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Comment by e12e | Hacker News Reader

> Most people invoking a moral imperative to not make hackintoshes are coming from the angle that it’s stealing from Apple.

I don't feel a moral obligation not to steal from Apple. I'm not sure I could steal (and use) an amount from them that would impact them at all. I mean even if I stole a classroom full of MacBook pro's in order to give free programming classes - it's not like it would affect Apple in any meaningful way.

But I don't quite get why anyone would go out of their way to get hw they'll never be able to run legally licensed os on. For fun and learning, sure. Turn your linux/bsd box into a hackintosh by dual booting. But you can never do any work on it without risk. So what's the point?

Sure you can "buy" a copy of os x - but you only get install media and a license to run on Apple hw.

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What does “never be able to run a legally licensed os” mean in this context? I am an iOS engineer and avid photographer: I work on a Hackintosh, I develop my photos on my Hackintosh. I’ve had 0 problems with this setup and it cost me 1/10th as much as a similarly specced Mac. And my “similar” I’m being generous to the Mac because my machine is faster

I’m guessing they’re referring to the fact that Apple’s EULA prohibits—or prohibited at one time, I believe it still does—running macOS on anything other than Apple hardware. Hence, a Hackintosh violates the EULA.

Not saying it’s bad or not. I despise EULAs. I think that’s what the parent means, though.

I don't think he's at all concerned about the license. He's just saying most people won't and shouldn't do "real work" on a machine that could break at any point with no possibility for support.

That too.

https://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/macOS1013.pdf

> 2. Permitted License Uses and Restrictions. A. Preinstalled and Single-Copy Apple Software License. Subject to the terms and conditions of this License, unless you obtained the Apple Software from the Mac App Store, through an automatic download or under a volume license, maintenance or other written agreement from Apple, you are granted a limited, non-exclusive license to install, use and run one (1) copy of the Apple Software on a single Apple-branded computer at any one time. For example, these single-copy license terms apply to you if you obtained the Apple Software preinstalled on Apple-branded hardware.

(...)

> J. Other Use Restrictions. The grants set forth in this License do not permit you to, and you agree not to, install, use or run the Apple Software on any non-Apple-branded computer, or to enable others to do so.

(...)

If you're not going to abide by the license, you're essentially running "pirated" software.

So what? You've paid for the OS you can run it wherever you want.

Depends on your jurisdiction's view of the legality of apple's terms of use

Not seriously, unless you believe Apple is going to start working with cops to kick in doors and inspect homess for non-Apple branded hardware for unsanctioned OS installs.

Even if a judge agreed with Apple's EULA (unlikely, and unlikely to be tested), that's not really enforceable in any practical sense unless you're selling computers with MacOS preinstalled. Then it's a matter of commercial licensing and distribution which they do have an interest in protecting.

So you're saying it's fine to break the law of you don't get found out?

Most people think its ok to break the law if you won't get found out AND they don't think breaking the law presents any moral issue.

Ever noticed how people tend to drive at a speed that seems safe given conditions? Respect for ethics is a virtue respect for the law for its own sake is a disease.

I suppose you just get a license for one cpu core for your database servers and run them on 32-corevservers too?

The license is strange - but it is what Apple is selling.

And AFAIK the latest release is a "free" (gratis) download anyway - so you can't even claim you've paid for it.

I mean sure, you can ignore the license. Maybe Apple won't sue, but they might revoke your developer access, I loud account etc.

[ed: anyway, the thread started with a claim about "moral" obligation, I'm just pointing out that Apple is refusing to give or sell a valid license, so you're in breach of the license. I don't see how it's legally very different from an illegal copy of Microsoft Windows).]

> But you can never do any work on it without risk.

What risk is that?

Same as running any other not legally licensed software - a civil suit. And/or "sanctions" if the company who's license your violating has the power to, say, disable a cloud account, developer license etc.

This probably wouldn't bode well for them. It would provide negative pr and the majority of hackintosh users would be liable to move off the platform.

These users would be paying them the say zero dollars right now either way but they would no longer be potential future customers.

What would they gain by this?

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