Show HN: Quetree – A Q&A site that is tree-based and hierarchical
quetree.com
quetree.com
2) (For future projects) IMHO It's not advisable to work for "years" on a project without showing it to end users. It's basically a big guess. For best results make sure to start building your audience from the start. Even before you code anything. When you pick an idea to focus on, if you can't build some kind of list of people interested in it just from a landing page with a "Join the waitlist" button, then it's a big sign that the idea might not be the best or that you don't have the capacity to market it.
3) Your key premise is that people care about hierarchical Q&A. There is no true way to know this without asking people. So, again, ask them at the beginning of the "years" before writing a line of code.
4) Your site boils the ocean. It's almost impossible to build up a user base with a site that is not focused around a niche. For example, Stack Overflow's first version was focused on the topic of Tech/Coding Q&A and then they rolled out sub sites. So, your best bet will be to pick a specific niche to focus on and then when you grow and build that topic, then start to move to other topics. That is a tried and proven strategy. (Also, it's only by picking a niche that you know WHO to market to and what marketing strategy to use).
5) Your main marketing message is based around "features" but very few end users care about features they care about how your product will make their life better and how your product will make them a better person. So, your marketing copy should be about "benefits" not "features".
Please read this set of free ebooks for more info on that: https://copyhackers.com/get-it-now
6) Again, well done for shipping! If you ever work on another project I would recommend to pick something you can ship in < 3 months, even better just test it with mockups and a landing page before building anything. The sooner you can get feedback the sooner you know if you're moving in the right direction.
I hope that this feedback is taken in the spirit it is meant, which is just to be helpful.
Good luck with your project!
0. Well-intentioned and you can read it
1. Next to well-intentioned also a simple but effective feedback style (the hamburger model: compliments at the top and bottom and the 'meat' in the middle)
2. Amazing advice (need to flesh this out more)
3. One call to action (copyhackers.com)
I need to reread this a couple of days later.
The earliest of adopters ("enthusiasts" and "innovators") want cool technical features, not benefits.
Yes thank you very much for detailed and helpful comment. You are very right in your well written points. Discovered “The Lean Startup” book only very late in the game lol. But I doubt it would have changed our course much since we are true rebels and any Tried and Proven Strategy is probably not exciting enough ;) ! Thanks again and have a great day!
However, I am curious why you chose two features from which to derive your community software.
Voting: This has been demonstrated by major websites to form "mob opinions", hide individuality, and discourage of unpopular/unoriginal ideas. It is somewhat agreed by Hacker News members that voting should represent quality of comments. But as the size of a website approaches infinity (like Reddit, or Facebook comments with "liking"), this type of culture breaks down, so voting is eventually only used to game the system to promote comments that follow your personal opinion. Differing opinions are a beautiful aspect of humankind, and they are lost when a comment's score is used to make it visible in an unequal manner to other comments. Additionally, voting has little correlation with the effort that goes into a comment. A one-word reply is just as likely to have the same score as a wiki-like hand-typed article and will therefore be artificially promoted to the same level. I believe that if you're running an online news website, sure, absolutely promote "top" content. If it's a community forum, give people an equal voice.
Threading/hierarchy: Human conversation has not and will not change as a result of Internet community software. Hierarchy is unnatural, chronology is natural. If the goal of a community is to generate "answers" to "questions", sometimes this unnatural feature is necessary, but use caution and don't over-hierarchy-ize the organization. Having a "Support" and "Not support" feature like in your video demo adds to the paperwork of posting an answer while not offering much benefit, and it seems a bit O(n^2) to me.
About voting: we really thought really hard about this very hard thing and it is a very hard problem to solve. As you said earlier, we need more experimental communities to really be sure as there may be limited unadulterated evidence as to its effectiveness currently. But we looked at review sites as a guide - they seem to work pretty good. So the argument is: if people can help each other choose products or services they could theoretically also help with choosing ideas. But we know its not as easy as that.
We are starting by catering to the good members, those with only good intentions and not to game the system, and then to worry about how the bad or unsuspecting ones can spoil it for everyone. So given such a group of good members we thought it more beneficial for everyone if each person could make it easier for the next one by making a good choice and voting up. It would be better to use their time and efforts. This is contrasting to where no one is trusted and each person has to start from the beginning and go through all choices thus not benefitting from the time and thoughts spent by those who went through the same thing before.
But you hit at a deeper problem here which is really really hard to answer: how do you make something popular while giving equal importance to every other thing. By giving something precedence, e.g. calling it a better apple, aren’t you by definition making all the other apples worser? And if you call all of them equal then do you do justice to the already ripe ones?
