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Often these types of suicides aren't given publicity, though this one was too much of a spectacle to ignore.

There was a man who shot himself on the steps of a government(?) building, which is a town over from where I'm originally from, because he was laid off.

A friend showed me the note he left on Facebook before it got deleted. It was very clear that he had been struggling financially for years and the layoff was the final straw.

In a sense, the way he went out was his attempt to bring attention to the problems he faced and believes others were facing, too. While I'm not an advocate of martyrdom, it's kind of sad that the very act he thought would shine light on his suffering was disappeared from the record.

India's freemdom was gained, in part, by self immmolation. Can't be spreading that dissidence because it would lead to 'copy cats'. We don't actually want to fix the issue but rather sweep it under the rug like public mental health.

Wasn't entirely deleted from the record -- his story lives on in a small but nonzero way with this comment of yours, for example.

But yes, sad that it probably didn't get the attention he wanted. Was there no news article explaining his suicide and the causes?

Mental health organisations see reporting on the "cause" of a suicide as unhelpful, even when there is a note. Not that their guidelines are normally adhered to.

At one point, this type of desperate act might have far reaching consequences in the US, it's a matter of how desperate society is as a whole.

The Arab Spring revolutions were started by a suicide brought about by severe injustice and poverty.

In particular drought and subsequent famine, leading to not only poverty (which already existed), but food thst was priced beyond what most could afford in the necessary quantities and qualities. It’s a scary preview of what global climate change has in store for us all as people in marginal situations are suddenly thrust below the metaphorical (and occasionally real) water line. Political and social instability, war, mass migration, all are in the cards and here today.

The suicide was the spark, the tinder was almost literally brought about by a lack of water.

It may not be him but it's the same tragedy as Douglas Schifter's.

Facebook note: https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=1888367364...

"A Driver’s Suicide Reveals the Dark Side of the Gig Economy" : https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/06/nyregion/livery-driver-ta...

I'm almost certain he worked for the county, but I'd have to do some digging.

Sell large screen TVs all day or pack bags on a plane to Hawaii all day — then try to make 13.50$/hr during a bad divorce. Spend 20 hours detailing a bmw m7 and struggle pay for your kids school supplies.

I am more surprised this isn’t a everyday thing. This country has a bad mental health issue. But ok. Make sure the lock is on the plane.

If we take the conversation at face value this individual does not appear to be malicious.

What's unsettling is a cheerful disposition mixed with deep resigned sadness. In a weird way its like he had given up and was broken but yet wanted his last shot at some 'fun', and also a bit of a protest while he is at it.

It's feels both disjointed and coherent. He is another voice in a growing realization of the need to organize society around people and not markets.

Which part of an MBA syllabus deals with suicidally insane employees, again? I'm guessing the bit about liability insurance coverage, maybe? I'm 100% willing to bet it's not a section on how to help and retain employees with mental health issues by dealing with things in a sensitive and understanding fashion though, sadly...

Ethics, supposedly.

Ethics was just to educate on what they are, and how to manipulate other people’s ethics based on their view of the worls.

You can’t use education alone to force someone to not be a sociopath.

OK, so what then? Lets try some MBA-approved brainstorming - nothing is wrong here, ideas are what is important!

- A carefully calculated series of beatings?

- The 'naughty step' for at least five minutes?

- Some sort of heavy-duty drug regimen involving intravenous lithium and/or ketamine?

- Maybe just pay someone to follow them around and prod them with a meter-stick whenever they seem to be getting a bit too excited? They could also hold up a warning sign, or maybe a color coded flag (as decided by either local church committee, or an act of parliament, depending on regional preferences) to warn people nearby (when not engaged employing the meter-sick, of course.)[0]

0. This last one is actually really good, as not only does it fix the sociopaths, it gets us closer to full employment, what with the flag people and all the committees, which will need planning meetings with secretaries and facilitators and note-takers and adminstrators, probably some sort of report will need to be generated after a while to see if the committees are working properly, or if we need more. And then there's the craftsmen who make the meter-sticks and flags as well. Probably the flag/meter-stick people will want a uniform, which adds a whole new layer of possibilities.

In fact, I can't see why everyone doesn't just get up NOW and grab a long stick and go out and prod some fucking sociopaths just to show them who's boss. I think that was the idea, anyway.

I'm not an MBA, but I think it's way too early to attribute motivation to this incident.

