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Comment by 4ad | Hacker News Reader

I agree that Tripadvisor is useless for restaurants, but how do you find/book hotels? In general hotels are more expensive when booked directly and not through an aggregator, however, how do you even find them without sites like Tripadvisor?

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The big US chains are always cheaper directly (Marriott/Hilton/IHG/Wyndham/Choice). Use roomkey.com and you can search them all at once. This is because the brands own room key so they don't pay commission so pass on some of the savings to you.

You can also contact a hotel directly and say you're thinking about reserving on so and so website (aka travel agent), and if you reserve directly, they might give you a discount for not having to pay commission.

Good to know, thanks!

I find there is a problem here - hotel chains "sell" some of their room-nights (#) to the third party channels. I think it works like options - but it means I phone the hotel to book a room i can see is available on all these third party sites (including trip advisor) but the hotel cannot sell that room-night to me because the channel has first dibs.

which seems like the hotel is cutting off its own nose

(#) notnsure of the industry term but you get the idea

I think the idea is they get an acturay to estimate how many rooms will be empty at some future date, and sell the room-nights they estimate they couldn't fill anyways to 3rd party channels. This way, they at least recoup some money on empty rooms and why Priceline can offer rooms that are much lower than what booking directly at the hotel costs.

I'd be shocked to find out any hotel uses an actuary. The big ones have sales teams dedicated to booking groups and events, and the smaller ones are usually franchised and managed by a small staff. Most brands use h inventory management software too that auto updates pricing based on prior years' performance and how quickly rooms are renting (or canceling), much like airline ticket prices.

None of the big US brands do that. They each have a best price guarantee that gives you a free night or 50% off or something if you are able to reserve for cheaper than on their official website.

The only thing they might engage in is opaque pricing, which is Priceline and hotwire auction. But that is different since it's not a publicly advertised price, the buyer puts in how much they want to pay and they are stuck with whatever hotel Priceline or hotwire give them.

But reputable hotels don't resort to that since that attracts price sensitive guests that aren't desirable anyway, such as prostitutes and drug dealers.

> But reputable hotels don't resort to that since that attracts price sensitive guests that aren't desirable anyway, such as prostitutes and drug dealers.

Maybe at the 1 or 2 star level, but every other hotel on the planet secretly loves the price discrimination that Priceline and Hotwire offer.

You won't see a $1400/night boutique hotel on there, but a $300/night place will offload for half the price if they're relatively unbooked.

In a lot of cases, the trip booked through the aggregator blocks you from collecting loyalty points from the chain.

Yes, but not roomkey.com since it's just owned by the hotel brands and is not commissionable.

> In general hotels are more expensive when booked directly and not through an aggregator

This is because the aggregators have "most favored nation" clauses in their deals with hotels that forbid hotels for undercutting the aggregator's prices, either on their own site, or on other aggregators.

One of the workarounds is that these clauses don't apply to customers with whom the hotels have a preexisting relationship, which is why you can sometimes get better rates by just signing up for a loyalty program, and searching a hotel's own site while logged in using that program. Another is that amenities aren't necessarily covered in that agreement, so it's possible that you can book the same room for the same price on the hotel's own site, but get later checkout, a free breakfast, cheaper parking, or whatever.

Look for a hotel on maps.google.com. There 90% chance that the hotel is offering the same price as OTAs. Book directly on the hotel site, and use their reward system to get points.

Most of the hotel offers the same rate as OTA. We - Hotel owner can't offer a cheaper rate than OTA.

I've found that some perks, like free cancellation, is only available on the hotels' sites for significantly more than OTAs. Also my CC gives me a 10% on some OTAs.

You will find two different prices on many hotels websites. A discounted prepaid non refundable price, and a flexible price allowing you to cancel up to a certain deadline. Works just like airlines.

I've been traveling for the past few years (40+ countries) and overall I'd say Booking.com works very well and has much better-controlled reviews (be sure to actually read them for details). AirBnB can work well and is my preferred style, although a lot of place have been cracking down on them lately.

Hotels allocate a portion of rooms for sites like agoda, trip advisor, etc. And keep a small portion for direct bookings and walk ins.

The price is almost always cheaper when booked direct or onsite than it is through a 3rd party. That’s cos the cut these people take is upwards of 15-30%. Hotels are literally forced to pay this because if they don’t they don’t get business. Under cutting the websites for going direct allows them to get more profit.

If you ever try book a hotel and it says there’s no rooms avaliable. There’s a good chance you can get a room by going direct.

There are benefits to using the 3rd party which is refunds and cancelations. A lot of hotels don’t offer refunds at all or have conditions on refunds and cancelations. The 3rd party sites handle the refunds themselves tho.

It goes both ways: As you get closer to the booking time, if the rooms that the third parties have allocated aren't mostly booked, they generally start to drop prices in order to fill the inventory (I'm assuming because they have paid for the rooms in advance), whereas I have never seen a hotel do this directly. I have gotten some great deals from booking last-minute through sites like Agoda where the price was significantly lower than it would have been going through the hotel directly.

True, deals exist everywhere if you're willing to look.

> how do you even find them without sites like Tripadvisor?

Stay in hostels. Many of them have private rooms in addition to dorms. Ask the other travelers and hostel staff for recommendations. Book directly and help the hostels save money on the ridiculous commission fees. (It's usually cheaper too.) Don't plan too far in advance. If you travel outside of high season, finding accommodation isn't a problem.

And if you want more/better amenities than a hostel has to offer?

