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Comment by rapnie | Hacker News Reader

> Why would we gut policies that save thousands of lives and eliminate tens of thousands of cases of childhood asthma, bronchitis and emphysema annually? Why wouldn’t we want more efficient cars when we’re still importing three million barrels of oil a day from OPEC countries like Libya, Saudi Arabia and Venezuela?

Countless articles like this ask the same kind of questions over and over again. Leaving the reader to ponder the answers to them.

I'll answer here: People in power earn their money that way.

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As evidenced by the "rollin' coal" phenomenon, destroying the environment is a way to signal how manly you are.

Damn, I had forgotten about that.

But really, isn't it just a form of trolling?

> Practitioners cite "American freedom" and a stand against "rampant environmentalism" as reasons for coal rolling

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rolling_coal

My god. Every time I think I've seen all the possible dumb shit people do something like this inevitably comes up.

Funny you should say "god". Some argue that environmentalism is inconsistent with Genesis. In that God gave us everything to use as we see fit. But others say that God made humans responsible for managing the Earth. So that environmentalism is indeed Godly. That makes more sense to me, not that I'm particularly religious.

It's interesting - yet eating a single apple cast us out of paradise. Maybe the symbolism here is: Don't take what wasn't yours for the taking (i.e. earth's resources).

For the religiously inclined, consider that this planet earth could become our "paradise". Destroying its resources may just cast all of us out of paradise once again.

Not that it's likely to change anyone's mind, but I do recommend The Making of a Conservative Environmentalist by Gordon K. Durnil (Indiana Univ., 1995).[0]

As I recall, one of the core arguments was the equivalence of abusing a child, and poisoning them by polluting the environment. So if one is evil, why not the other?

0) https://www.kirkusreviews.com/book-reviews/gordon-k-durnil/t...

The Bible is very pro-nature.

BTW: https://biblehub.com/revelation/11-18.htm

"The nations were angry, and your wrath has come. The time has come for judging the dead, and for rewarding your servants the prophets and your people who revere your name, both great and small-- and for destroying those who destroy the earth."

On balance, I agree. But some do quote selectively, to justify all sorts of horror.

The words used in my bible are "stewardship". That is, we're responsible for maintaining this property in the master's absence.

That's an excellent translation!

> a stand against "rampant environmentalism"

That is like randomly beating people up as a stand against "rampant humanism".

Well, you know, that's also a thing.

It makes me very sad to say this, but you are right.

My longhair friends and I were targeted now and again, back in the 60s-70s. For a while, I carried a folding buck knife. But then we all started doing Aikido, which was much better overall. Because defense mostly ends up being verbal, flowing around conflict.

It's not just "people in power". People have voted for them, in support for such policies. How has that happened?

The politicians (at least in the US it looks like from abroad) are subject to legal corruption aka lobbyists and PACs. That is where they are getting the money not from the voters. They will say whatever they can to get votes then turn around the day after elected to ask their patrons what to vote for.

That is where they are getting the money not from the voters. They will say whatever they can to get votes then turn around the day after elected to ask their patrons what to vote for.

Exactly this. The Clintons went from stony broke to a $250m fortune and no one quite seems sure how. Even the lucrative speakers fees from Goldman’s can’t explain it.

Love him or loathe him, no one can deny that Trump doesn’t need to do that kind of chicanery.

> Trump doesn’t need to do that kind of chicanery

.. because he's funded by laundered Russian money instead? https://newrepublic.com/article/143586/trumps-russian-laundr...

Interesting. I wonder if the full story on this will ever come out. Are these truly the end times? They are for me, I know, but I'm curious.

I think its more like that missing link story in evolution. You know, the one they haven't yet found because it never existed.

Doesn't Trump park half of the Secret Service 100 times a year at his golf resorts at huge costs? Besides the various scandals regarding his Russian contacts.

That Secret Service doesn't get vacation when he's at the White House. And they never slacked off for other presidents. Why does it seem that government expenses are suddenly Trump's fault?

People much prefer a convenient scapegoat from the Others than actually doing the hard work of fixing a problem. And the easiest way to deal with a problem like global warming is to deny it exists, then all the hard tradeoffs of fixing it go away. After all, so long as it's not your house burning down, does it really matter?

Right, and who cares about those snowflakes in California ;)

But damn, what about when we see lots more hurricanes and tornadoes? Maybe some sour grapes?

Well, with all this global warming, it seems to me that the storms that produce tornadoes have been much fewer this year (from my Kansan perspective). The storms have been milder but with greater rainfall.

Sweet grapes for sure.

I wasn't remembering whether any projections have been as specific as Kansas. But a quick search says likely drier, but no clear impact on tornado frequency and intensity (increased atmospheric instability, but decreased wind shear).[0,1] As I understand it, decreased wind shear follows more or less from lower temperature gradient between equatorial and polar regions. Also, more days over 38°C.

0) https://www.kansasforests.org/resources/resources_docs/clima...

1) http://www.ipsr.ku.edu/conferen/kepc07/Feddema_KEPC.pdf

The local news reports otherwise:

https://www.kansas.com/news/weather/article212365444.html

Also a severe weather analysis for Kansas:

https://www.weather.gov/media/ddc/SWAW_2018_Final_UPDATED.pd...

OK, what about President Trump? Does be or his close family have major investments in Lukoil, Yukos, TNK-BP and Surgutneftegaz?

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