Reading the dialog I think it's fair to say that both a) the man was not quite well, and b) the only motivation he actually DID suggest was the stress of low wage. So there's that.

Dentists alsohave a curiously high rate ofdepression despite being very well paid

Literally anyone can snap. The only deterrent is precrime.

He seemed to throw the minimum wage thing in as an afterthought though, not sure that was actually a significant motivation for him.

Yes, definite afterthought. Or perhaps rather a best a guess at an unknown trigger. It seemed he acted on an impulse.

It’s like if my doctor asks me why I think my blood pressure is suddenly extreme. It would be the first time I reflected over it.

Occam's razor says he most likely meant what he said.

If a program errors into a non-recoverable state, and I see something in the stack trace, odds are it had something to do with the issue.

He showed intent to send a message. The fact he was about to end his life just amplifies it. Of all the things one could have focused on, that stuck out? Hardly dismissable.

He knew where his life was going either way. Either because he would have ended it regardless, or because he knew that doing anything drastic enough to hurt the "people" who he saw as the source of his hardship would forfeit his ability to live any semblance of a normal life afterward.

>It seems to me to be a continuation of the pattern of labor 'Going Postal' in the labor hostile environment that has emerged since Reagan.

What evidence do you have that this is a trend?

>I'm sure an MBA will surface and tell me I'm wrong, but I've not encountered a workplace that didn't marginalize their workers and generated a tragedy of the likes that has become a hallmark of the last 50 years.

Isn't that every single employer that hasn't had an employee do this?

What is your response to the European pilot that crashed a passenger plane full of passengers working for an airline in a country that eschews free market capitalism and has strong social safety nets?

The media is full of articles about how to avoid being stressed out, how to manage stress, how to avoid being stressed.

Hardly do they ever even discuss that maybe our current labor/employer power balance and paradigm is fundamentally unhealthy, and only exists to fuel the greed of rampant crony capitalism.

I predict we're going to see many more such incidents of labor "going postal" in the near and medium term. Doubly so if the economy contracts and goes into a recession.

Just look at the situation in NYC with ride-sharing and all the taxi driver suicides.

>Just look at the situation in NYC with ride-sharing and all the taxi driver suicides.

To clarify this, it is not 'taxi driver' suicides, it is suicides by medallion investors.

Most drivers do not own medallions.

http://www.slate.com/articles/business/moneybox/2012/06/taxi...

The medallion system reminds me of feudalism. It blows my mind that taxi drivers would defend this system and not flee to Uber/Lyft/etc.

> It blows my mind that taxi drivers would defend this system and not flee to Uber/Lyft/etc.

For those who defend the system, often enough the medallions are their life saving / insurance when they get old, and almost always financed by loans.

The medallions going worthless at the same time invalidates their retirement plans and STILL leaves them on the hook for the loan.

This is something that's made me think a lot about the health care debate.

Would it not be just that, if we're going to rewrite the economic rules in some areas, we give partial compensation towards those we just screwed over?

Presumably we're changing the rules because of progress (e.g. Uber and Lyft showing on-demand rideshare has a market), which is good for everyone.

But say the human lifespan is 85 years +/-. 25 years for education to post-secondary graduation (e.g. bachelor's degree in US). Probably another 2-5 years of accumulating working capital for your venture.

So there's a set number of "shots" a person gets in their life.

In this instance, what's wrong with saying "We're doing away with the medallion system. Existing medallions will be repurchased by the government at a price proportional to ownership time. Funding will be accomplished by a tax on rideshare companies, that decreases yearly, and ends 5 years from now"?

Otherwise, I see the following sequence of events: (1) people get screwed by technological upheaval -> (2) people become resentful against technological progress -> (3) people vote in politicians / laws that retard technological progress, to the detriment of all

No no no. People who overpaid for medallions gambled and lost. It is not my problem to subsidize.

Why not also subsidize traders who lose on a stock?

If you want a society where people can't lose then you also get a society where no one wins.

I wouldn’t necessarily say you’re wrong, but (at least in the US) we have a long history of taxpayer-subsidized bailouts for the very wealthy who take gambles and lose (e.g., 80s S&L crisis, but there are countless others). It’s an interesting and unfortunate cultural aspect of America that we really, really hate the poor, and seek to hold them accountable for their actions to a degree that we simply don’t do for the well-off.

Because betterofchuck is not with us anymore, I have copied his comment, which I think is important for a myriad of reasons. Predominantly because _this is how america works_, we punish, we do not fix.

