "what is profitable" will always be what drives any social change
https://www.npr.org/2016/12/10/505079091/lawrence-lessig-off...
HN even has brigaders now. Its really pathetic. dang you have let this go to shit, I don't really care if you ban my account for saying so either.
I suppose people in certain positions would have to be of this view, for their internal sanity.
Whether it’s net neutrality, IP law, GDPR, or what have you, there are worthwhile discussions to have about how laws affect tech and how they could be better.
I’d much rather have those discussions with people who understand technology well. People who don’t understand tech well have demonstrated that they will pass deeply flawed laws like the DMCA thanks in part to their lack of understanding (in addition to corruption of the political process).
Also, as I recall Lessig's work used to focus on copyright and intellectual property, and it was his experience trying to advocate for sensible reforms to those laws that led him to shift his focus towards what he terms the "corruption" that allow the Disneys and Comcasts of the world to force through bad laws like the DMCA (or repealing net neutrality) and block more sensible laws and regulations. So there is a line from this post back towards tech-related law issues.
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1934367
https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=6157485
There has always been a mix of political stories here. pg's criterion was that they were ok as long as they were intellectually interesting and not only about politics.
Lots of links here if anyone wants more: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=17014869