I guess it depends on where you're going and what you're looking for. Many hostels have private rooms that are comparable to hotels, but with more opportunities to meet people. They aren't for everyone though.

http://www.soulkitchenhostel.com/upload/iblock/9e1/9.jpg

https://www.czech-inn.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/08/DSC9192...

Uhh.. Google Maps? Kayak/Travelocity/Expedia/Orbitz/etc/etc?

If I'm staying near a business client or family I ask them. If they don't know I search. Then I see what's available on the booking sites.

Tripadvisor only ever came into the picture if I was visiting a resort area where I didn't know anyone.

> Kayak/Travelocity/Expedia/Orbitz/etc/etc

Sorry, I should have been more specific. To me, all these sites are the same quality as Tripadvisor. I use them all, but I assumed someone who would avoid Tripadvisor would also avoid these sites.

> If I'm staying near a business client or family I ask them.

That's weird. If they already have a real place to stay in some place, why would they know anything about hotels?

> Tripadvisor only ever came into the picture if I was visiting a resort area where I didn't know anyone.

That's pretty much all the travel my family and I do these days.

(Disclaimer: I work in the travel industry.)

What you want to do is search on these sites and then book at the actual business's sites. Even if the fares are different, it's worth it.

Ever had to try to get a flight/hotel/car changed or cancelled through Expedia or a similar site? Whatever savings you get from aggregator sites aren't worth it.

This.

I travel extensively for work - and I direct book as much as I can, even avoiding our travel agent.

Ever had to try to get a flight/hotel/car changed or cancelled through Expedia or a similar site?

booking.com works well in that regard. When a room is cancelable and you cancel via the site it works at no cost and without hassle.

That said I have very mixed feelings about the service. For starters it's a parasitic business model, which is not very transparent or honest. I.e. places that pay higher comissions are more prominently ranked. Which is not obvious to the site user.

What's outright galling is their unfairness towards hotels. "CaptainZapp, prices in Sapporo just wen down!" after booking a hotel in Sapporo a few days in advance.

In addition to the spammy nature of such mails it's an outright lie. In that example the hotel was booked during golden week (first week in May when virtually all of Japan is on holiday) and hotel prices during golden week don't go down, ever!

It's dishonest and totally unfair towards the hotel, which I just booked.

Depends. If the cancellation terms are advertised then its point and click and done and money back in a few days - no questions asked - hotels.com or agoda.com - do it regularly as plans changed. Most of direct hotels you have to email their reservation staff and go through the back and forth reasons to get something cancelled - which is a PITA/risk if cancellation time is 31 minutes away. It is true though if it's a non-cancellable deal you'll have more look if booked direct.

Ever tried to get a directy to match the OTA price, sure it can happen, then you get ++, or some shit forex they choose, or some other bullshit, it's not worth the hassle most of time. In addition when directy will sometimes match without hassle but then what about hotels.com 1 for 10 booking room free, or expedia points (about the same), I want that extra 7-8% (since you dont earn on free night) or whatever it is off too... good luck

With oversell too, very common in asia esp vietnam, they are more likely to move the direct booking to their sister/partner hotel rather than OTA booking, the moment you say that's not acceptable let me call agoda/hotels.com all of sudden some other punter booking is being moved...

I dont stay high end though (2-3 star) and in fairness I do recall hearing direct booking on chains get special benefits like airport pickups or breakfast but never a better rate than OTA since thats the terms of the large OTAs (never advertise a better rate than us)

YMMV

> Kayak/Travelocity/Expedia/Orbitz/etc/etc

These are basically the same. They are all usually one of two companies:

    Booking Holdings
    
    * Booking.com
    * Agoda.com
    * Priceline.com
    * Kayak.com
    
    Expedia Group
    
    * Expedia.com
    * Orbitz.com
    * Travelocity.com
    * Wotif.com
    * Cheaptickets.com
    * Hotels.com (+ Venere, HotelClub)
    * egencia.com
    * Hotwire.com
    * Homeaway.com
    * VRBO.com
    * Remainder of Homeaway Network (~5 more sites)
    
    Independent-ish
    
    * TripAdvisor (former Expedia spinoff)
    * Trivago (former Expedia spinoff)
    * Hipmunk (Conde Nast/Reddit)
    * Ctrip.com (China)
    * Despegar.com (Brazil)
    * MakeMyTrip.com (India)
    * GetARoom.com
    * Google Hotels/Flights

I thought Google hotels/flights used the OTAs, but instead of the OTAs making 13-18% commission, Google leaves them with 3-8% taking 10% themselves (Which no affiliate of the OTAs has ever gotten close to that high of % before)

How about ClearTrip (mostly interesting in India, but they also have some non-Indian hotels)? Who are they owned by?

You can also look to the niche travel blogs and websites. I usually browse Suitcase Magazine’s travel guides for where to eat/stay/see if I’m in a city they have covered. Have not been disappointed so far

I do read niche travel blogs and websites, but they very rarely cover lodging, unless it's some exotic destination with special lodging requirements.

Hostelworld... ok so I'm probably not the demographic you're looking for answers from.

However, Booking.com is by far the world's largest hotel booking website.

The main booking websites themselves, e.g. agoda.com or booking.com, their reviews at least are from people who definitely paid to stay...

Booking.com, Yelp and Tripadvisor are pretty much the same thing to me, and the same low quality. I use them all, but I was curios how would someone do without them.

booking.com used to work fine for me, at least in places I have any idea about.

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