----

Poverty is the Lord's way of anointing the sinners for the righteous to cull.

Ephesians 1:11 “In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him who works all things according to the counsel of his will.”

The parts of US culture I am familiar with blur the lines between godliness and wealth pretty far. It is a common belief that the poor are being justly punished for their sins, and that only good things happen to good people.

That is... A horrible reading of that passage. It completely cherry picked and pulled it out of context.

From the Today's English Version,

Paul's Letter to the Ephesians: Chapter 1, verses 1-11

From Paul, who by God's will is an apostle of Christ Jesus-- To God's people in Ephesus, who are faithfulin their life in union with Christ Jesus.

2-) May God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ give you grace and peace.

3-) Let us give thanks to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ! For in our union with Christ he has blessed us by giving us every spiritual blessing in the heavenly world.

4-) Even before the world was made, God had chosen us to be his through our union with Christ, so that we would be holy and without fault before him, because of his love.

5-) God had already decided that through Jesus Christ he would make us his children--this was his pleasure and purpose.

6-) Let us praise God for his glorious grace, for the free gift he gave us in his dear Son!

7-) For by the blood of Christ we are set free, that is, our sins are forgiven. How great is the grace of God,

8-) which he gave to us in such large measure! In all his wisdom and insight

9-) God did what he had purposed, and made known to us the secret plan he had already decided to complete by means of Christ.

10-) This plan,which God will complete when the time is right, is to bring all creation together, everything in heaven and on earth, with Christ as head.

11-) All things are done according to God's plan and decision; and God chose us to be his own people in Union with Christ because of his own purpose based on what he had decided from the very beginning.

Nothing in there screams "poverty is an affliction God amounts on the sinner."

You might get a hint of it around verse 14, but that verse is contingent on the Spirit granting complete freedom to the faithful.

The entire section is a call to praise God.

I don't know who this betterofchuck is, but he seems to have a penchant for cherrypicking verse to fit his argument. His interpretation is outright sickening, and bordering on the blasphemous.

Also, America DOES tend to see destitution as a self-inflicted condition, but the main way in which disgust is usually elicited is by the perception of those destitute who refuse to find a way to better themselves. A central American value is to FIGHT for one's own liberty, not to grovel at the feet of others to have it delivered. This disgust can be elicited just as easily by the wealthy as well.

Show me someone who makes an honest effort at lifting themselves up, and I'll show you someone living up to the American ideal.

It isn't pretty, but in my life, THAT is how America has worked.

Presumably they bought the medallions at current fair market value.

I'd draw a distinction between those who risk their own capital for themselves, and those who risk capital through others (aka investors). It's not an easy distinction to codify, but it seems important.

Society needs people taking risks for themselves. To benefit themselves. And instead of paying after they've hit rock bottom, maybe it would be smarter to do a bit to keep that from happening.

Because change isn't slowing down...

> People who overpaid for medallions gambled and lost.

Earning a livelihood is not gambling. The taxi drivers had entered the market for medallions under specific circumstances and IMHO should be compensated by government if government unilaterally breaks the deal.

In Sydney, Australia, they slapped on a tax to uber, to compensate the taxis. I can't remember the details, possibly time bound.

That's what bankruptcy is for. You get to start over after making crappy debt bets (unless it's a student loan).

There are plenty of non-medallion drivers being squeezed by the recent Uber/Lyft boom.

A poster above me highlights one example of a livery driver whose income fell precipitously after the ride-sharing floodgates opened.

Even Uber/Lyft drivers themselves are being squeezed (which I guess is the whole point). Look at the conditions that many bay area ride-sharing drivers face... driving hours from their homes outside the bay to make barely above minimum wage (if that) driving 60-80-100 hours a week in the city.

Meanwhile all the marketing from these companies paint a rosy picture of "being your own boss" and earning "side-hustle" money, when in reality most of these drivers are, like taxi drivers, poor immigrants killing themselves trying to make a living (and without all the benefits and protections of a "traditional" job).

Nothing I'm saying is extreme or a stretch. If you live in a major urban area you can literally see it and experience it for yourself. I've made this same point across different threads and keep on getting down-voted, but as Sinclair once said "It is difficult to get a man to understand something, when his salary depends upon his not understanding it!"

"You tell me whar a man gits his corn pone, en I'll tell you what his 'pinions is."

Guy is depressed and crashes plane and you’re connecting to labor relations?

That’s a stretch!

