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Comment by cassandrajam | Hacker News Reader

Hi, French here but I don't know much about the Paris scene, more the Lyon scene but they're probably close.

Regarding the French language: you don't need to be good at it. Just learn enough of it so you can show the locals you tried, and soon they'll be ok speaking to you in English. All coding languages are English-based so everybody knows enough to work efficiently with non French-speaking people.

Like the other users said, Station F is the flagship startup trend in Paris but there are many startups that don't go there and just operate in Paris itself, it's up to you to find them using meetups (there are plenty) to network.

Coding language wise, it's difficult to say but from my experience a lot of people are into Node.js and Ruby.

Hope this can help, enjoy your time there

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French here too; regarding language, it's rather annoying when there's one only person who don't speak French at work, forcing everyone else to switch. But if the co-workers are young enough, there shouldn't have too much difficulty for them to speak English. And regarding code, all the variable + comment are usually in English.

Yes and it is kinda annoying if there's only one country which doesn't want to adopt English, forcing everyone to learn their language ;-)

So it is just a matter of perspective. I wonder how the chinese see that picture.

> only one country which doesn't want to adopt English

What? You've never been to Europe have you? Try travelling here and speaking English in any country other than the obvious champions like Norway / Sweden / Danemark and you'll come to the crazy realization that people like speaking their own language.

I've never had that experience traveling. Just knowing a few basic greetings and pleasantries is enough, smile a little bit and most people are forgiving

Exactly! Weird how people aren't asshats when you show them you're trying.

In fact, I am German. I had both English and French as foreign languages in school. I know that Germans aren't that good at English either but the French people are by far the most resistant I have met when it comes to learning English. Yes, they are also the most forgiving when it comes to trying to understand someone who is trying to speak their language but that does not change the first issue.

But hey, on the positive side of things I have a feeling that the younger generations depend less on their own language and have better English skills.

Since English is only third most spoken language, why would they adopt English?

I think the head count is not as imporant as the number of affected countries and the attractivesness of doing business with the people in those countries. Another factor might be the difficulty of learning the language, as English is considered one of the easier lagnuages.

Because there's a ton of business to be had with English speakers: buying, selling stuff, tourism. Also many of the English speaking countries are very cool to visit or even move to.

There's not that many Spanish, Chinese or even French speaking countries you'd want to move to, as someone from a developed country.

If you're going to immigrate, learn the local language and do your best to adopt the local accent. It's tough, but it's the best investment you'll make in your new home.

Yes, when you are coming to a foreign country you should adapt to that country and not vice versa, the but that wasn't the point of my critique.

I critizied that the people in France are known for their hostility against English. So I just wish they would embrace the international nature of English a bit more.

I'm not saying you're wrong because honestly, I don't know. I haven't lived enough places to be able to judge anyone on how welcoming they are to foreign language speakers.

One thing I'll tell you is that in my experience, every culture has its own way of expressing annoyance. When those ways clash, it can make people seem way more hostile than they mean.

As an example, if I start a sentence with "Sorry, but..." I'm pretty annoyed, but in some parts of the world, that would be endearing. In other parts, it would be so polite as to be annoying.

One thing I'll tell you is that my country isn't particularly patient with people who don't try to learn English, or with people whose English is poor. We have a reputation for being very polite and welcoming, but I think that's more a function of people just not picking up on cues that we're annoyed.

And Americans are known for their hostility against all other languages. Yet they speak English. Do you know the joke:

“What do you call someone who speaks 3 languages? Trilingual

What do you call someone who speaks 2 languages? Bilingual

What do you call someone who’s speaks one language? American”

I’d be willing to bet that a greater percentage of French population have basic communication skills in a foreign language than Americans.

FYI until relatively recently, French was the Lingua Franca of the world, not English. In fact that was one reason I wanted to learn French, to help me in travels around the world. Yes English is more prevalent now, yet I’ve found French to be more helpful than English in some non native French speaking countries.

Or, on the other hand, English-speaking people who never do any effort to learn any other language, assuming that English will be spoken everywhere. :o

Citizen of the ⅐ part of the land. Most of the IT workers here have an A2 or lower level of English.

I'm Canadian (from the western part of the country) who grew up speaking pretty decent French, but lost everything but some traces of my accent when my Grandma passed away. I consider losing that language one of the great failures of my life.

I understand that that would be annoying. In your shoes, I'd be annoyed if they didn't even try to learn French.

I find that when I meet French speakers and want to practice, their first instinct is to switch to English. That's very kind, but it doesn't help me. If I was in a workplace in France, I would want people to speak French first, but slow down a little and tell me when I mess something up.

How would that go over in a workplace? Or is it the kind of situation where you speak English because it's the least annoying choice? :)

It depends, in a meeting or for work-related discussion, English would be talked unless everyone is proeficient in French. But in casual conversation, I think you could easily ask people to switch to French.

Thank you! I appreciate you taking the time to answer that. Next time I have a chance to speak French, I'll try that out.

In my personal experience, whichever language you use when you first meet someone will be the language you will always use together. If you want to speak French, just struggle the first few times you talk to a new friend/colleague/contact. Then nearly all future engagements they will speak French with you.

FYI I’m native English speaker who speaks French and German. I’ve lived in both countries and my current work brings me to both countries still. I’ve found this experience try for both German and French speaking friends/colleagues.

Expat here, moved to Paris with my SO a few years ago, both working in software development.

It's true that everyone here must know some English, but the average level is bad to atrocious (even among people in their early 20s), and like others in this thread have said, many people hate being forced to switch to English for a colleague who can't be bothered to learn French. You may get by professionally (assuming a company is even willing to hire you if they know all your colleagues will hate you; think "culture fit" for a Silicon Valley way of putting this), but you will not be treated in a welcoming way and will de facto be excluded from conversations at lunch, in breaks, and at social events. I've seen this happen to expat colleagues. All this gets much better if you show that you are putting in the effort and learning, even if your current level is poor.

Really, if you settle anywhere, learn the language. Especially in France. French is neither super easy nor particularly beautiful IMHO, but it's not rocket science either. Not putting in the effort will harm you both professionally and socially.

I know this is unrelated, but I thought you might be interested. It's an Arabic programming language, by Ramsey Nasser: http://nas.sr/%D9%82%D9%84%D8%A8/

Indeed it's pretty cool. Thanks :)

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