But this problem really kept us up at nights: what will happen to the the poor and specially bright genius who can achieve transcendental insights but is against huge hoards who simply “don’t get it”. Because it is indeed a beautiful aspect of humankind. And that brings us to your last point - namely the supporting, conflicting feature. That one was designed with this very thing in mind. So that the inspired can create a conflicting idea to what has been accepted by the majority - and those who see that there is a conflicting answers to the prevailing accepted one, will hopefully take a closer look then and then spend more time deciding. Those who voted earlier on the prevailing one can change their minds and vote on the new insightful one and slowly the acceptance rating will sway to the new one as will the ranking and medals (it is all implemented already). A big part of Quetree is identify what is the popularly accepted so that we at least know if that needs to change and have a shot at changing it. Quetree is incepted to may be help change what is popular to take us closer to a world where the majority is wiser and more adaptive.
But the supporting and conflicting feature is not meant to quadratically complicate answering - it is served as an extra feature to be used when needed as exampled above but is safely tucked away hidden, and have to be expanded to use.
To address your other good point about hierarchy, that one is truly experimental. The idea is to encourage the path towards hierarchy-izing ideas and may be even over-hierarchy-izing them over over-hierarchy-izing men and kings that us humans have been doing naturally for eons. If we can have a hierarchy of ideas we can constructly move them around (ideal mobilization vs social mobilization ;), they won’t mind nor fight back, unlike the kings or authoritative figures who hold on for dear life.
I like how your brain thinks and I suspect we could’ve hung around and have long philosophical conversations that would be both enjoyable and inspiring. Please keep in touch, thanks and have a great day!
I wonder how the tree concept works when responses are long or short. It seems to me that short would encourage more of a "ping pong" style thread which may be desirable in a tree form instead of a long-form question and reply.
It may be interesting and enjoyable to contribute to a site if there was a short length constraint placed on the reply. For sake of example, let's say it was 140 characters. That would force replies to be concise and give more of an anchor for others to jump off on in the conversation.
It could also make it more of a competition -- who can succinctly reply to the question with the most clarity?
Lastly, I think this could go a long way towards mitigating the curse of knowledge when people communicate. I see this and experience this when I participate in technical forums. It's easy to use jargon or advanced topics that the person may or may not understand. The tree approach gives a simple way for a follow-up question around the topic.
You may even consider tying this into the "five whys" which is a common questioning approach
Ah the "curse of knowledge"! That is such a bulls eye, home run, out of the park, spot on, accurate assessment and perfect read on your part! The curse of knowledge alienates most of the brightest minds from the rest us which is really sad and simple access to structured questioning could help remedy that age old problem.
As far as I remember the "five whys" should end in a feeling. Right now I feel really energized and inspired by your input since I now know that there are those out there like you who I really need and hope will get directly involved in helping this thing grow in the right direction! Do please keep in touch will ya!?
Edit: I see that, as with Quora, users retain copyright to all of their content, and grant perpetual license to the site. Presumably, then, Quora users could migrate their answers to Quetree. But I'm not sure how corresponding questions could be handled.
Similar comment to others, but the visitor is left to wonder what a really excellent use of the site might look like. The thread w/ the largest number of posts[0] doesn't really get very far. The thread in the demo video is a bit hard to understand. If "B" were known by the OP, why would he ask a question as simple as 2+5? If "B" were unknown, wouldn't the question be what is "B" in the relevant domain (whatever domain that is)?
The video seems to show how the site might work, which has me interested. What would have me signing up would be a video showing how the site did work to really move some discussion forward.
Congrats again getting it out in the world. Best wishes as you continue to refine it.
God bless HN and all its great members!
Thanks again and have a great day!
I have been thinking about commenting and debate platforms lately, mainly two aspects
a) How to map comments/arguments in a way that the system by design encourages healthy debate and at the same time remain very intuitive to read (and contribute) for not so regular user For example: I am big fan of http://en.arguman.org/ is great work in mapping argument but might not be easy regular naive internet users
b) How can platform ensure that majority which may be is in favor of certain side (of argument), it doesn't influence rational argument. I am referring to trolls. Example: http://kialo.com/ is a good implementation but arguments can be pulled to one's side by sheer majority.
Good luck!
1) Your example in the video is too contrived.
2) I haven't seen one Q&A thread that actually illustrates your concept ... meaning others aren't getting it either.
Also looks good, but it's very hard to use on mobile.
I’m sure a mobile app would be the perfect solution. Nevertheless, until that materializes, it would be worth investing a day or two to mobile CSS.
It won’t be as good, but for people wanting to use your product now, it will be sufficient, and will be the difference between them using it and not.