It really isn't. I left the reference in my post for a reason.

The fact is our society has a tendency to be unable to have meaningful discourse until someone provides framework for it. Just as the issue of Slavery back in the 1800's was fraught with the same types of rebellious antics and slaveowner hysterics, we're seeing the same patterns reserve at a time where inequality in the country has begun to reach a new perceived maxima.

You're also seeing the same sort of outpouring of sympathy that many workplace shooters saw after they snapped, even from some people they shot.

I'm not bringing the topic up lightly. I DON'T make a habit of bringing up the obvious or trying to find a way to turn things political. I've seen slices of life recently from the 1%, to teachers, to call center workers, to someone working the floor at a Tractor Supply, to an AM in a grocery store, to farmers, to the retired elderly for who the system worked.

Every last one realizes that something is going amiss right now after a bit of time spent talking. Every last one feels helpless to change anything about it. In this type of environment it is frequently the mentally ill who are best able to perceive the flaws inherent in the System, and the most likely to ACT because of them.

The 'crazies' in short, aren't the problem. The fact we as a society have normalized something so 'off' that even the 'crazies' are starting to get pushed over the edge by it is what we should be paying attention to.

As I said, I was quite confident my post would prove controversial, but I felt it needed to be said, as it has been left unsaid for too long.

Do you own an iPhone? Do you know how much the people who build them make? Do you know that these workers also commit suicide on the job?

Well above the median income in their country.

like plane mechanics

Seems to be a misreport, the guy wasn’t a mechanic he was a baggage handler.

Pointless attempt to tie a political view to a tragedy, please don't do this. There have been massacres, bombings, dramatic suicides, etc long before the Reagan administration and none of them have claimed "If I would have only had 20% more compensation I wouldn't have violently murdered these 20 people."

P.S. It's godspeed, not "God speed".

I'd suggest looking at more data before we cast politics aside - I would like to compare the amount of mental health issues that manifest themselves like this one ranging up to mass violence with other countries. My hypothesis is countries with a larger middle class and robust social care (such as access to affordable health care) have less of these events.

No one says that outright but poverty and violent extremism are pretty closely linked. Its not the only factor ofc, and youll always have outliers, but comfortable people with things worth losing are less likely to do something to endanger that.

Income inequality and violent crime are linked. Absolute poverty is tolerable to the psyche so long as everyone is in the same boat.

This was a suicide, not violent extremism.

Why pointless? It seemed quite pointful to me. In fact, I would go so far as to say that salawat's point, far from being pointless, is actually correct, and we ignore it at our peril.

It's less politics, and more to do with empathy for the common man. Mental illness is at an all-time high, wages are low, poverty is incredibly visible, and based off of postings on Reddit, Facebook, etc. there's a general attitude of being despondent due to the current economic and political climate. Something has to change, and it can only really start at the top - with government taking care of its citizens rather than constantly destroying the few social safety nets left.

based off of postings on Reddit, Facebook, etc. there's a general attitude of being despondent due to the current economic and political climate. Something has to change

Maybe spend less time on Reddit, Facebook, etc... Things probably aren't as bad as they look through the lens of social media.

The lens doesn’t change stagnant wages, health care and housing being out of reach, and income inequality.

Things are terrible, and putting your head in the sand does nothing but exacerbate the situation.

Employment is low, home ownership is increasing, healthcare is too expensive but still more accessible than it ever has been. Things can be better, but I'd say, gently, that you lack perspective. You are mirroring a story that you see online on TV and social media that is created to make you think things are terrible so you'll watch more tv and spend more time on social media. Stagnant wages aren't terrible, 25% unemployment was terrible. Stagflation was terrible. You think housing is tough now, try a home loan at 16% interest rate like in 1981/2. You think things are politically divisive now? Look at the violence and political assassinations in the 1960's. Look at the crime rate which has been declining for a two decades.

Unemployment is low, but the jobs at the lower end are still jobs that don’t pay a living wage. Credit card, auto loan, and student debt defaults are rapidly rising. Home prices have accelerated away from incomes that can support them.

While I appreciate your view on my perspective, it comes from careful analysis of macroeconomic data, as well as discussing the issues with citizens who would eventually be my constituents when I run in the next election cycle.

That is a lens. Wages are increasing, lots of people do have healthcare, and homeownership is increasing.

Does it happen more in America than in European countries with more socialist policies?

Wasn't the last suicide by plane in Germany or Switzerland with a plane full of passengers?