More Companies That No Longer Require a Degree
glassdoor.com
glassdoor.com
Note that I'm a software engineer who dropped out of college, so you can take what I say with a few grains of salt. :)
And in my very own experience companies favoured me over people with "only" university degrees, simply because of my work experience + the knowledge I acquired, even tho the knowledge was probably less in-depth.
There are also corporative study programs, but the majority either studies or does [0]
[0]https://www.make-it-in-germany.com/en/for-qualified-professi...
Makes sense though. The only reason businesses ever started putting "bachelor degree required" on job ads is to help protect themselves in case of a hiring discrimination lawsuit. I provides a defence of "We didn't hire <person of minority> because they did not have the required degree." Courts have shown a willingness to accept this defence.
It is not there as information for job seekers, but to keep the lawyers happy.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/worldviews/wp/20...
https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2018/apr/03/india-school-e...
But there's many more where the requirement to have a degree seems counter intuitive. Universities were about expanding and democratising learning and seeking new knowledge and understanding. I never understood why people leave university expecting a job out of it - it may have worked for the previous generation because few had degrees but I doubt it works now.
Hopefully, in the near future, students will be enrolling in universities because they want to learn - not because they feel its their only ticket to a decent job.
Maybe because universities have relentlessly touted alumni employee numbers and advertised themselves as an avenue to secure a job for decades now
It would be like an opiate manufacturer advertising "FDA approved pain management solutions" for decades, and then turning around and saying "well you never should have expected to avoid becoming addicted to opiates."
The intrinsic value of a modern degree is that it demonstrates that a person can finish something that they started, regardless of being a number during that process.
I also have had PhD's reporting to me.
It is interesting when I do run into companies who think a degree is important and I tend to compare them in a less than favorable light to those who do not.
A lot of the others fell along the same category. No, you don't need a degree to be a developer, and you never did. But now you can get a job because employers have no choice but to acknowledge that fact.
Overall, it's a good thing, but it shouldn't have taken this much pressure for it to happen.
It's also wrong about listed jobs:they list Publix as hiring pharmacists. That job absolutely requires a degree, I know of no way to get liscenced without one. So overall this is just crap, the only mildly interesting info was IBM being listed.
That said, I still wish I would have had the opportunity to go to school. I’m increasingly finding I don’t have the same kind of network had I went to school.
It’s possible to build a network while you are working but it’s much harder because you are at the mercy of your employer and the work power dynamic is different than university. You are also at the mercy of your employer and the people he chooses to surround you with, and don’t have as much control or exposure as I feel you would in university.
At least for me employers always talk a big game when it comes to investing in their employees education but I’ve never experienced that personally. They are too focused on the sprint, the next sprint, the quarterly OKR’s and with most of their employees not lasting more than a year or two why invest in someone long term? This puts all the effort on the employee who must then learn on their own time in addition to working and making their boss & co-workers happy.
The last one is killer for me. Most of the people you meet at work aren’t entrepreneurial. I think there’s a reason why a lot of people start companies from people they know in school. Many of the people I’ve meet throughout my career in tech don’t even like tech, they’re just working a job. I feel like at a university it would be easier to filter these people out of your professional network, where as at work you can be stuck with them for years. It’s easy to drop or add a class and be exposed to new people but try dropping a team or a boss.
The difference, roughly, if I remember correctly, is that Professional Engineers are the only ones who can “sign off” on work and essentially assume liability. Therefore, you can be an uncertified Engineer as long as you’re working under someone certified or if your work doesn’t require sign-off from someone certified.
Are there any PE’s here that can tell me if that’s correct?
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2017/12/0...
It’s easy for people to forget that the engineering came first. The students came after. You can argue the point all day, but it will always come down to one person figuring shit out by themselves.
From wikipedia:
"In many countries, engineering tasks such as the design of bridges, electric power plants, industrial equipment, machine design and chemical plants, must be approved by a licensed professional engineer. Most commonly titled professional engineer"
"In the United States, engineering is a regulated profession whose practice and practitioners are licensed and governed by law. Licensure is generally attainable through combination of education, pre-examination (Fundamentals of Engineering exam), examination (professional engineering exam),[19] and engineering experience (typically in the area of 5+ years). Each state tests and licenses professional engineers."
I'm not saying you're wrong, I'm just saying you might be fighting collective delusion in the wrong place.
On the other hand, if you claim you are an engineer to the usa gov't then yeah, that gets you in hot water. I also tend to avoid calling myself a software engineer specifically to avoid potential issues like that, but I do lost the full job title given to me by previous employers when asked and on my resume.
This is what the summary mentions as the only supporting evidence of any sort of credentialing:
“The foundational qualifications of an engineer typically include a 4-year bachelor's degree in an engineering discipline, or in some jurisdictions, a master's degree in an engineering discipline plus 4–6 years of peer-reviewed professional practice (culminating in a project report or thesis) and passage of engineering board examinations.”
Note that the word used is “typically” - this is very different than being a requirement. The definition of a professional engineer cited mentions no such credentialing required, speaking in broad terms of the characteristics & responsibilities of one, but no narrow hallmark of how one reaches the title.
The part he quoted is far from verifying his/her claim - just the opposite, it is evidence that he/she is misusing the term professional engineer and is not distinguishing from a licensed professional engineer from a professional engineer.
Total BS, to be a pharmacist you need to have a Doctor of Pharmacy (which is an advanced degree!) and be licensed by the appropriate government entity. Those 6-8 years of schooling aren't exactly optional.
Obviously, you can ask the pharmacist questions and get additional info, but that's not required for someone to hand me my vitamin D supplements.
It would save highly motivated self learners or people learning in an apprenticeship type situation such as an open source contributer years of their life, lots of money, and allow them to more quickly contribute to society.
What I'd argue is that your observation is a form of survivorship bias. Of the very small people who manage to succeed without a degree, those people will likely have a great deal of drive, self-motivation, and other traits to compensate for that lack of degree. I'd then argue that in the long term, those traits end up having a much greater impact on your ability to succeed than an education.
But that doesn't mean not having an education is overall a good thing. The majority of people without a degree will be absolutely incompetent software developers compared to those with a degree... you would just have never met them because they don't last long enough to work with you.
If a degree or formal education has been used as a barrier to restrict access for any time only the strongest and most driven of the degree-less are going to persevere and make it.
>4. Costco Wholesale
>Company Rating: 3.9
>Hiring For: Cashier, Stocker, Pharmacy Sales Assistant, Bakery Wrapper, Cake Decorator, Licensed Optician, Cashier Assistant, Depot Solutions Functional Analyst, Forklift Driver, Seasonal Help & more.
a degree was ever required.